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Ike Hilliard

Money

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Money

Money

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Posted

In the five years that I've been posting on Giants message boards, one of the most perplexing arguments that I've seen has unequivocably maintained that Ike Hilliard was a "bust." The brilliant mind behind this misguided sentiment has even dubbed Ike an oh-so-clever nickname: "Ike Hillary." I know, I know ... how hilarious, I wish I could have thought of it first.

 

 

I guess the reasonable starting point is arriving at an operational definition for "bust." Personally, I think it applies to a player that entered the league with reasonable expectations (say, 4th round or higher) and never held a starting position for an extended period of time (3-4 years). There is something to be said for relativity -- a top 5 pick that starts for only 3 years might be rightfully viewed as a bust -- but if a player develops into a serviceable starter, I have a difficult time categorizing that player as a bust, especially since bust implies that a player never amounted to anything. In that regard, Ike was far from a bust. He was absolutely a solid receiver for us; a bust doesn't complie 5000 receiving yards and 30 TDs over the course of his career, playing the majority of the time with lousy QBs.

 

 

Next, it's been suggested that Ike wasn't worth the 7th overall pick, which is a fair point. Hilliard's production does not match the expectations of a top 10 player. HOWEVAH, you have to evaluate him in the context of his draft class. Ike was the first WR drafted. After him, there were 6 other WRs taken in the first two rounds:

 

- Yatil Green (15th overall)

- Reidel Anthony (16)

- Rae Carruth (27)

- Joey Kent (46)

- Kevin Lockett (47)

- Will Blackwell (53)

 

COMBINED Career Production: 334 catches, 5458 yards, 31 TDs

 

Ike Hilliard:: 437 catches, 5251 yards, 30 TDs

 

The Giants obviously made a mistake drafting future bust Ike Hilliard when surefire stars like Yatil Green and Rae Carruth were on the board.

 

 

Moving forward, the anti-Ike campaign has been largely based upon his injury problems. Sure, he was injured quite often, but I'm not sure why our resident Hilliard biographer feels compelled to direct that as a criticism. The guy BROKE HIS NECK in his second career game and there was doubt that he would ever play again. Perhaps that's why fans have praised Ike's toughness, because soooooooo many people play in the NFL for a decade after sustaining a broken neck. But yeah, it's obviously more sensible to give the guy a feminine nickname.

 

He also had another half season taken away because of a blatant cheap shot by Brian Dawkins. But I suppose none of that matters. All that matters is that he was on IR a whopping 3 times, and besides the time missed from the 2 aforementioned devastating injuries, he's missed an entire 7 games during his career.

 

 

Sounds like a bust to me... ;)

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fringe

fringe

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in the long line of giants receiver flops, i guess he's above the curve. i don't buy the argument of 'hey, he wasn't ray carruth' however.

we could have had:

james farrior

warrick dunn

tony gonzalez

jim drunkinmiller - :P

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NightFire

NightFire

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Not a bust.

 

The definition of bust to me is not where you are drafted but how long you play. Hilliard has now been in the league for 11 years and was on the Giants for 8. It doesn't matter that he hasn't gotten pro bowl numbers but that has lasted this long (especially with his major injuries). A bust doesn't last 11 years. How many players are still playing from the hundreds drafted in his draft year?

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Nas

Nas

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Money, I don't know what the hell you do for living. Don't know if you're still in school or married with children. Everytime I read one of your posts, I'm amazed at your style of writing, your logic, and your knowledge. You should be a sportswriter.

 

Having said that, I never thought of Ike as a bust. On the contrary, I thought the guy was pretty good at what he did. And it's true that we don't know we have till we lose them.

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BIGBLUE01

BIGBLUE01

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Money, I don't know what the hell you do for living. Don't know if you're still in school or married with children. Everytime I read one of your posts, I'm amazed at your style of writing, your logic, and your knowledge. You should be a sportswriter.

 

Having said that, I never thought of Ike as a bust. On the contrary, I thought the guy was pretty good at what he did. And it's true that we don't know we have till we lose them.

 

Hey Nas, long time no talk, how the heck ar ya??

 

I agree w/ Nas, great writing, very interesting to read. :TU:

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xxi-xxv

xxi-xxv

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Ike was not a bust, but rather a true definition as to why sometimes you need to draft best player available as opposed to need. You see that list from 97? No great Wr's. Take the96 class, Keyshawn, T.O., Harrison, Toomer, Kinnison, some pretty productive WR's.

 

Ike was not a bust, just probably not worth the 7th pick, but in a weak WR class combined with a team that needed a WR he was the 7h pick. I always liked Ike and feel that ELI has missed that short router runner in the seams, particularly on 3rd down.

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BIGBLUE01

BIGBLUE01

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No one went across the middle better, and no one was tougher, besides maybe our last 3 Tight Ends, and Cross is questionable on that one. (Luved Howard, just not as tough as Bavaro or Shock).

 

I gotta say this again guys and gals, but he is THE NICEST GIANT PLAYER I have met in a long time. The guy went outta his way to sign stuff for me and my buddies, and when I had my son w/ me....fuggedaboutit! The guy would sign eveything my son had, talk to him, high five him....you get the picture. Met his wife, tailgated w/ her and some family friends in AZ once, Ike's a class act. :worshippy:

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Nas

Nas

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Posted
No one went across the middle better, and no one was tougher, besides maybe our last 3 Tight Ends, and Cross is questionable on that one. (Luved Howard, just not as tough as Bavaro or Shock).

 

I gotta say this again guys and gals, but he is THE NICEST GIANT PLAYER I have met in a long time. The guy went outta his way to sign stuff for me and my buddies, and when I had my son w/ me....fuggedaboutit! The guy would sign eveything my son had, talk to him, high five him....you get the picture. Met his wife, tailgated w/ her and some family friends in AZ once, Ike's a class act. :worshippy:

 

The guy stood there after practice and talked to me for 15 minutes. What athlete does that. Humility is a lost art and class doesn't seem to matter to anyone anymore.. it sure does to me though.

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Gspotter

Gspotter

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No not a bust. If you look to what the O was as Fassel took over, wow, it was bad.

 

Even afterwards, we didn't really have much cohesion and I recall a lot of stalled drives, poor blocking, bad QB'ing, etc.

 

To my mind, it's hard to judge a WR alone when all that's in disarray. He wasn't a speed guy and so as a posession receiver going over the middle, etc., I think he wasn't bad at all and showed a lot of guts.

 

I'm not sure I'd qualify anyone a bust who's contributed and maintiained in the NFL for this many years and as far as I know, he's still with TB, so I can't support the notion of him as a "bust."

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RaginCaucasian

RaginCaucasian

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Ike does not = bust. Probably not as productive as we would have hoped coming out of college but four things contributed to that:

1. Fassholes play calling.

2. Broken neck in game 2 of his career.

3. Playing in a pass-happy system in Florida made him look like the second coming of Jerry Rice.

4. Sub-par Qb's.

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  • 2 weeks later...
ksm7

ksm7

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Posted
In the five years that I've been posting on Giants message boards, one of the most perplexing arguments that I've seen has unequivocably maintained that Ike Hilliard was a "bust." The brilliant mind behind this misguided sentiment has even dubbed Ike an oh-so-clever nickname: "Ike Hillary." I know, I know ... how hilarious, I wish I could have thought of it first.

I guess the reasonable starting point is arriving at an operational definition for "bust." Personally, I think it applies to a player that entered the league with reasonable expectations (say, 4th round or higher) and never held a starting position for an extended period of time (3-4 years). There is something to be said for relativity -- a top 5 pick that starts for only 3 years might be rightfully viewed as a bust -- but if a player develops into a serviceable starter, I have a difficult time categorizing that player as a bust, especially since bust implies that a player never amounted to anything. In that regard, Ike was far from a bust. He was absolutely a solid receiver for us; a bust doesn't complie 5000 receiving yards and 30 TDs over the course of his career, playing the majority of the time with lousy QBs.

Next, it's been suggested that Ike wasn't worth the 7th overall pick, which is a fair point. Hilliard's production does not match the expectations of a top 10 player. HOWEVAH, you have to evaluate him in the context of his draft class. Ike was the first WR drafted. After him, there were 6 other WRs taken in the first two rounds:

 

- Yatil Green (15th overall)

- Reidel Anthony (16)

- Rae Carruth (27)

- Joey Kent (46)

- Kevin Lockett (47)

- Will Blackwell (53)

 

COMBINED Career Production: 334 catches, 5458 yards, 31 TDs

 

Ike Hilliard:: 437 catches, 5251 yards, 30 TDs

 

The Giants obviously made a mistake drafting future bust Ike Hilliard when surefire stars like Yatil Green and Rae Carruth were on the board.

Moving forward, the anti-Ike campaign has been largely based upon his injury problems. Sure, he was injured quite often, but I'm not sure why our resident Hilliard biographer feels compelled to direct that as a criticism. The guy BROKE HIS NECK in his second career game and there was doubt that he would ever play again. Perhaps that's why fans have praised Ike's toughness, because soooooooo many people play in the NFL for a decade after sustaining a broken neck. But yeah, it's obviously more sensible to give the guy a feminine nickname.

 

He also had another half season taken away because of a blatant cheap shot by Brian Dawkins. But I suppose none of that matters. All that matters is that he was on IR a whopping 3 times, and besides the time missed from the 2 aforementioned devastating injuries, he's missed an entire 7 games during his career.

Sounds like a bust to me... ;)

 

The question begs to be asked - are you Ike Hilliard? Because the Dog is quite certain that the only person that would right an extensive post about Ike Hilliard, complete with statistics and draft placement, is Ike Hilliard...

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Chuck Wagon

Chuck Wagon

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The question begs to be asked - are you Ike Hilliard? Because the Dog is quite certain that the only person that would right an extensive post about Ike Hilliard, complete with statistics and draft placement, is Ike Hilliard...

 

Nobody...I mean not even Ricky Henderson...refers to themselves in the third person better then you sir. Its use and placement is simply genius..and it has been missed.

 

C. Wagon

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NeMesiS

NeMesiS

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The question begs to be asked - are you Ike Hilliard? Because the Dog is quite certain that the only person that would right an extensive post about Ike Hilliard, complete with statistics and draft placement, is Ike Hilliard...

No...But he is one of many Giants fans who have fallen into Ike's Jedi mind tricks in believing that Ike was a good WR. I'm sorry, but Ike was not very productive.

 

Was Ike dominating? Hell no. Sure, He'll have one, maybe two (if we're lucky) 100 yard game in a season. I'll always wonder why people consider Ike to have good hands. He was always among the leader of drop balls, even though he spend most of the season on the IR list.

 

My favorite quote among Giants fans "Ike was fearless going over the middle." :LMAO: Are we sure about that? Because I do recall him having a bad case of Alligator arms through out his career. Which probably lead to all those drop balls...(Enter Jedi mind trick: Ike was never among the leaders in drop balls. He was fearless over the middle and had great hands. He had 4.20 speed)

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charlietags

charlietags

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No...But he is one of many Giants fans who have fallen into Ike's Jedi mind tricks in believing that Ike was a good WR. I'm sorry, but Ike was not very productive.

 

Was Ike dominating? Hell no. Sure, He'll have one, maybe two (if we're lucky) 100 yard game in a season. I'll always wonder why people consider Ike to have good hands. He was always among the leader of drop balls, even though he spend most of the season on the IR list.

 

My favorite quote among Giants fans "Ike was fearless going over the middle." :LMAO: Are we sure about that? Because I do recall him having a bad case of Alligator arms through out his career. Which probably lead to all those drop balls...(Enter Jedi mind trick: Ike was never among the leaders in drop balls. He was fearless over the middle and had great hands. He had 4.20 speed)

All you have to do is see the catch he made in the SB over the middle and drove 2-3 guys 4-5 yards to get a first down.

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