BlueInCanada Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 12 minutes ago, Sephiroth said: Yeah like... not for nothing, they DID try but after last season of being 0-for-3 with Neal, Ezeudu, and McKethan... and Glowinski and Bredeson also looking pretty bad... they should have said, "none of those guys looked good so let's bring in a few competent guys either through FA or the draft as a back up plan." The plan this year basically was "nothing last year worked out but hey let's hope" when it came to the line. Hope is not a strategy. Not so much hope as "We don't have much to work with, until many of these contracts are off the books, so fuck it let's see what happens" Which tends to happen in rebuilds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 5 minutes ago, BlueInCanada said: But this team would still be in a rebuild granted maybe with one starting guard, still with no WRs and no LBs since we dont land Bobby the OK and we would be starting Eric Gray at RB lol The result wouldn't be much different if not the same. All I'm saying is, by week 8 I don't think any (or most) of us thought the Giants would be better than 3-5 with the schedule we have. Were 2-6. The FO rolled the dice with the roster and the offseason moves they could make with the limited ammunition. However they didn't plan for us to be one of the most injured teams in the NFL the first 8 weeks. We wouldn't have the worst scoring team offense in 57 years if we had 3 or 4 functional offensive lineman going into the season, and we'd very likely be 4-4, going on 5-4 after this weekend. Plus we wouldn't be getting embarrassed on prime time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 Just now, mastershake said: We wouldn't have the worst scoring offense if we had 3 or 4 functional offensive lineman going into the season, and we'd very likely be 4-4... Plus we wouldn't be getting embarrassed on prime time. Probably not. We played actual teams this year vs last years cake walk of a schedule and single score games we won. We'd have little to no run game with the RBs wed have, wed still have no WRs, and if the injuries set in like they did this year then who knows how many of those lineman are still starting after the great tush push injury that killed two of our starting Olineman lol We're a bad team, bad teams get embarrassed, it's nothing we haven't seen the last 10 years. Also Jones is still the QB on the team so yeah we'd still be a poor scoring offense lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 29 minutes ago, BlueInCanada said: Probably not. We played actual teams this year vs last years cake walk of a schedule and single score games we won. We'd have little to no run game with the RBs wed have, wed still have no WRs, and if the injuries set in like they did this year then who knows how many of those lineman are still starting after the great tush push injury that killed two of our starting Olineman lol We're a bad team, bad teams get embarrassed, it's nothing we haven't seen the last 10 years. Also Jones is still the QB on the team so yeah we'd still be a poor scoring offense lol A competent OL gets you the wins vs the Bills and Jets, plus makes you competitive and likely to win vs the Raiders, plus in general means your scoring more points in general. A competent OL means you're looking at possibly 7-5 or 6-6 heading into the bye. Not great, but not terrible. 3 of the next 4 games really SHOULD be wins if the team just had an OL. Barkley is averaging 3.7 yards per carry. That's not anything special. That can be easily replaced. At best they're an 8-10 win team with a competent OL. Without one, and with one this putrid OL well maybe 4-6 is what we're looking at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 53 minutes ago, BlueInCanada said: But this team would still be in a rebuild granted maybe with one starting guard, still with no WRs and no LBs since we dont land Bobby the OK and we would be starting Eric Gray at RB lol The result wouldn't be much different if not the same. All I'm saying is, by week 8 I don't think any (or most) of us thought the Giants would be better than 3-5 with the schedule we have. Were 2-6. The FO rolled the dice with the roster and the offseason moves they could make with the limited ammunition. However they didn't plan for us to be one of the most injured teams in the NFL the first 8 weeks. After being a veteran of watching this team....not much you can do when you have no real cap money and are locked in with high draft picks that are not panning out for now. You just have to ride the wave. Call it a day and reboot for next year. This year is a lost cause and just try to preserve as much as you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 55 minutes ago, BlueInCanada said: Not so much hope as "We don't have much to work with, until many of these contracts are off the books, so fuck it let's see what happens" Which tends to happen in rebuilds. This is a pure rebuild. The thing that we have been avoiding since the Glory Days of Eli. You either rebuild on the fly as the Broke Backs and 69'ers seem able to do... or you go through 5-10 years of wilderness traveling as it seems the Giants do. We go from doormats, to up and coming, to forces to be reckoned with, winners of a Super Bowl to one or two years of playoffs, to being doormats again. It is cycle we have been repeating since 1963... and I think the current regime is trying to change this. Going beyond the Maras as total owners and/or one of the primary owners is the only way IMHO to break this cycle. The Giants seem to be slow walking this and/or are too scared to walk away from Mara ownership/major involvement so here we go. If for nothing... the outside thinking of Schoen and Daboll is the way to go IMHO opinion. The Fool's Gold of trying to harness the Belichik Method (an original Giants defensive coordinator most directly responsible for rings One and Two outside of LT, Parcells and the like), which without Belichik has failed everywhere to my knowledge. It is a system that requires Belichik in the center and without him it has no chance of real success. I would hope with the recent Raiders' implosion that people are finally willing to give this up. We just have to ride the wave till it crests and brings us in to shore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 38 minutes ago, mastershake said: A competent OL gets you the wins vs the Bills and Jets, plus makes you competitive and likely to win vs the Raiders, plus in general means your scoring more points in general. A competent OL means you're looking at possibly 7-5 or 6-6 heading into the bye. Not great, but not terrible. 3 of the next 4 games really SHOULD be wins if the team just had an OL. Barkley is averaging 3.7 yards per carry. That's not anything special. That can be easily replaced. At best they're an 8-10 win team with a competent OL. Without one, and with one this putrid OL well maybe 4-6 is what we're looking at. I hear you man... I would rather truly tank and get a higher draft choice and win in 2024 and/or 2025. Wins in 2023 don't really mean anything to me. We should get value for Barkley... who I liken to a flawed home run runner who looks to get a TD each run instead of what is there. Prior to last year and this... everyone was lamenting his ability to see open spaces and blocks that were there to get 4-5 yards, yet eschewing what is there for the 20+ yard gains that come in one in ten and/or twenty runs. Barkley is a home run runner designed for the 70s-90s and maybe the early 2000s; not for the high scoring QB/WR league of today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boohyah Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 Competent game management and a field goal not being missed gets us wins over the Jets and Bills. Don't have to look to the o line there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 1 hour ago, boohyah said: Competent game management and a field goal not being missed gets us wins over the Jets and Bills. Don't have to look to the o line there. This the AFC East is a paper tiger with the collapse of the Patriots. We should have beaten both the Bills and Jests. The Dolphins flat up beat us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 2 hours ago, boohyah said: Competent game management and a field goal not being missed gets us wins over the Jets and Bills. Don't have to look to the o line there. If the O line was competent, you're not in a position where one decision or FG makes it breaks the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boohyah Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 5 hours ago, mastershake said: If the O line was competent, you're not in a position where one decision or FG makes it breaks the game. Well that's not the case at all. You could have competent offensive lines and still come down to a field goal. Let's just go back to the last superbowl for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted November 4, 2023 Share Posted November 4, 2023 22 minutes ago, boohyah said: Well that's not the case at all. You could have competent offensive lines and still come down to a field goal. Let's just go back to the last superbowl for that. I'm speaking about the two specific games where we averaged less than 10 pts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boohyah Posted November 4, 2023 Share Posted November 4, 2023 35 minutes ago, mastershake said: I'm speaking about the two specific games where we averaged less than 10 pts. The Giants don't have more points on the board against the Bills because they made a bad call ay the end of the first half and a blatant hold prevented the last score. They didn't score more against the Jets because they didn't trust the qb to run the offense properly. That couldn't be more obvious. And 2 missed field goals. The offensive line was better the last 2 games than they were the previous 4. Obviously if they were better it would be beneficial, but they don't kick field goals or throw or catch the ball. Let's be fair here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted November 4, 2023 Share Posted November 4, 2023 5 minutes ago, boohyah said: The Giants don't have more points on the board against the Bills because they made a bad call ay the end of the first half and a blatant hold prevented the last score. They didn't score more against the Jets because they didn't trust the qb to run the offense properly. That couldn't be more obvious. And 2 missed field goals. The offensive line was better the last 2 games than they were the previous 4. Obviously if they were better it would be beneficial, but they don't kick field goals or throw or catch the ball. Let's be fair here. Because the OL sucked in both instances, and in the case of the Jets, that QB was in the game because the previous one got hurt running for his life, after the QB before him in a prior game got crushed because of an incompetent OL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted November 4, 2023 Share Posted November 4, 2023 Soooo get ready for Tommy Devito again, and 29 runs in the 2nd half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted November 5, 2023 Share Posted November 5, 2023 He shouldn’t play if he has any pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted November 5, 2023 Share Posted November 5, 2023 5 hours ago, mastershake said: Soooo get ready for Tommy Devito again, and 29 runs in the 2nd half. 2 hours ago, Herc said: He shouldn’t play if he has any pain. Just unreal... he will need a walker or cane by age 50 at this point. Just damned stupid. DJ should just sit out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted November 5, 2023 Share Posted November 5, 2023 I took the under 37.5 on today's game, and the Raiders at -1.5. I wish there was an over under on when DJ gets knocked out of the game: 2nd quarter I'd bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted November 5, 2023 Share Posted November 5, 2023 2nd quarter... probably the latter part of the 3rd is where my money is. Let's hope he still feels his left side somewhat after getting racked up. Dude should have been a running back. He must have been a killer in the Wishbone in college. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted November 5, 2023 Share Posted November 5, 2023 1 hour ago, TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt said: 2nd quarter... probably the latter part of the 3rd is where my money is. Let's hope he still feels his left side somewhat after getting racked up. Dude should have been a running back. He must have been a killer in the Wishbone in college. They're going to ruin this guy's neck, ala David Wilson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted November 5, 2023 Share Posted November 5, 2023 6 minutes ago, mastershake said: They're going to ruin this guy's neck, ala David Wilson. how did they ruin his neck? once he got diagnosed they put him on IR and he retired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted November 5, 2023 Share Posted November 5, 2023 2 hours ago, TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt said: 2nd quarter... probably the latter part of the 3rd is where my money is. Let's hope he still feels his left side somewhat after getting racked up. Dude should have been a running back. He must have been a killer in the Wishbone in college. Funny thing is, Jones wasn’t a runner quite like this in college. He grew, and got faster. he was an ok runner in college. But just ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted November 5, 2023 Share Posted November 5, 2023 10 hours ago, mastershake said: I took the under 37.5 on today's game, and the Raiders at -1.5. I wish there was an over under on when DJ gets knocked out of the game: 2nd quarter I'd bet. Well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted November 6, 2023 Author Share Posted November 6, 2023 2 hours ago, gmenroc said: Well done. I said to my son and dad before kickoff that this game may be the last one of Jones's career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted November 6, 2023 Share Posted November 6, 2023 1 minute ago, Sephiroth said: I said to my son and dad before kickoff that this game may be the last one of Jones's career. Would not shock me. Also, the conspiracy theorist in me says the Giants put him in a royally shitty position on purpose because they learned early he is not the guy and injury is easiest way to get out from that contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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