Sammy Knight inked to a 3 year, 5 million contract

[BleedinBlue]

I cannot reiterate enough how bad that deal for Gibril was by the Raiders. I believe Peter King said it best when he reffrered to Gibril as a "pedestrian" safety when he was talking about all the crazy money that guys got....xxi-xxv-xLii

 

Gibril was good, not great. For every play he made like the one against Fasano at the goal line in Dallas, he would take the wrong angle on a play and be right in the middle of a big passing play.

 

Free agency for players is like playing the lottery. Some times you win....some times you lose. Gibril won big. Guys like Briggs lost because no one pursued him. Can't blame Wilson for testing the market to see if there was a sucker out there willing to pay him like an elite player and a millionaire for life. He rolled the dice and won.

 

But back to Knight. Yeah, I loved what he said in that interview and it sounds like he will love the Giants because he eats, drinks, and breathes defense and he loved the way the Giants attacked N.E. with the pass rush. He seems like a good fit at the right time - both for the Giants and for him. I'm happy!

 

since this is starting a new page, I'll reiterate from the last page that everyone should check out the interview with Knight on Giants.com Interview with Sammy Knight

[Storm]

You mean 03-04.

 

You keep referring to Sammy Knight as a Dolphin. He played there two years. If anything (other than a Giant), you should refer to him as a Saint.

 

 

yah...and uhh, him and Sam Madison both played together for the Dolphins years ago...now they're playing for our team...both, over 30, which is what I was alluding to. It's not a good signing.

[Storm]

Giants.com is to old for Storm.

 

Huh? I was Giantsguy21 on giants.com.

 

But yah, it IS way too old for me.

[osi724dasack]

great value

 

 

[ccase39]

I love this. Veteran guy who can step right in and start and at a great value.

I loved him when he was with the saints. I hated to get rid of him. glad he went to the giants, hes gotta be getting old though. good signing over al imo

[Taylorized56]

What's not to like? Great value, great vet to mentor our young safety's. He can still produce too. He's not the greatest at coverage but should benefit from the pressure our d-line will provide. Nice sign as a stop-gap for a year or two.

[BIGBLUE01]

This signing is great, considering he'll help get Johnson fully ready to dominate back there. Johnson is the real deal IMO.

[echochamber]

There's a good chance he doesn't even make the final roster, especially since the cap hit would be minimal. Reese will still draft a S, and probably sign some UDFAs. This signing is a lot about depth and competition at camp.

[BleedinBlue]

There's a good chance he doesn't even make the final roster, especially since the cap hit would be minimal. Reese will still draft a S, and probably sign some UDFAs. This signing is a lot about depth and competition at camp.

He'll make the roster. For several reasons. First, he got a signing bonus of 1.25 million. Giants aren't going to piss that away to take a chance on an unproven rookie. Secondly, even if the Giants were fortunate enough to draft a couple of decent safeties that have potential, they still need backups and very, very few rookies are able to step right in and handle the position. Thirdly, Knight is durable, as evidenced by his playing in 156 consecutive games and rookies tend to get hurt in that position. Lastly, he obviously isn't playing like an old man about to retire as evidenced by his 132 tackles and 4 interceptions last year. The Giants aren't going to get those kind of numbers (not even close) out of a rookie learning the game.

 

The other problem the Giants are facing is that the linebacking corps is depleted and they have to address that before chasing after rookie safeties. I have to believe the Giants are sifting through the free agent linebackers in hopes of signing one.

[fishgutmartyr]

The other problem the Giants are facing is that the linebacking corps is depleted and they have to address that before chasing after rookie safeties. I have to believe the Giants are sifting through the free agent linebackers in hopes of signing one.

 

I just don't see the panic at linebacker. We need one, maybe two backups. I'm more concerned about DE at this point. Right now, the only DE we have signed as a backup is Dave Tollefson--Awasome isn't even signed right now. Granted we have Tuck, but with Osi's recent tendency to miss a few games during the season and Strahan's injury record of late (assuming he stays), I'm not feeling all that secure there. Making matters worse, our SB stretch has the rest of the league putting that position at a premium. All that said, I'm still not into putting Kiwanuka back to DE, because he's too good to sit on the bench, and at this point too light to play DE. I suppose you could bulk him up a little, but that will slow him down at LB. And with the season Tuck had, there's no way you sit him to play Kiwi.

 

To me, that's the scariest part of the defense right now.

[echochamber]

He'll make the roster. For several reasons. First, he got a signing bonus of 1.25 million. Giants aren't going to piss that away to take a chance on an unproven rookie. Secondly, even if the Giants were fortunate enough to draft a couple of decent safeties that have potential, they still need backups and very, very few rookies are able to step right in and handle the position. Thirdly, Knight is durable, as evidenced by his playing in 156 consecutive games and rookies tend to get hurt in that position. Lastly, he obviously isn't playing like an old man about to retire as evidenced by his 132 tackles and 4 interceptions last year. The Giants aren't going to get those kind of numbers (not even close) out of a rookie learning the game.

 

The other problem the Giants are facing is that the linebacking corps is depleted and they have to address that before chasing after rookie safeties. I have to believe the Giants are sifting through the free agent linebackers in hopes of signing one.

 

I think those stats are a bit deceiving. To me, they say opposing offenses threw his way to take advantage of his lack of speed and range. The more tackles a secondary player has, it means opposing teams believe they are a weak link and will attempt to take advantage. You want your LBs & DL doing the tackling, not players at the next level cause that means you're giving up yardage. The signing bonus is peanuts, and if he is cut the bonus would be split between this year and next, so no problem there. I do like his durability. He also played under Giunta in KC, so there is familiarity. He will also be a good teacher and QB for the secondary. He'll probably make the team, but I wouldn't be surprised in the least to see Johnson & Butler starting. The safeties that make the team will greatly depend upon the progression of Butler & Johnson.

 

The Giants are actually pretty good at LB. MLB & SLB are set. Wilk will in all probability start at WLB. You then have Blackburn & DeOssie as backups. Another LB is definitely needed, but it is not a pressing need like S. Really, i could see Reese taking either a S, LB or DT in the 1st round. Whichever position has BPA.

 

 

[Treehugger]

I just don't see the panic at linebacker. We need one, maybe two backups. I'm more concerned about DE at this point. Right now, the only DE we have signed as a backup is Dave Tollefson--Awasome isn't even signed right now. Granted we have Tuck, but with Osi's recent tendency to miss a few games during the season and Strahan's injury record of late (assuming he stays), I'm not feeling all that secure there. Making matters worse, our SB stretch has the rest of the league putting that position at a premium. All that said, I'm still not into putting Kiwanuka back to DE, because he's too good to sit on the bench, and at this point too light to play DE. I suppose you could bulk him up a little, but that will slow him down at LB. And with the season Tuck had, there's no way you sit him to play Kiwi.

 

To me, that's the scariest part of the defense right now.

I think Tuck proved you don't need to be named 'starter' to get the reps or production under Spags' scheme. They're rotating in and out all the time.

[fishgutmartyr]

I think Tuck proved you don't need to be named 'starter' to get the reps or production under Spags' scheme. They're rotating in and out all the time.

True, but wasn't he doing that rotating mostly out of DT anyway? I just don't see how you use him sparingly if a DE spot opens, s'all. Besides, Osi would be shitting bricks if he didn't start with that contract.

 

But you made a good point. Thanks, I needed that. I can get rid of the paper bag now.

[BlueInCanada]

I would still like to see us take a safety early, maybe the 2nd round now because people are saying in the 1st alot of talent will drop down to us so we should take whoever is the best available.

 

I would like some competition with the Johnson kid and I think a early round safety would do it.

[BleedinBlue]

I just don't see the panic at linebacker. We need one, maybe two backups. I'm more concerned about DE at this point. Right now, the only DE we have signed as a backup is Dave Tollefson--Awasome isn't even signed right now.

 

At the linebacker position, we have been carrying 7 guys. The 3 starters are (were) Torbor, Pierce, and Mitchell with backups Blackburn, DeOssie, Wilkenson and Torrance Daniels. We lost two starters and the only backup with significant experience is Blackburn. We definitely have a problem there. When you lose 66% of your starters in a position....that's significant.

 

As far as DE goes....we cut Awasome shortly after his DWI in Phoenix. He's history. Plus, the backups we have are Manuel Wright and Russell Davis....neither of whom are proven.

 

Kiwi is a natural DE trying to learn the linebacker position in which he struggled early on this season. Also, Kiwi is 6'5", 270 lbs as opposed to Osi who is 6'3", 260 and Tuck who is 6'5" 272 lbs and Strahan who is 6'5", 255 lbs....so I'm not quite sure why you think Kiwi is too small to play DE. He's basically the same size as Tuck and Strahan, but because of his speed, is being tried out as a linebacker.

 

If Kiwi can develop into a hybrid DE/LB....that gives Spags some options for trick defenses, which is good. But keeping Kiwi as a linebacker only is wasting his talent as a lineman in my opinion.

 

With Briggs and Pace gone - the only elite linebacker left in free agency is Landon Johnson, who a 6'2", 230 is much more ideal for the linebacker position. The only drawback is that he has played his entire career in a 3-4 defense, so there's some question marks about his playing in the Giants 4-3.

 

Regardless...we are short handed at linebacker and 2/3's of the 3-man crew are going to be learning the game on the fly. The only good thing is that Spags knows far more than any of us fans about what is needed and what isn't and I think between him, TC and Reese, they'll do the right things.

 

 

[Treehugger]

True, but wasn't he doing that rotating mostly out of DT anyway? I just don't see how you use him sparingly if a DE spot opens, s'all. Besides, Osi would be shitting bricks if he didn't start with that contract.

 

But you made a good point. Thanks, I needed that. I can get rid of the paper bag now.

I may be mistaken but I think Spags had him rotating in at both ends and DT (on third down passing plays). It's be interesting to see how many snaps each of them took; I bet it would be pretty even.

[fishgutmartyr]

At the linebacker position, we have been carrying 7 guys. The 3 starters are (were) Torbor, Pierce, and Mitchell with backups Blackburn, DeOssie, Wilkenson and Torrance Daniels. We lost two starters and the only backup with significant experience is Blackburn. We definitely have a problem there. When you lose 66% of your starters in a position....that's significant.

 

Bleedin' no offense but you're buying into the hype. Torbor wasn't our starter until Kiwi went down. We've tried him as a starter in the past, and he just didn't have it (How bad do you have to be to have Brandon Short and Carlos Emmons start before you?). If Kiwi didn't break his leg, Torbor would have seen the field from the distance more often than not.

 

As far as DE goes....we cut Awasome shortly after his DWI in Phoenix. He's history. Plus, the backups we have are Manuel Wright and Russell Davis....neither of whom are proven.

 

I thought Manuel Wright and Russell Davis were DTs. The roster I looked at has them listed as such.

 

Kiwi is a natural DE trying to learn the linebacker position in which he struggled early on this season. Also, Kiwi is 6'5", 270 lbs as opposed to Osi who is 6'3", 260 and Tuck who is 6'5" 272 lbs and Strahan who is 6'5", 255 lbs....so I'm not quite sure why you think Kiwi is too small to play DE. He's basically the same size as Tuck and Strahan, but because of his speed, is being tried out as a linebacker.

 

I think we have a misunderstanding about Kiwi--when he switched positions, he went down to about 255 lbs. That's a bit light for his frame to play DE. That's what I meant by "small." If he bulks up again, he'd be fine--but at that point you really do lose a starter at LB. That's were the stomach acid comes from.

 

If Kiwi can develop into a hybrid DE/LB....that gives Spags some options for trick defenses, which is good. But keeping Kiwi as a linebacker only is wasting his talent as a lineman in my opinion.

 

With Briggs and Pace gone - the only elite linebacker left in free agency is Landon Johnson, who a 6'2", 230 is much more ideal for the linebacker position. The only drawback is that he has played his entire career in a 3-4 defense, so there's some question marks about his playing in the Giants 4-3.

 

Regardless...we are short handed at linebacker and 2/3's of the 3-man crew are going to be learning the game on the fly. The only good thing is that Spags knows far more than any of us fans about what is needed and what isn't and I think between him, TC and Reese, they'll do the right things.

 

Before he was injured, I think that was what Spagnuolo was doing--using him as a pass-rushing LB in 3rd down situations. In the last few games before his injury, I thought he was improving considerably.

[Nas]

yah but webster played well enough that when Madison got back late in the playoffs, Webster was still our guy. or am i wrong...?

 

regardless, I still say Sam Madison and Sammy Knight both suck. And we should have been letting those guys go(or not pursuing them) then let Gibril go.

 

You have to factor in the price we got Knight for. I don't know much about players in other teams but our Wilson wasn't a super start to begin with. If this Knight guy is half way decent, then we got ourselves a great deal.. besides we have the draft coming up... so in essence Knight is more of a stop-gap.

[Gspotter]

Sammy Knight is Brent Alexander's older brother...

 

this is a weird move.

[Nesta]

 

yah...and uhh, him and Sam Madison both played together for the Dolphins years ago...now they're playing for our team...both, over 30, which is what I was alluding to. It's not a good signing.

 

about 3 years ago, so what. You're right. It's not a good signing, it's a great one.

We get the same production for less money, and the guy is an iron man.

 

[Storm]

Sammy Knight is Brent Alexander's older brother...

 

this is a weird move.

 

That's exactly what this move is. Signing Brent Alexander's older brother.

[Lubeck]

What is it about this signing that you don't understand? Near-identical production for almost 5 million a year less sounds good to me.

 

He is 32 and only getting older you say. Which means he still has 1-2 good years left. And in the time that he spends on this roster he will be as invaluable to our young and developing safeties as Madison is to our CBs.

 

Not all signings are about bringing in a superstar athlete whose talent is all you want from them. The Giants have shown over the past couple of seasons that they value veterans who can contribute on and off the field and from all signs this is just another one of those situations.

[BlueInCanada]

I agree with Lubeck, it's not like we expect this guy to be pro bowl for the next couple of seasons. He is a good player with near identical stats to Wilson, who after his contract is up the younger guys who have been behind him and fed off his experiance can step in and fill the role.

 

I really don't see the problem.

 

[xxi-xxv]

Brent Alexander has never been or will even be remembered as anywhere near the player that Sammy Knight has been

 

As for this idea this is a bad signing, who did anyone want? Gibril was priced WAY WAY WAY too high and quite frankly is nothing more than a middle of the road safety, who now by the way makes Bob Sanders, Troy Polumolu and Roy Williams money. He is not even close to any of those guys and that includes the overrated Williams, yes Roy Williams, despite being OVERRATED is STILL BETTER than Gibril Wilson.

 

In fact I take a 34 year old Brian Dawkins over Wilson at this point.

 

Anyone that paid attention saw the speed and athleticsm that Michael Johnson brought to the table in 2007. With more seasoning and study the coaches feel he will be a fixture in that secondary for the future. In the meantime Knight can hold the position and probably have no less an impact than Gibril Wilson did, at 1/4 the cost.

 

The same people bitching now are the ones come next year would be bitching when we have NO MONEY to sign a Snee or a Jacobs to a new deal that we overpaid for mediocre talent like Wilson.

[BleedinBlue]

Excellent points. Remember, the Giants had only ONE player that went to the pro-bowl. The Vikings had 7 go to the pro-bowl....hell, the Cowboys had 13 pro-bowlers this year. Yet, because of TEAMWORK and sheer guts and determination, the Giants took home the whole enchilada.

 

We have a very young team as it is. But the mixture of veterans in with the kiddie corps, was a significant help.

 

Also, the Giants are smart enough to look at things LONG TERM and realize that shooting their wad year after year on expensive free agents only fucks the team in the years to come. Therefore, it's all about combining reasonably priced veterans, with corps players and youngsters. It's all about value and long term thinking.

 

And I would be willing to bet anyone on this board, that Knight is going to work out just fine. One of the stories that has slipped through the cracks and not been published to death, is that Jacksonville wanted Knight to stay and was willing to give him the same offer and even more up front. Jacksonville didn't cut him....he walked...and he wanted to play for the Giants because he says the Giants are all about defense and he is a defense loving freak of nature. Do not count Knight out. He's a very good pickup and we're damn lucky to have gotten him when you consider our (and all NFL teams) options.