KiLLaKyLe Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Check out this passage of the NFP Sunday Blitz (http://www.nationalf...Blitz-4049.html) Things I Didn’t Used To Know *It is expected that free agent Osi Umenyiora will not return to the Giants' date=' so the team is planning to compensate by using its remaining pass rushers differently. Instead of playing a rotation in which three men split the snaps pretty evenly as the Giants did last year, I’m told Jason Pierre Paul and Justin Tuck will get the majority of the snaps. And Giants coaches don’t want the ends flipping sides as much. The early talk out of the Timex Performance Center is Pierre Paul may become a full-time left end, with Tuck concentrating on the right side. [/quote'] Interesting idea. I do think JPP fits the role of a LE more than a RE, but I don't know how Tuck will do at RE. I can't recall him ever lining up there and making a splash play. One thing will be certain though, and that is our DEs are very good at stopping the run. I think it's a move that will ultimately leading the Giants to drafting Tank Carradine in the 1st, who would be a perfect complement at RE to JPP for the future. There's very little chance he lasts until the 2nd round, but I think by the time draft day comes he will be securely in the top 25. What do you guys think about the changes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osi724dasack Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 That makes sense. I'm down for that. I kind of like JPP rushing a QBs blind side though to out that fear into them. But JPP would eat RTs alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Check out this passage of the NFP Sunday Blitz (http://www.nationalf...Blitz-4049.html) Interesting idea. I do think JPP fits the role of a LE more than a RE, but I don't know how Tuck will do at RE. I can't recall him ever lining up there and making a splash play. One thing will be certain though, and that is our DEs are very good at stopping the run. I think it's a move that will ultimately leading the Giants to drafting Tank Carradine in the 1st, who would be a perfect complement at RE to JPP for the future. There's very little chance he lasts until the 2nd round, but I think by the time draft day comes he will be securely in the top 25. What do you guys think about the changes? Are you saying they will have to be good at stopping the run or they already are? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Are you saying they will have to be good at stopping the run or they already are? Yeah, they fell off in that respect last year, IMO. Seems the team is loading up on run stuffers like Dan Connor and even the guy Mundy is a run stuffing safety. But it was the big play through the air that killed us last year and inability to get off the field on 3rd down....IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiLLaKyLe Posted March 18, 2013 Author Share Posted March 18, 2013 Are you saying they will have to be good at stopping the run or they already are? I'm saying that they already are. JPP had a great year stopping the run, although Tuck wasn't as effective. I think the switch will help Tuck because teams usually run behind their RG and RT, which will now be running towards JPP. Yeah, they fell off in that respect last year, IMO. Seems the team is loading up on run stuffers like Dan Connor and even the guy Mundy is a run stuffing safety. But it was the big play through the air that killed us last year and inability to get off the field on 3rd down....IMO I think Connor was picked up to help stop runs through the middle, which this team had trouble containing last year. I think Mundy was just signed for depth purposes, and hopefully to stop that damn read-option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I think speed was and continues to be the Giants biggest enemy. We're a slow team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Ugh.... JPP is clearly better at the RE position. The difference is night & day really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigblue25 Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Check out this passage of the NFP Sunday Blitz (http://www.nationalf...Blitz-4049.html) Interesting idea. I do think JPP fits the role of a LE more than a RE, but I don't know how Tuck will do at RE. I can't recall him ever lining up there and making a splash play. One thing will be certain though, and that is our DEs are very good at stopping the run. I think it's a move that will ultimately leading the Giants to drafting Tank Carradine in the 1st, who would be a perfect complement at RE to JPP for the future. There's very little chance he lasts until the 2nd round, but I think by the time draft day comes he will be securely in the top 25. What do you guys think about the changes? I think Carradine is great, but it would be a risk to take him at 19. My thing with a first round DE, is the class is deep, where we could get a decent one in later rounds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Ugh.... JPP is clearly better at the RE position. The difference is night & day really. Exactly. Typical Giants logic. Coaches: Where have JPP and Tuck had their most success? Analysts: Well, for JPP it's been on the right at DE, for Tuck on the left. Coaches: I see... you know what? Let's do the exact opposite! We'll show 'em how smart and unpredictable we are! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Case in point: we saw JPP numerous times lined up at DT last year. Name one time he made a play from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Ugh.... JPP is clearly better at the RE position. The difference is night & day really. I disagree, he looks like a natural RDE to me. I think he would have been there sooner, but Tuck is also a more natural RDE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Unless Tuck beats his 1 on 1, it really doesn't matter. Teams will line up their TE or send their RB to chip JPP on the left side (the offense's right), which will severely hamper JPP's pass rush. If Tuck doesn't get it done on the other side, or if the DTs don't push the pocket from the middle, switching from one side to the other doesn't seem to matter much to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Unless Tuck beats his 1 on 1, it really doesn't matter. Teams will line up their TE or send their RB to chip JPP on the left side (the offense's right), which will severely hamper JPP's pass rush. If Tuck doesn't get it done on the other side, or if the DTs don't push the pocket from the middle, switching from one side to the other doesn't seem to matter much to me. True but I think the point of this thread is that Tuck was playing.. out of position... kindda... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 True but I think the point of this thread is that Tuck was playing.. out of position... kindda... When Tuck started getting noticed, he was playing a lot of DT with Strahan next to him at left end commanding the double team and Osi at right end. Tuck was able to beat the guard easily. We all thought Tuck would slide right into the Strahan role, commanding the double team so that the next young stud would be able to step in. Tuck does not demand the double team consistently enough and as a result, the whole thing kinda fell apart. Bottom line is that if Tuck doesn't get his shit together, given the defense hinges on him in a big way, it could be another tough season stopping the run/rushing the passer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 When Tuck started getting noticed, he was playing a lot of DT with Strahan next to him at left end commanding the double team and Osi at right end. Tuck was able to beat the guard easily. We all thought Tuck would slide right into the Strahan role, commanding the double team so that the next young stud would be able to step in. Tuck does not demand the double team consistently enough and as a result, the whole thing kinda fell apart. Bottom line is that if Tuck doesn't get his shit together, given the defense hinges on him in a big way, it could be another tough season stopping the run/rushing the passer. Agreed. That's why I look at this season as a make or break for Tuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 You probably want your best run stopping DE on the left side, JPP is probably our best run stopping DE, this would make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I really want Kiwi back at the line... I don't know how this would work out but he seems far more productive at the line than at LB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I really want Kiwi back at the line... I don't know how this would work out but he seems far more productive at the line than at LB No way. Put him at DT, where he's never made a play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 No way. Put him at DT, where he's never made a play. lol, you're on a roll, Seph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I'm tellin ya, go watch tape of JPP right side vs left. He's hands down a better pass rusher from the right. I wonder if there are stats of his sack #'s right side vs left. He does poorly pass rushing wise when on the left side. The idea of moving JPP to the left and Tuck to the right seems to be based more around Tuck's durability. Tuck probably can't handle the grind of the LDE position anymore, since as pointed out in this thread, LDE's need to do more in run support. Still, I think you play to your strengths. JPP in the RDE position can generate 12-15+ sacks per year. Tuck is past his prime - replace him or rotate him at LDE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Ugh.... JPP is clearly better at the RE position. The difference is night & day really. I agree...people forget that JPP has very little high level football experience other than with the Giants so there will be a learning curve as he gets up to speed. JPP is more of a hammer than a crowbar....a hammer can hammer a nail and pull it up...so can a crow bar...but less efficiently than a hammer...but a crow bar is better at picking up nails and other items...plus it can be used as a lever to pry things open...this smacks of turning JPP into a crowbar....more Tucks speed IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Exactly. Typical Giants logic. Coaches: Where have JPP and Tuck had their most success? Analysts: Well, for JPP it's been on the right at DE, for Tuck on the left. Coaches: I see... you know what? Let's do the exact opposite! We'll show 'em how smart and unpredictable we are! Bump... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 When Tuck started getting noticed, he was playing a lot of DT with Strahan next to him at left end commanding the double team and Osi at right end. Tuck was able to beat the guard easily. We all thought Tuck would slide right into the Strahan role, commanding the double team so that the next young stud would be able to step in. Tuck does not demand the double team consistently enough and as a result, the whole thing kinda fell apart. Bottom line is that if Tuck doesn't get his shit together, given the defense hinges on him in a big way, it could be another tough season stopping the run/rushing the passer. Agree...as Fringe and I say....every Giants lineman going back to 93' owes Strahan a part of their paychecks because he had consistently occupied two-three guys on just about every play and was still All Pro (soon to be Hall of Famer). Tuck struggles against anything other than one on one...especially after he was injured in a cheap shot play by that Flozell Faggot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 I'm tellin ya, go watch tape of JPP right side vs left. He's hands down a better pass rusher from the right. I wonder if there are stats of his sack #'s right side vs left. He does poorly pass rushing wise when on the left side. The idea of moving JPP to the left and Tuck to the right seems to be based more around Tuck's durability. Tuck probably can't handle the grind of the LDE position anymore, since as pointed out in this thread, LDE's need to do more in run support. Still, I think you play to your strengths. JPP in the RDE position can generate 12-15+ sacks per year. Tuck is past his prime - replace him or rotate him at LDE. Exactly...don't turn your hammer into a crow bar... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blindgreed1 Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 I'm saying that they already are. JPP had a great year stopping the run, although Tuck wasn't as effective. I think the switch will help Tuck because teams usually run behind their RG and RT, which will now be running towards JPP. I don't recall Tuck playing last year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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