Ok I hate to say this

[Nas]

Now you see, if everyone had just listened to the dog for the last 7 years, and accepted the fact that he is a solid starting QB who is very inconsistent, then outings like this would not seem as frustrating. the man was elevated to something he is not (at least to date) for several reasons. one, his name. two, the fact that so much was given up for him on draft day. and three, the defense-lead super bowl run in year 4, in which eli played solid football and for the only stretch of his career he played consistent, almost mistake free football.

 

now he is 7 years in, and by all accounts should be clicking on all cylinders. can he still be more than he has shown? sure. but at this stage in his career, the mistakes and lapses in judgement should not still be present, unless of course he is nothing more than a solid QB. plus he had better opportunities than most QBs coming into the league, which gives one cause for concern that he is at the stage in his development that he is. he has a very good defense for a majority of his 7 years. he has had a very good o-line for a majority of his 7 years. he has had the following weapons throughout his career: burress, shockey, toomer, barber, bradshaw, nicks, manningham, boss, smith. he has had the same coach and OC for all 7 years.

 

manning is a solid option as a starting QB. but what you saw the other night is what you have always gotten and will most likely always get from him. inconsistent performances that at times make you scratch your head and say, really, this is what we have, and at times makes you say, hey, we got a very good QB with a lot of potential...unfortunately, when you start getting into years 7 and beyond, the potential should be realized by then...

 

We're in agreement. I always liked hearing opinions of non-Giant fans because our own vision of our players tend to be biased... besides you just stated that Eli is a solid option as a starting QB and that's settles it.. He's the best we got.

 

Having said that... with the game on the line... minutes to go in the 4th quarter would I give the ball to Eli, Vick, or Romo? Eli it is

[Storm]

Thats the problem with the media and casual fans. They dont look at the game as a whole, just bits of it. Yes, Eli threw 2 picks, only 1 of which was really his fault. But he threw for 200 yds and alot of those passes looked crisp. Yes, he threw some lame ducks too, but its early and its preseason. We all know if this teams gonna hit steam, it aint in preseason, its later in the yr.

 

Now, with that said, Im not ready to give up on Eli, but he doesnt have much more time to tighten it all up. If he doesnt show improvement this yr, ill start waving the surrender flag.

 

Any time a quarterback throws a football that is intercepted, it's his fault. I don't care if it bounced off a wide receivers hands and into the opponents, the quarterback most likely could have made a more on target throw.

[BadEgg]

Now you see, if everyone had just listened to the dog for the last 7 years, and accepted the fact that he is a solid starting QB who is very inconsistent, then outings like this would not seem as frustrating. the man was elevated to something he is not (at least to date) for several reasons. one, his name. two, the fact that so much was given up for him on draft day. and three, the defense-lead super bowl run in year 4, in which eli played solid football and for the only stretch of his career he played consistent, almost mistake free football.

 

now he is 7 years in, and by all accounts should be clicking on all cylinders. can he still be more than he has shown? sure. but at this stage in his career, the mistakes and lapses in judgement should not still be present, unless of course he is nothing more than a solid QB. plus he had better opportunities than most QBs coming into the league, which gives one cause for concern that he is at the stage in his development that he is. he has a very good defense for a majority of his 7 years. he has had a very good o-line for a majority of his 7 years. he has had the following weapons throughout his career: burress, shockey, toomer, barber, bradshaw, nicks, manningham, boss, smith. he has had the same coach and OC for all 7 years.

 

manning is a solid option as a starting QB. but what you saw the other night is what you have always gotten and will most likely always get from him. inconsistent performances that at times make you scratch your head and say, really, this is what we have, and at times makes you say, hey, we got a very good QB with a lot of potential...unfortunately, when you start getting into years 7 and beyond, the potential should be realized by then...

 

 

Manning is average. It will be evident this year. This year because they have lost offensive weapons they need a QB who is a leader and who can carry a team. He will fail. The Superbowl run was driven by defense. When Spagnola left it was over. At the end of the season, the debate will be whether its fair for TC to lose his job because the QB is inaccurate and makes poor throws. And we all know the end result of that battle.

[MakeMeSomeFoodHo]

I hope the Dolphins just throw the season so they can grab Luck with the first pick next year. If I were a Giants fan, Id be wishing the same.

[Mr. P]

Eli will be fine.

[fishgutmartyr]

This is easily one of the stupidest fucking threads I've ever read in my entire life.

 

 

Now you see, if everyone had just listened to the dog for the last 7 years, and accepted the fact that he is a solid starting QB who is very inconsistent, then outings like this would not seem as frustrating. the man was elevated to something he is not (at least to date) for several reasons. one, his name. two, the fact that so much was given up for him on draft day. and three, the defense-lead super bowl run in year 4, in which eli played solid football and for the only stretch of his career he played consistent, almost mistake free football.

 

now he is 7 years in, and by all accounts should be clicking on all cylinders. can he still be more than he has shown? sure. but at this stage in his career, the mistakes and lapses in judgement should not still be present, unless of course he is nothing more than a solid QB. plus he had better opportunities than most QBs coming into the league, which gives one cause for concern that he is at the stage in his development that he is. he has a very good defense for a majority of his 7 years. he has had a very good o-line for a majority of his 7 years. he has had the following weapons throughout his career: burress, shockey, toomer, barber, bradshaw, nicks, manningham, boss, smith. he has had the same coach and OC for all 7 years.

 

manning is a solid option as a starting QB. but what you saw the other night is what you have always gotten and will most likely always get from him. inconsistent performances that at times make you scratch your head and say, really, this is what we have, and at times makes you say, hey, we got a very good QB with a lot of potential...unfortunately, when you start getting into years 7 and beyond, the potential should be realized by then...

 

 

Manning is average. It will be evident this year. This year because they have lost offensive weapons they need a QB who is a leader and who can carry a team. He will fail. The Superbowl run was driven by defense. When Spagnola left it was over. At the end of the season, the debate will be whether its fair for TC to lose his job because the QB is inaccurate and makes poor throws. And we all know the end result of that battle.

 

 

Now it's the stupidest thread you've ever read, Golfing. Aside from fans freaking out over a preseason game and going after the wrong aspect for the reason we lost, we now have two jokers using that same preseason game to vindicate nonsense.

 

Two INTs isn't exactly good news, but considering Manning's history in preseason, it isn't all that surprising, either. I don't recall him ever having a particularly good preseason. But just for the sake of argument, how many points did the Jets rack up due to those turnovers? Oh, yeah--zero.

 

The Jets did manage to score a touchdown after piss-poor kick coverage. And they did stop a drive after Jacobs was ejected just before we could have used him on short yardage. And more points were left on the field after a botched field goal. So it was clearly the two INTs that cost us the game.

 

Good Lord. Shockey and Toomer weapons? In 2006 and 2007? Toomer was able to revive his career a bit, after Burress started taking the double coverage, but I'd hardly call him a player opponents feared. Shockey was a mess on and off the field, and never played a full season before he drifted off into obscurity. Oh, sorry, got himself traded.

 

The same OC for 7 years? It's like Hufnagle never existed...which, on reflection, wouldn't have been so bad.

 

This offense, since 2008, has been the most potent Giants offense I've ever seen. Blemishes and all. It has gone from a one-dimensional attack in which Barber accounted for 60% of all yardage to one where they are a threat on the ground and in the air. And only two players on the whole damn squad have been there for the entire time in the same positions since 2004: Manning and Snee.

 

If anything gets Coughlin fired, it's this slavish devotion to Quinn. But I wouldn't get my hopes up.

[Treehugger]

hahaha...Nas forgets that the Texans drafted Andre Johnson the year after they drafted David Carr.

 

LMAO at "Carr had no weapons"

 

Seriously Nas, please just stay in the politics section...and maybe when a Giant pulls a hamstring..you can tell us how he can fix it.

Carr had no OLine.

[BIGBLUE01]

Now you see, if everyone had just listened to the dog for the last 7 years, and accepted the fact that he is a solid starting QB who is very inconsistent, then outings like this would not seem as frustrating. the man was elevated to something he is not (at least to date) for several reasons. one, his name. two, the fact that so much was given up for him on draft day. and three, the defense-lead super bowl run in year 4, in which eli played solid football and for the only stretch of his career he played consistent, almost mistake free football.

 

now he is 7 years in, and by all accounts should be clicking on all cylinders. can he still be more than he has shown? sure. but at this stage in his career, the mistakes and lapses in judgement should not still be present, unless of course he is nothing more than a solid QB. plus he had better opportunities than most QBs coming into the league, which gives one cause for concern that he is at the stage in his development that he is. he has a very good defense for a majority of his 7 years. he has had a very good o-line for a majority of his 7 years. he has had the following weapons throughout his career: burress, shockey, toomer, barber, bradshaw, nicks, manningham, boss, smith. he has had the same coach and OC for all 7 years.

 

manning is a solid option as a starting QB. but what you saw the other night is what you have always gotten and will most likely always get from him. inconsistent performances that at times make you scratch your head and say, really, this is what we have, and at times makes you say, hey, we got a very good QB with a lot of potential...unfortunately, when you start getting into years 7 and beyond, the potential should be realized by then...

 

 

OK, I now believe dog and egg are 2 different people.

 

I hate to say it, but I somewhat believe this now. Ive stuck up for Eli forever, and still think he can do it, but 7 years in he should be clicking on all cylinders.

 

Badeggs reply on the other hand......just more crap.

[BIGBLUE01]

Any time a quarterback throws a football that is intercepted, it's his fault. I don't care if it bounced off a wide receivers hands and into the opponents, the quarterback most likely could have made a more on target throw.

 

No way Storm. The 1st INT last night I initially thought it was the receivers fault. But after watching it again, it was Elis. Too high a throw, regardless if it the WR hands. But if a throw is spot on and the WR tips it, how in the world could that be the QBs fault?

[Steitzenhaus]

OK, I now believe dog and egg are 2 different people.

 

I hate to say it, but I somewhat believe this now. Ive stuck up for Eli forever, and still think he can do it, but 7 years in he should be clicking on all cylinders.

 

Badeggs reply on the other hand......just more crap.

 

 

Seven years into a career you should have figured just about everything out. To a degree unfortunately, what you see is what you get. Eli has proven you can win with him and every year since becoming a full time starter he hasn't had a record below .500. He's also out there every week. There is something to be said for that. The interceptions are probably something we are going to have to accept and live with.......just not 25 of them. Hell, cut it down to one a game and that's worth at least one win. Now we just need to see some players like Pierre-Paul, Hixon/Cruz, and Ross step up into their new roles with added responsibility and this team might be ok.

[BlueInCanada]

It's interesting to think that the Giants literally lie on the brink of 5-11 or 11-5 and it's all up to Eli.

 

If Eli continues to play how he has the Giants will fall to a losing record there is no doubt about it. We do not have the veteran leadership on the team to over come the offensive woes. The defense can do it's job all it wants but if Eli is turning the ball over 20 times plus in another season then the Giants wont make the playoffs. However if Eli snaps into a grove and steps his play up the Giants can easily roll over most teams in the league and finish with a winning record and a play off birth.

 

It's odd to think as well of the consequences of Eli's play.

 

If Eli plays bad and the Giants fail to make the playoffs, does that mean TC is done with? As well do the Giants start looking at other QB options if Eli does regress? Do free agent players leave the Giants since they are no longer contenders? What about Fewell? Does he get a shot at head coach if we go threw a losing season.

 

Like I said it's odd to think the Giants might become a team like the St.Louis or Miami, not really in contention but trying to get back on track.

 

And it all depends on Eli.

[Steitzenhaus]

It's interesting to think that the Giants literally lie on the brink of 5-11 or 11-5 and it's all up to Eli.

 

If Eli continues to play how he has the Giants will fall to a losing record there is no doubt about it. We do not have the veteran leadership on the team to over come the offensive woes. The defense can do it's job all it wants but if Eli is turning the ball over 20 times plus in another season then the Giants wont make the playoffs. However if Eli snaps into a grove and steps his play up the Giants can easily roll over most teams in the league and finish with a winning record and a play off birth.

 

It's odd to think as well of the consequences of Eli's play.

 

If Eli plays bad and the Giants fail to make the playoffs, does that mean TC is done with? As well do the Giants start looking at other QB options if Eli does regress? Do free agent players leave the Giants since they are no longer contenders? What about Fewell? Does he get a shot at head coach if we go threw a losing season.

 

Like I said it's odd to think the Giants might become a team like the St.Louis or Miami, not really in contention but trying to get back on track.

 

And it all depends on Eli.

 

I wouldn't lump St Louis into that group. It's only one year, but Bradford showed plenty of good things in his rookie year. I think he's a keeper. But you're right the Giants season hinges on Eli. I don't think the Giants even begin looking at other qb options before they give a new coach a shot to right the ship. Eli has a 100 million dollar contract. On talent and performance, he isn't deserving of that contract. The Giants paid him for arguably the greatest playoff run in recent sports memory. Regardless, it's a huge commitment in a league with huge salary cap penalties and implications so he's pretty much here to stay barring a catastrophe. I think he's an intelligent guy. However, his recent football iq in the heat of the moment has pretty much sucked. That has to change.

[BlueInCanada]

I wouldn't lump St Louis into that group. It's only one year, but Bradford showed plenty of good things in his rookie year. I think he's a keeper. But you're right the Giants season hinges on Eli. I don't think the Giants even begin looking at other qb options before they give a new coach a shot to right the ship. Eli has a 100 million dollar contract. On talent and performance, he isn't deserving of that contract. The Giants paid him for arguably the greatest playoff run in recent sports memory. Regardless, it's a huge commitment in a league with huge salary cap penalties and implications so he's pretty much here to stay barring a catastrophe. I think he's an intelligent guy. However, his recent football iq in the heat of the moment has pretty much sucked. That has to change.

 

I'm not saying the Giants would bring in a new QB to start day one of next season but what I mean is if Eli plays another season where he arguably hasnt improved, do the Giants start to consider some sort of option at QB. Bring in a veteran QB just in case he doesnt improve? Do they draft someone to start learning behind Eli ala Aaron Rodgers and Lord Favre in Green Bay.

 

Like I said though it all depends on Eli play.

[Steitzenhaus]

I understand. Let's hope he gets it together. Despite what has happened, that win in Glendale was worth every penny.

[Storm]

No way Storm. The 1st INT last night I initially thought it was the receivers fault. But after watching it again, it was Elis. Too high a throw, regardless if it the WR hands. But if a throw is spot on and the WR tips it, how in the world could that be the QBs fault?

 

The majority of interceptions last season that "bounced off receivers hands" were on inaccurate balls thrown by Manning, high or behind the wide receiver normally. You take out the ones Manning himself should be faulted for and last year's interception statistic would be more average. Besides, every quarterback has to deal with a few deflected interceptions.

 

I'm pretty sure both were Manning's fault last night, though.

[BIGBLUE01]

The majority of interceptions last season that "bounced off receivers hands" were on inaccurate balls thrown by Manning, high or behind the wide receiver normally. You take out the ones Manning himself should be faulted for and last year's interception statistic would be more average. Besides, every quarterback has to deal with a few deflected interceptions.

 

I'm pretty sure both were Manning's fault last night, though.

 

Yeah, I watched it again, and they both were without a doubt.

 

But last yr, most of the tipped passes were perfectly throw. I cant fault Eli for that.

[Guest StrahansGap]

I said it last year and I'll say it again today, even though a lot of people on this board think the money issue isn't an issue at all. I NEVER liked Eli's contract. I can live with the trades with San Diego and whatever else we did to get him, but I cannot live with that salary of his. He is, was and always will be a $7-8 million per year quarterback. Not $19, not $18, not $17.....NOT EVER!!! And we wonder why we have no linebackers or tight ends.

[Nas]

Seven years into a career you should have figured just about everything out. To a degree unfortunately, what you see is what you get. Eli has proven you can win with him and every year since becoming a full time starter he hasn't had a record below .500. He's also out there every week. There is something to be said for that. The interceptions are probably something we are going to have to accept and live with.......just not 25 of them. Hell, cut it down to one a game and that's worth at least one win. Now we just need to see some players like Pierre-Paul, Hixon/Cruz, and Ross step up into their new roles with added responsibility and this team might be ok.

 

I like how you think. And it helps the Giants got a solid run game... Jacobs is running strong and Bradsaw looked extremely impressive.

[osi724dasack]

Eli is overpaid, but Carr is no where near as good ad Eli.

 

Just make it fucking stop already!!!

[ksm7]

Now it's the stupidest thread you've ever read, Golfing. Aside from fans freaking out over a preseason game and going after the wrong aspect for the reason we lost, we now have two jokers using that same preseason game to vindicate nonsense.

 

Two INTs isn't exactly good news, but considering Manning's history in preseason, it isn't all that surprising, either. I don't recall him ever having a particularly good preseason. But just for the sake of argument, how many points did the Jets rack up due to those turnovers? Oh, yeah--zero.

 

The Jets did manage to score a touchdown after piss-poor kick coverage. And they did stop a drive after Jacobs was ejected just before we could have used him on short yardage. And more points were left on the field after a botched field goal. So it was clearly the two INTs that cost us the game.

 

Good Lord. Shockey and Toomer weapons? In 2006 and 2007? Toomer was able to revive his career a bit, after Burress started taking the double coverage, but I'd hardly call him a player opponents feared. Shockey was a mess on and off the field, and never played a full season before he drifted off into obscurity. Oh, sorry, got himself traded.

 

The same OC for 7 years? It's like Hufnagle never existed...which, on reflection, wouldn't have been so bad.

 

This offense, since 2008, has been the most potent Giants offense I've ever seen. Blemishes and all. It has gone from a one-dimensional attack in which Barber accounted for 60% of all yardage to one where they are a threat on the ground and in the air. And only two players on the whole damn squad have been there for the entire time in the same positions since 2004: Manning and Snee.

 

If anything gets Coughlin fired, it's this slavish devotion to Quinn. But I wouldn't get my hopes up.

 

the dog isn't using the preseason game to "vindicate nonesense," but rather his entire career, using this latest example as a microcosm of what he is. and just for fun, shockey as a tight end caught 60 or more passes in eli's first three years as a starter (pretty solid numbers for a TE), and yes, was considered a weopon that teams had to account for. Toomer had 2 of the 3 years during that time period of 50 plus catches as the number 2 option, a very solid number 2 relative to what most teams have...pretty good weapon to have at your disposal. well, Huffnagle was the OC for two years yes, but Gilbride was eli's QB coach in that time before taking on the OC position, so unlike most QBs in the league, eli has benefited from one constant coach during his entire career (a coach mind you with a reputation of developing QBs effectively...). again, he had a much better situation than most QBs starting out. By year 7 he should be further along if you buy into his reputation...

[fishgutmartyr]

the dog isn't using the preseason game to "vindicate nonesense," but rather his entire career, using this latest example as a microcosm of what he is. and just for fun, shockey as a tight end caught 60 or more passes in eli's first three years as a starter (pretty solid numbers for a TE), and yes, was considered a weopon that teams had to account for. Toomer had 2 of the 3 years during that time period of 50 plus catches as the number 2 option, a very solid number 2 relative to what most teams have...pretty good weapon to have at your disposal. well, Huffnagle was the OC for two years yes, but Gilbride was eli's QB coach in that time before taking on the OC position, so unlike most QBs in the league, eli has benefited from one constant coach during his entire career (a coach mind you with a reputation of developing QBs effectively...). again, he had a much better situation than most QBs starting out. By year 7 he should be further along if you buy into his reputation...

1) Manning has had THREE QB coaches: Gilbride, Palmer, and Sullivan. OC is not the same as QB coach--and he's had two of those. So your argument is simply false regarding this.

2) Ernest Gray and Chris Calloway had multiple 50 reception seasons as well. Was any DC quaking when their names were mentioned? Thought not. I'm not saying Toomer was bad by a long shot: but let's not make Burress/Toomer into Bruce/Holt.

3) Shockey had more receiving TDs with Manning than any other QB. His 2nd best season as far as yardage was in 2005. Brees, the better QB, got almost nothing out of him. Collins, got his best single season out of him, and that's it. I wonder if he regrets waving his arms around like an asshole after an incomplete pass; because it looks like Manning gave him his best years.

 

But none of this really changes the reality that you are trying to use a preseason game as a microcosm of a career. It's not.

[JackStroud]

Eli throws a high ball when he does set his feet and step in to it

 

When hes panicked and going backwards he throws a volley ball

[RandolphScott]

Manning is average. It will be evident this year. This year because they have lost offensive weapons they need a QB who is a leader and who can carry a team. He will fail. The Superbowl run was driven by defense. When Spagnola left it was over. At the end of the season, the debate will be whether its fair for TC to lose his job because the QB is inaccurate and makes poor throws. And we all know the end result of that battle.

 

Both Nas and BadEgger are bringing out the LULZ.

 

[RandolphScott]

Eli Manning sucks. I think we should have kept Buzz Lightyear instead.

[BlueInCanada]

Atleast I don't come off like Nas in this thread.

 

All I said if Eli needed to step up his game this year and look at that he did.

 

We arnt in the same wagon as St.Louis or Miami lol