Off-season priorities, FA and draft

[mastershake]

Purely position based priorities. This may change of course if we move to a 4-3.

Top Priorities

LT (I know easier said than done)

C (Halapio could miss next season, plus stinks anyway)

CB (Need a starting caliber CB)

LB and Edge (Retain Golden if the price is reasonable, in my view draft Isaiah Simmons, and replace Ogletree if possible. I'm okay with keeping Ogletree if we can't replace him or if we put more pieces around him.)

RT

DE (I'm torn on retaining Leonard Williams if the price is right or just cutting our losses. Either way, a top priority in my view)

 

Medium Priorities

TE (Given Engram is always hurt)

 

Lower Priorities/Depth

S (assuming Love at FS and Peppers at SS as starters next year)

WR (assuming Slayton is for real)

G

RB

DT

 

 

 

[BronxRik]

So, the whole team then?

[Sephiroth]

In order, I'd say:

1. LT - doesn't matter how awesome your sophomore QB is if he's on his back fifteen times a week. 

2. EDGE - there is literally no pass rusher on this team. 

3. MLB - for fuck's sake, before I die, can we please get an NFL caliber middle linebacker. 

4. C - Halapio and whoever the other guy is both suck. 

[mastershake]

8 hours ago, BronxRik said:

So, the whole team then?

The lower priorities are areas we don't have to address or don't need to spend big/draft high on. 

The top 5 priorities are the key areas to invest in.

[Nas]

8 hours ago, Sephiroth said:

In order, I'd say:

1. LT - doesn't matter how awesome your sophomore QB is if he's on his back fifteen times a week. 

2. EDGE - there is literally no pass rusher on this team. 

3. MLB - for fuck's sake, before I die, can we please get an NFL caliber middle linebacker. 

4. C - Halapio and whoever the other guy is both suck. 

 

So, the whole team then?

[mastershake]

54 minutes ago, Prince_Nas said:

 

So, the whole team then?

He named four position priorities and I named five. We're not that far away from being competitive if we hit on 4/5 players in those areas, plus assuming guys like Jones, Baker, Beal, Hernandez, Slayton, Love, and Connelly all make progress.

Not saying we're a super bowl team with that but definitely on the right track. For instance, adding two solid starters on the O line and you have a much more capable offense vs last year.

[CrazedDogs]

I think the main offseason priority is a new coaching staff! 

I'm going through roster now thinking about what it would take to at least have a dice roll on fixes up and down the roster. With no expectation that all of this would actually work.... this team is still so damned far away. Can't use high draft picks everywhere, can't sign high priced free agents everywhere.... to fix it all, a few somebodies will have to come out of nowhere.

On offense, I think the biggest hole is at center. I think we'll miss out on the hot shot center from Wisconsin in the draft, I'm not even going to try to spell his name, he's probably going to be a late 1st rounder, but that's one of those positions that is so mental, I'd like to see them late round cluster draft and/or go crazy with UDFAs at the position. Thats arguably the toughest position to scout. Cast a wide net and there's a decent chance to find someone who is an upgrade on another UDFA, Halapio.

OT is a more obvious problem.... I think I'm giving Solder one more year, and possibly asking him to move to RT if there are other options at LT. He isn't a G. Some tackles can move inside, but not him.... he's much too tall and lean to move inside. And as bad as he's been, and as much money as he makes, what are the odds we can find someone who's an improvement while filling all the other needs? Not good in my estimation. 

And I'm saying 'if there are other options at LT', as if that's some easy thing.... I fairly well expect our first pick to be an OT. And I hope - especially if we've brought in a college coach - that we've traded back for additional picks. (Because there is no college scout that knows college players better than a good college head coach.) We'll have a couple potentially good LTs available to the mid first round. Unfortunately not even the Dolphins have enough high 1st round picks for us to trade back and get two blue chip (or close) picks out of the deal. We'll have the opportunity to be confident we've 'solved' one position in the 2020 draft.... everybody thereafter is a crap shoot. 

So now if it falls that way, we're looking better on the OL.... but still have major holes at edge rusher and interior LB. I don't have confidence in the DBs at all, but with so many young players back there it's dice roll time on those guys. There may be good opportunities for a replacement for Ogletree with a red chip pick (mid 1st or 2nd round). 

I expect a pass rusher to be the big free agent priority. There are a couple good ones available. Olivier Vernon part 2, here we go? Hope not. 

If solutions shake out from those moves, that could be a decent turn around. Still have weaknesses at a lot of places. Need quality talent at wide out. Need a couple real TEs. Need those young DBs to pan out. Need Will Hernandez to learn to pick up a stunt. 

Sounds like another aspire to 8-8 kind of season even if everything falls right. 

 

[UK-Giantsfan]

Solder is staying for sure ......... but we need a new Centre and some more depth in the O line and probably RT too ( due to inevitable injuries ) ....both in FA and the Draft.

We need a pass rusher ......FFS in FA

I'm really hoping that Conelly is our MLB of the future ( that ACL just sucks massively ) 

Our run D is fine , our WR will have to do and i think we are stuck with our young defensive backs .

so it is O line and pass rushers for me

[Iceman_NYG]

Coaching Staff - Mainly capable coordinators

Pass Rush - towards the end the OL was playing quite well - albeit the return of Barkley certainly helped. But they did show some improvement - because of that I feel pass rush is a far more pressing need.

OL - Whoever the best available fucks are available bring them on

Thats my order

[mastershake]

On 12/31/2019 at 9:13 AM, CrazedDogs said:

I think the main offseason priority is a new coaching staff! 

I'm going through roster now thinking about what it would take to at least have a dice roll on fixes up and down the roster. With no expectation that all of this would actually work.... this team is still so damned far away. Can't use high draft picks everywhere, can't sign high priced free agents everywhere.... to fix it all, a few somebodies will have to come out of nowhere.

On offense, I think the biggest hole is at center. I think we'll miss out on the hot shot center from Wisconsin in the draft, I'm not even going to try to spell his name, he's probably going to be a late 1st rounder, but that's one of those positions that is so mental, I'd like to see them late round cluster draft and/or go crazy with UDFAs at the position. Thats arguably the toughest position to scout. Cast a wide net and there's a decent chance to find someone who is an upgrade on another UDFA, Halapio.

OT is a more obvious problem.... I think I'm giving Solder one more year, and possibly asking him to move to RT if there are other options at LT. He isn't a G. Some tackles can move inside, but not him.... he's much too tall and lean to move inside. And as bad as he's been, and as much money as he makes, what are the odds we can find someone who's an improvement while filling all the other needs? Not good in my estimation. 

And I'm saying 'if there are other options at LT', as if that's some easy thing.... I fairly well expect our first pick to be an OT. And I hope - especially if we've brought in a college coach - that we've traded back for additional picks. (Because there is no college scout that knows college players better than a good college head coach.) We'll have a couple potentially good LTs available to the mid first round. Unfortunately not even the Dolphins have enough high 1st round picks for us to trade back and get two blue chip (or close) picks out of the deal. We'll have the opportunity to be confident we've 'solved' one position in the 2020 draft.... everybody thereafter is a crap shoot. 

So now if it falls that way, we're looking better on the OL.... but still have major holes at edge rusher and interior LB. I don't have confidence in the DBs at all, but with so many young players back there it's dice roll time on those guys. There may be good opportunities for a replacement for Ogletree with a red chip pick (mid 1st or 2nd round). 

I expect a pass rusher to be the big free agent priority. There are a couple good ones available. Olivier Vernon part 2, here we go? Hope not. 

If solutions shake out from those moves, that could be a decent turn around. Still have weaknesses at a lot of places. Need quality talent at wide out. Need a couple real TEs. Need those young DBs to pan out. Need Will Hernandez to learn to pick up a stunt. 

Sounds like another aspire to 8-8 kind of season even if everything falls right. 

 

I wanted to make this thread specific to players on the roster, i.e. FA and Draft. Yes, clearly the coach is the number one team priority, as they're looking to hire asap.

I can see the case for C being the top priority, plus there are likely more options at the position. 

If we're able to fill 3 out of the 5 priorities outline above, and go 8-8, I'd consider that to be an improvement.

[mastershake]

On 12/31/2019 at 10:13 AM, UK-Giantsfan said:

Solder is staying for sure ......... but we need a new Centre and some more depth in the O line and probably RT too ( due to inevitable injuries ) ....both in FA and the Draft.

We need a pass rusher ......FFS in FA

I'm really hoping that Conelly is our MLB of the future ( that ACL just sucks massively ) 

Our run D is fine , our WR will have to do and i think we are stuck with our young defensive backs .

so it is O line and pass rushers for me

Is Solder staying though if we're able to sign or draft a replacement? Maybe he can move to RT?

[Sephiroth]

1 minute ago, mastershake said:

Is Solder staying though if we're able to sign or draft a replacement? Maybe he can move to RT?

Solder went on the record this week saying he'd be happy to move to RT to stay with the team.  

Wonder if we could talk him into a pay cut. 

[mastershake]

8 minutes ago, Sephiroth said:

Solder went on the record this week saying he'd be happy to move to RT to stay with the team.  

Wonder if we could talk him into a pay cut. 

That's encouraging to hear, especially if we draft Andrew Thomas, who I presume would be plug and play at LT.

I'm not sure who else we could replace Solder with at LT, as I haven't looked at free agents yet nor draft prospects beyond Thomas. Some are saying this year's draft is deep at the Tackle position, but I don't know who's ready to start day one.

[Sephiroth]

3 minutes ago, mastershake said:

That's encouraging to hear, especially if we draft Andrew Thomas, who I presume would be plug and play at LT.

I'm not sure who else we could replace Solder with at LT, as I haven't looked at free agents yet nor draft prospects beyond Thomas. Some are saying this year's draft is deep at the Tackle position, but I don't know who's ready to start day one.

I'd love if we came outta this draft with a tackle and center in the first 3 rounds. Something tells me we're getting that 3rd back. 

[Nas]

On 12/31/2019 at 8:59 AM, mastershake said:

He named four position priorities and I named five. We're not that far away from being competitive if we hit on 4/5 players in those areas, plus assuming guys like Jones, Baker, Beal, Hernandez, Slayton, Love, and Connelly all make progress.

Not saying we're a super bowl team with that but definitely on the right track. For instance, adding two solid starters on the O line and you have a much more capable offense vs last year.

Your sarcasm meter is off

[BlueInCanada]

In terms of free agents my wish list;

CB Logan Ryan - start for the Titans with impressive coverage ability and also able to rush the passer. Going to cost some big money though.

LB Kyle Van Noy - Patriot players usually don't play well after leaving the system however he's a proven tackler and also pass rusher.

DE Yannick  Ngakoue - Obviously pass rusher is a must if we don't land Young. Expect a massive pay day though since pass rushers are a premium in free agency. 

FS Tre Boston - Former Getty player who is a true free safety.

DE Arik Armstead - One of the first highly drafted defenders for the 49ers hitting free agency.

WR Amari Cooper - True #1 option for Jones plus it would piss Jurriah off to no end.

 

[mastershake]

What am I missing on keeping Markus Golden? He seems to have better stats than FAs like Ngakoue and Dante Fowler (sacks, hurries, tfl, qb hits combined) who will command big $$$. Those other two do have him beat on age though.

[BlueInCanada]

40 minutes ago, mastershake said:

What am I missing on keeping Markus Golden? He seems to have better stats than FAs like Ngakoue and Dante Fowler (sacks, hurries, tfl, qb hits combined) who will command big $$$. Those other two do have him beat on age though.

Oh I don't count Golden as a FA but yea if they can resign him and someone like Armstead then holy hell we got a pass rush.

I think my biggest problem is that Golden suffers from the Osi problem, he gets a lot of garbage time sacks.

He isn't a premium pass rusher but he still is a very capable DE.

He's like a poor man's Tuck.

[mastershake]

2 minutes ago, BlueInCanada said:

Oh I don't count Golden as a FA but yea if they can resign him and someone like Armstead then holy hell we got a pass rush.

I think my biggest problem is that Golden suffers from the Osi problem, he gets a lot of garbage time sacks.

He isn't a premium pass rusher but he still is a very capable DE.

He's like a poor man's Tuck.

Armstead will be big $$$ but I'd like him as well.

Judon might be a better fit for us than Ngakoue, but I'd be fine with either.

If we could get Armstead, Judon/Ngakoue, bring back Golden for say `4 years $40mm, plus add DB veterans Tre Boston and Logan Ryan who shouldn't break the bank, I'd feel pretty good about our defense. The first two on that list will be $14-15mm plus per year though, but we should have the cap space, and the early years of their contracts will be less.

[BlueInCanada]

5 minutes ago, mastershake said:

Armstead will be big $$$ but I'd like him as well.

Judon might be a better fit for us than Ngakoue, but I'd be fine with either.

If we could get Armstead, Judon/Ngakoue, bring back Golden for say `4 years $40mm, plus add DB veterans Tre Boston and Logan Ryan who shouldn't break the bank, I'd feel pretty good about our defense. The first two on that list will be $14-15mm plus per year though, but we should have the cap space, and the early years of their contracts will be less.

Logan Ryan will cost some $$$ he's one of the better CBs this year and will probably bring Jenkins type contract with him.

Boston and Van Noy shouldnt break the bank and be day one starters.

But yeah I agree if they can get one DE, resign Golden, land Ryan and Boston or Van Noy.

Suddenly the defense looks better.

The majority of all that cap space should go towards the defence and extended contracts with the team.

Use the draft for Oline and WR help.

[BronxRik]

It'd be a shame if all that cap room we're supposed to have went on FA busts. 

[CrazedDogs]

5 hours ago, mastershake said:

I wanted to make this thread specific to players on the roster, i.e. FA and Draft. Yes, clearly the coach is the number one team priority, as they're looking to hire asap.

I can see the case for C being the top priority, plus there are likely more options at the position. 

If we're able to fill 3 out of the 5 priorities outline above, and go 8-8, I'd consider that to be an improvement.

I figured as much, I just brought up the coaching end of it because scheme fit will be a consideration. Difficult to be very specific on this until we know the coaches.

I think it may just be all about the center. Maybe. For example, some of Hernandez's mistakes I noted were when he let someone around him while turning to help Halapio. When you have a weak tackle or guard, he needs help, but you know where the help needs to go. When you are weak at center, it impacts the entire protection scheme because you can't hide it; the default is already to block from the inside, out - how else are you going to help the guy? 

For me, everything else on offense is a bonus just so long as we get solid at center.

 

[MakeMeSomeFoodHo]

Who is that huge receiver on the Seahawks? 
 

is he a free agent? They should get him... he is as big as a defensive end

[Storm]

Gates needs to stick on that offensive line. Kaden Smith should take Rhett Ellisons place. The running game was on fire largely due to runs off tackle to his side the final 3 or 4 games of the season. Engram should stay, even if oft injured. The offense is just better with him.

 

On defense I would like to see some more youth in the secondary, a veteran MLB, and an early round defensive end.

[Iceman_NYG]

Just found out Nate Solder's son had a tumour removed couple months back and is going through chemotherapy. Man - that sucks - I can pardon a drop in play with such a burden on your mind