Brandon Marshall for a #1?

[fringe]

Besides Eli (who cost more than a #1, is there anyone on this list that's better than brandon marshall?

 

 

2000Ron DayneRBWisconsin2001Will AllenCBSyracuse2002Jeremy ShockeyTEMiami2003William JosephDTMiami2004Phillip Rivers

(traded to San Diego on draft day for ELI MANNING, QB, Mississippi -in a deal that also involved draft picks.)QBNC State2005Corey Webster (2nd Round)CBLSU2006Mathias KiwanukaDEBoston College2007Aaron RossCBTexas2008Kenny PhillipsSMiami2009Hakeem Nicks

[Allstarjim]

defense won't be fixed this year, blue in ca- we still need to score a lot. and stats are misleading-

first of all we got in by the skin of our teeth in 2007 so don't point to that as a benchmark formula.

 

secondly, how many of those TD's last year were against good teams in meaningful games?

 

 

A lot. We put a lot of points up against Philly, Dallas (twice), the Saints, and the Falcons. Our offense was good enough to win in a number of games we lost, if we had a good defense. By my count, we could've won an additional 5 games had our defense been worth a damn.

 

That's not to say our offense was outstanding. But after the year Eli had, you can't say that the offense was a problem. If you are going to find fault there, it is with the running game. Instead of Marshall, if you're going to trade a 2nd rounder, go get a stud RB. Better yet, address it in the draft.

 

If you thought the offense was not as good as it could be, then fix the defense. A good defense will give Eli even more opportunities to score. This team needs a linebacker in the worst way.

[Allstarjim]

Besides Eli (who cost more than a #1, is there anyone on this list that's better than brandon marshall?

 

 

Based on phsyical talent alone, probably not, but a case could be made for Webster and Phillips. But that's not the point. You don't bring in just a raw, physical talent. Brandon Marshall brings a lot more baggage. You have to ask yourself is he worth it? He would be if this was last year. But since we saw the skills of Steve Smith and Hakeem Nicks come to fruition in 2009, I have to say that not only is he not worth it, he's also not a good fit on the roster.

[Allstarjim]

Gotta go, enjoyed the conversation, gents.

[fringe]

Besides Eli (who cost more than a #1, is there anyone on this list that's better than brandon marshall?

 

 

Based on phsyical talent alone, probably not, but a case could be made for Webster and Phillips. But that's not the point. You don't bring in just a raw, physical talent. Brandon Marshall brings a lot more baggage. You have to ask yourself is he worth it? He would be if this was last year. But since we saw the skills of Steve Smith and Hakeem Nicks come to fruition in 2009, I have to say that not only is he not worth it, he's also not a good fit on the roster.

 

no idea what that means. i know this-that the offense was built on the big play- and if it's not BM, someone needs to do it. the defense won't be strong enough in 1 year to stop the likes of Minn, Dallas, Phi, NO.

C'mon Jerr

 

 

[BlueInCanada]

ame='Allstarjim' date='08 March 2010 - 07:07 PM' timestamp='1268104046' post='535549']

 

 

no idea what that means. i know this-that the offense was built on the big play- and if it's not BM, someone needs to do it. the defense won't be strong enough in 1 year to stop the likes of Minn, Dallas, Phi, NO.

C'mon Jerr

 

So why rush it then?

 

So what happens if we use the 1st on Marshall and he comes in and instead of putting up 24 points a game we put up 31 but the defense is still giving up 30+? Instead of addressing a pressing need a LB and the D-line we use it on a WR who could be a head case if we dont win. You just said it yourself " the defense won't be strong enough in 1 year to stop the likes of Minn, Dallas, Phi, NO" so if thats the case why waste a great chance this year on getting a guy like McClain who can hold down the LB spot for the next 10+ years and be something special then trade for a WR who is only going to be playing the next 4-5 years that MIGHT help us win maybe a game or two.

 

You cant just hope to outscore your opponents every game, heck even the Saints had to hold the Cardinals and Colts to under 20 points to get their first SB.

[Balloonknot]

How is this even a debate. Eli and the Offense were quite good this Season. They weren't the high flying colts or the Saints but they did a very good job of moving the ball and putting points on the board.

 

The problem was that as soon as the O handed the ball to the other team it was painful to watch. 0 pressure and horrible Safty play and Wide open TE's.

 

Our problem was Defense.

 

We addressed Safety Already, Hopefully we nab a Stud LB in round #1 and a Stud DT in Round#2

Osi Kiwi and Tuck should be good enough off the edge. I truly think Osi problem this year was that it generally takes 2 years to come back from his type of injury.

Couple that with our DT's being beatup almost from the get go and then Tuck get cheap shotted Tripped by fucko adams on the cowboys and you has a receipe for Disaster on the DL

[JMFP]

I want a linebacker in round #1.....anything else with that pick would disappoint me.

[Nas]

Marshall is a special talent. No doubt there. However, bringing him in would make waves in the locker room, I think. There is no way you can keep Marshall, Nicks, and Smith all happy. One would be moved to the slot... and it would probably be Nicks. But it should be Smith, based on skillset. Smith would undoubtedly object after the season he had. But Nicks' talent demands he play on the outside, every down. And all three would need to catch a lot of balls to stay happy. Marshall is too combustible to be a fit unless someone else goes. And I would not want to bring in his personality to the lockerroom and lose a player that has been a good soldier like Nicks or Smith. It could be argued that all three could co-exist, but I think that would be a ticking time bomb.

 

Don't forget Barden, who is the player the Giants hope becomes a Brandon Marshall type.

 

The thought of him in Giants blue does make me drool... but logistically I don't think it's worth it.

 

Nicks has the skillset to allow us to forget Plaxico. Let him develop, and focus on defense.

 

But even if I was in favor of this, I would not part with a 1st rounder. Baltimore just got Boldin for a 3 and 4. He is way too much of a problem child to spend the #15 pick on him.

 

It's a nice dream, but one better dreamt than actually becoming a reality.

 

Thanks Jim.

[Nas]

I want a linebacker in round #1.....anything else with that pick would disappoint me.

 

Done!!!

 

 

 

sorry when is the draft?

[BIGBLUE01]

If you havent noticed this boards activity goes down with the Giants season is over and alot of posters only visit every so often, myself included. Does that make me a fair weather fan? No. But when there is nothing to talk about Giant's related there is not much happening on here, with free agency and the draft coming up there is reason to be active on here again outside of the occasional browsing.

 

Come on Dog, I know you and BB01 hound each other non-stop but even I dont question his fan hood. Hell I'm a Canadian with no ties to the New York area yet I've been a fan of the Giants since the 90s and I'll never root for another NFL team as I do the Giants.

 

Right on BIC, and thats right, were true Blue till the end. I just think the dog is runnin out of insults. lol

[Sephiroth]

Marshall is a head case who's rap sheet is worse than T.O's or Randy Moss' at this point in their respective careers.

 

He would be a bad fit for the Giants.

[Virginia Giant]

A lot. We put a lot of points up against Philly, Dallas (twice), the Saints, and the Falcons. Our offense was good enough to win in a number of games we lost, if we had a good defense. By my count, we could've won an additional 5 games had our defense been worth a damn.

 

That's not to say our offense was outstanding. But after the year Eli had, you can't say that the offense was a problem. If you are going to find fault there, it is with the running game. Instead of Marshall, if you're going to trade a 2nd rounder, go get a stud RB. Better yet, address it in the draft.

 

If you thought the offense was not as good as it could be, then fix the defense. A good defense will give Eli even more opportunities to score. This team needs a linebacker in the worst way.

N.O.? The game where we were down by 30 before all the lights in the stadium kicked on? I agree with both sides of this argument. Our defense needs help, but in no way can you say our offense is set. We have a talented group of possdession receivers. Would love to see a LB drafted in the first, but if we got a chance to get a talent like Marshall's, we have to go for it. You know you're special when teams are keying on you and you still catch 20 passes.

 

My reservations are the same as the rest though, not sure even a talented headcase is a welcome addition to the locker room.

[CrazedDogs]

oh, i thought we were talking about winning. no defensive coordinator loses sleep worrying about how to stop any of the giants skill players. it's a credit to eli that he's done so much with so little. he deserves better. he deserves a deep threat.

easy peesey let's do this reesey

 

We are. IMO, Nicks will be better than Marshall. Maybe not in week 1, 2010... but I think he'll get there sooner than later.

 

And I know Marshall is a rare physical talent...but shit, if thats all we need, I think Matt Jones is still available. I simply don't believe in Marshall. I think he'll flake out or flame out.

[fringe]

So why rush it then?

 

 

because our greatest asset right now is Elisha Nelson Manning. we have to put the people around him that maximize his talent. It's like having Barry Bonds and not surrounding him with hitters who can get on base in front of him.

[BlueInCanada]

because our greatest asset right now is Elijah Nelson Manning. we have to put the people around him that maximize his talent. It's like having Barry Bonds and not surrounding him with hitters who can get on base in front of him.

 

The problem is though Eli is surrounded by talent and he has it in his WRs and O-line, the RBs are skeptical at this point. Eli can put up big numbers with the group we have so honestly whats the problem? I mean sure if we were going out there and only putting up 10 points a game I can see the reasoning for you to think that Eli needs help. Hell we were putting up 25 points a game which was 8th in the league and the majority of that was Eli carrying us because our running game was pathetic. What over the course of the season showed you Eli needed help in the passing game when he statistically put up his best year passing last season? If anything we should be looking for a quality RB to trade with the 1st round pick.

 

The fact remains that last season our passing game was the only thing about the Giants that was a positive and the only thing that let us finish the season 8-8. Why trade away an excellent 1st round 15th pick selection for a WR who obviously is more about himself then a team. We could use the pick to bolster our already pathetic LB core and let us finally have a leader on the D who people go "Oh shit we have to face this guy"

 

But alright lets trade away a chance to get a stud LB who will finally anchor down a problem area that Giants have had for the last six seasons(and cost us a couple runs into the playoffs) for a WR who might help improve our already good young passing game that doesn't need the help. So when Eli is throwing 300 yards a game and 3 TD's we can sit back and watch our defense get walked over as the other team throws up an easy 40 on the scoreboard.

[fringe]

The problem is though Eli is surrounded by talent and he has it in his WRs and O-line, the RBs are skeptical at this point. .

 

If you mean the RB's are skeptical about the WR's, I don't blame them Look, I've told you. A big WR stretches the field and opens up all other facets of the game. The RB's were less effective because of the numbers on defense. ditto the OL-

i don't think we have anyone (yet) capable of drawing double coverage. And I think the NFL is going thru a phase where a great offense and a serviceable defense wins.

[Virginia Giant]

Saying the Giants scored such and such points a game is all well and good, but look at the schedule and see who those points were against. We beat up on teams like Oakland, Tampa and Washington. In other games they scored a few points playing catch-up. Meanwhile, while in control of our own destiny the great offense managed a collective 18 points in the seasons final two games.

 

I am by no means saying our defense doesn't need fixed, we absolutely need a better answer than Goff at MLB, we need to figure out what the deal is going to be with the DT's. But to throw numbers around and pretend our offense is some kind of juggernaut is rediculous. Yes they did well against lkousy teams and playing catch up, but as Blu was mentioning there is not one player on the offense in general (aside from Eli) and in the wr corps in particular, that strikes fear into opposing D's. Steve Smith is a steady eddy, Hicks is a nice young receiver, but not one of them are gonna have defenses game planning around them.

 

IMO, if you can add a player with a proven track record the likes of Marshall's, it's foolish not to. Provided the price is reasonable, and if the price is a 1st, it's m,ore than reasonable.

[Mr. P]

Saying the Giants scored such and such points a game is all well and good, but look at the schedule and see who those points were against. We beat up on teams like Oakland, Tampa and Washington. In other games they scored a few points playing catch-up. Meanwhile, while in control of our own destiny the great offense managed a collective 18 points in the seasons final two games.

 

I am by no means saying our defense doesn't need fixed, we absolutely need a better answer than Goff at MLB, we need to figure out what the deal is going to be with the DT's. But to throw numbers around and pretend our offense is some kind of juggernaut is rediculous. Yes they did well against lkousy teams and playing catch up, but as Blu was mentioning there is not one player on the offense in general (aside from Eli) and in the wr corps in particular, that strikes fear into opposing D's. Steve Smith is a steady eddy, Hicks is a nice young receiver, but not one of them are gonna have defenses game planning around them.

 

IMO, if you can add a player with a proven track record the likes of Marshall's, it's foolish not to. Provided the price is reasonable, and if the price is a 1st, it's m,ore than reasonable.

 

 

but when we have the need at MLB that we currently have i think its foolish to spend the 1st on a position that was one of our strongest positions last year.

[Treehugger]

Has Brandon cured his dropsies yet?

[fringe]

Has Brandon cured his dropsies yet?

 

i think you're talking about Braylon.

[Balloonknot]

Woah guys be realistic. #1 Of Defense is our #1 priority or at least it should be. #2 Keep in mind Hicks was a rookie last year and manningham improved but still had some mental mistakes.

 

I expect them both to improve for this coming season. Manningham proved he could stretch a field if he could just bring in those damn balls. Hicks showed some good speed too getting down field.

Or WR core is young and improving. IF you had asked anyone of use last year right after the draft if we would get the type of production we got from this group this past year the answer would have been NO!

 

So why is eveyone so down about our current group. Yeah they could have done things better but there is always room for improvement. But the Huge glaring hole on our team in in our LB core. That is what needs to be addressed with our #1 pick. If that Mcclain dude is not there look at DT, O-line or RB

[Treehugger]

i think you're talking about Braylon.

You're right. I just mashing all sorts of people together in my head these days.

 

Anyway, he's got all that money from his Virgin empire, why would he want to start a football career at his age?

[fringe]

You're right. I just mashing all sorts of people together in my head these days.

 

Anyway, he's got all that money from his Virgin empire, why would he want to start a football career at his age?

 

lol, you need to defragment and re-sort your data, tree. btw, i flew on that airline, it was brilliant!

[Mr. P]

Woah guys be realistic. #1 Of Defense is our #1 priority or at least it should be. #2 Keep in mind Hicks was a rookie last year and manningham improved but still had some mental mistakes.

 

I expect them both to improve for this coming season. Manningham proved he could stretch a field if he could just bring in those damn balls. Hicks showed some good speed too getting down field.

Or WR core is young and improving. IF you had asked anyone of use last year right after the draft if we would get the type of production we got from this group this past year the answer would have been NO!

 

So why is eveyone so down about our current group. Yeah they could have done things better but there is always room for improvement. But the Huge glaring hole on our team in in our LB core. That is what needs to be addressed with our #1 pick. If that Mcclain dude is not there look at DT, O-line or RB

 

 

 

woooo! soul patrol!