Jerry's guys aren't helping out Ernie's guys

[JMFP]

It's been 7 drafts, Jerry......where's our future?

[BronxRik]

According to you, it's in Chi Town.

[Storm]

Half this draft class was inactive today. Our future is resting on a 5th round tweener safety who takes horrible, horrible angles at ball carriers, a DE who doesn't know how to stay onsides, and a DT, RB. and QB who will never, ever dress for the Giants this season.

 

I will go on record right now that Pugh is the only member of this draft class who will be on the team in 5 years.

[JMFP]

According to you, it's in Chi Town.

 

Golf will get mad if I mention that.

[Sephiroth]

It's been 7 drafts, Jerry......where's our future?

Somewhere in the top 5 of next year's draft.

[Bigblue25]

I said in the game thread, Reese gets more of a pass then he should

[jranieli]

I said in the game thread, Reese gets more of a pass then he should

I agree, the first super bowl win was Acorsi's team. The second, I don't know but still, many players that EA drafted.

[Herc]

mvp of that second superbowl run is nicks and that's a jerry guy

 

he's wiffed plenty though. he's no genius

[jranieli]

They all wiff though, but there has to be blame. He had some good drafts, Bradshaw was a good find. There are just holes that should have been filled, free agency could have solved some of that.

[Bigblue25]

It's not just whiffing on the draft, it's the cap hell we are in. David Baas is an example.

[Herc]

yeah i don't think anyone on this board liked the baas signing at the time either which is rare

[Sephiroth]

I have to admit, I'm starting to question his genius as well. Sure, he knows when to get rid of the Luke Petitgouts and Jeremy Shockeys, but who has he given us?

 

Nobody from his first draft is still on the team, and T2 is the only guy left from his second class. Then we've gotten Nicks, Beatty, and Brown from his third one, Joseph and Pierre-Paul from his second, Jacquian Williams, the Mook, Jernigan, and Brewer from the next one, and the guys from the last two, none of whom have really knocked anyone's socks off, unless you believe the hype of Reuben Randle and David Wilson.

 

In the meantime, his free agent guys have been anywhere from serviceable (Michael Boley) to flat-out useless (Louis Murphy).

 

The jury's still out on Reese.

[Storm]

They all wiff though, but there has to be blame. He had some good drafts, Bradshaw was a good find. There are just holes that should have been filled, free agency could have solved some of that.

 

 

Instead of signing 3 (!) declining, 30+ year old DTs, and hmmm....well, raiding the fucking RAIDERS (!) offense and putting mediocre, middle of the road talent on this team (Murphy, Meyers), he should have been looking at the offensive line and linebackers and adding 1 or 2 key ingredients to shore those positions up. Fuck Dan Connor, fuck Aaron Curry. Fuck DEPTH, especially since even though we technically worked to provide depth at least on the D-Line we still start aging (Tuck) and ineffective (JPP) talent on the defensive line with little to no rotation as it is. It seems to me that GM and coaching philosophy are at an impasse and Coughlin and co. can't figure out what to do with these guys.

[TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt]

Rain's is the post I agree with most. It seems that the front office and coaching staff is evident. We have Nicks a Reese pick who doesn't get a sniff of the ball till garbage time; Randle a less capable player but obviously a coaching favorite gets the touches...not catches. Lastly in terms of the defense...I believe they have really gone away from the line rotation that kept guys relatively fresh. Coach Out of Gas and yes St. Gibride have been found out. Their game plans are rudimentary at best with no ability to adjust.

[fishgutmartyr]

Damn you Reese for not checking out Chad Jone's driving record! Or allowing Smith's, Phillips', Ballard's, Brown's, Sintim's, Goff's Koet's, and Thomas's knees to get blown out! How dare you draft guys that get concussions!! JPP--my god, man! His back! Fucking Bradshaw and his foot--YOU SHOULD HAVE KNOWN!!! HOW THE FUCK DID YOU NOT KNOW ANDRE BROWN'S ACHILLE'S TENDON WAS GOING TO RUPTURE IN HIS FIRST PRESEASON--or for that matter, that he was going to break his leg this year!?!

 

And your draft picks decline with age, too?!? WTF is that!?!?!?

 

Your free agents, Reese--holy shit! You constantly get guys that their original teams think aren't as good as other players they have, or feel are overpriced! This bullshit has to stop.

 

BTW, Ernie's guys are Tuck, Webster, Snee, Diehl, Kiwi--you know, the guys you folks want cut because they stink now, or cost too much...Yeah, Eli, too--and his $20 million cap hit.

 

Make up your minds: do you want to re-sign our players and have them decline under contract (which they inevitably will), or let them go at around their peak, and miss their ability? That way, we can sign other team's players and pay a higher price for equivalent skill sets.

 

I'm not saying Reese is perfect by any stretch (the proof is in the record), but it's not like everything worked out as planned, either.

[Sephiroth]

Damn you Reese for not checking out Chad Jone's driving record! Or allowing Smith's, Phillips', Ballard's, Brown's, Sintim's, Goff's Koet's, and Thomas's knees to get blown out! How dare you draft guys that get concussions!! JPP--my god, man! His back! Fucking Bradshaw and his foot--YOU SHOULD HAVE KNOWN!!! HOW THE FUCK DID YOU NOT KNOW ANDRE BROWN'S ACHILLE'S TENDON WAS GOING TO RUPTURE IN HIS FIRST PRESEASON--or for that matter, that he was going to break his leg this year!?!

 

And your draft picks decline with age, too?!? WTF is that!?!?!?

 

Your free agents, Reese--holy shit! You constantly get guys that their original teams think aren't as good as other players they have, or feel are overpriced! This bullshit has to stop.

 

BTW, Ernie's guys are Tuck, Webster, Snee, Diehl, Kiwi--you know, the guys you folks want cut because they stink now, or cost too much...Yeah, Eli, too--and his $20 million cap hit.

 

Make up your minds: do you want to re-sign our players and have them decline under contract (which they inevitably will), or let them go at around their peak, and miss their ability? That way, we can sign other team's players and pay a higher price for equivalent skill sets.

 

I'm not saying Reese is perfect by any stretch (the proof is in the record), but it's not like everything worked out as planned, either.

 

What I'd like is:

 

1. Two starting DEs, and a capable backup.

 

2. Two starting DTs, and a capable backup.

 

3. NFL caliber linebackers and offensive linemen.

 

This whole "let's spend our money on eight DL guys" when you can only have four on the field at once isn't working.

[JMFP]

Damn you Reese for not checking out Chad Jone's driving record! Or allowing Smith's, Phillips', Ballard's, Brown's, Sintim's, Goff's Koet's, and Thomas's knees to get blown out! How dare you draft guys that get concussions!! JPP--my god, man! His back! Fucking Bradshaw and his foot--YOU SHOULD HAVE KNOWN!!! HOW THE FUCK DID YOU NOT KNOW ANDRE BROWN'S ACHILLE'S TENDON WAS GOING TO RUPTURE IN HIS FIRST PRESEASON--or for that matter, that he was going to break his leg this year!?!

 

And your draft picks decline with age, too?!? WTF is that!?!?!?

 

Your free agents, Reese--holy shit! You constantly get guys that their original teams think aren't as good as other players they have, or feel are overpriced! This bullshit has to stop.

 

BTW, Ernie's guys are Tuck, Webster, Snee, Diehl, Kiwi--you know, the guys you folks want cut because they stink now, or cost too much...Yeah, Eli, too--and his $20 million cap hit.

 

Make up your minds: do you want to re-sign our players and have them decline under contract (which they inevitably will), or let them go at around their peak, and miss their ability? That way, we can sign other team's players and pay a higher price for equivalent skill sets.

 

I'm not saying Reese is perfect by any stretch (the proof is in the record), but it's not like everything worked out as planned, either.

 

Outside of Eli, most of Ernies' guys should be out to pasture now.

 

Every team has injuries.

 

The issue with Reese is that he's constantly looking for the home run hitter when what a championship caliber team really needs is to get some good consistent contact hitters.

 

There's no excuse - none - that after 7 years of drafting and free agency that we are fielding the garbage I watched today. I watched the offensive line, defensive ends, and the linebackers play, and thought to myself that not only is this game over, but the season might be over too.

 

It's all on Reese....if he's as good as he thinks he is, he'll fix this.

[fishgutmartyr]

What I'd like is:

 

1. Two starting DEs, and a capable backup.

 

2. Two starting DTs, and a capable backup.

 

3. NFL caliber linebackers and offensive linemen.

 

This whole "let's spend our money on eight DL guys" when you can only have four on the field at once isn't working.

 

What you wound up with:

 

1. A ghost and an out-patient at de, with a guy that should be playing LB and an overmatched rookie; all of whom seem to practice a drill that allows everyone to run outside of them.

 

2. 2 starting and 2 decent backup DTs, that keep the center of the line reasonably intact.

 

3. Nothing. Which is just as disturbing to me as it is to you.

 

4. An Oline that has now played 2 complete games as a unit all season and preseason.

 

It was necessary to bring in those DL guys because we cut Canty to lower the cap, Austin to that point had shown nothing, and the interior line was ripped apart last season. We'd look even worse if Reese hadn't done what he did--they would be running at will all along the line of scrimmage, rather than mostly outside.

 

Hey, I'm not happy either; I'm just pointing out that this team is falling apart from personnel, to how that personnel is being used, to indifference on the part of players, to just pure age and dumb luck. We're still playing defense like we have Strahan, a peaking Osi, and a healthy Tuck--and we just don't. We're trying to have a balanced offense at the coaching level, while the front office is trying to create a pass-protect line. I have no clue what they are trying to do at TE.

 

The only thing that's giving me any sort of hope is that Tuck is not going to be here with his cap number and niether will Webster. Snee and Diehl I would bet retire, and Manning's cap number goes down a bit next year. That's without making any decisions regarding any other players with huge numbers, and that should free up some room for what comes next.

 

I wouldn't be shocked if Coughlin retires as well, especially if Snee does; so everyone will get their wish for a new coaching staff.

 

This team had too many ifs going into training camp, and way too many didn't go the right way. It happens. This team is snake-bit, and the players know it. It's going to be a long season.

[Herc]

maybe he'll retire tomorrow

[Steitzenhaus]

Yep. Window is closed on this group and it's time for a rebuild. It happens. Pittsburgh is going through the same exact thing and their recent run of sustained success mirrors ours pretty closely. Hopefully we see some development from the players who will be staying but it's not going to be fun.

[JMFP]

 

What you wound up with:

 

1. A ghost and an out-patient at de, with a guy that should be playing LB and an overmatched rookie; all of whom seem to practice a drill that allows everyone to run outside of them.

 

2. 2 starting and 2 decent backup DTs, that keep the center of the line reasonably intact.

 

3. Nothing. Which is just as disturbing to me as it is to you.

 

4. An Oline that has now played 2 complete games as a unit all season and preseason.

 

It was necessary to bring in those DL guys because we cut Canty to lower the cap, Austin to that point had shown nothing, and the interior line was ripped apart last season. We'd look even worse if Reese hadn't done what he did--they would be running at will all along the line of scrimmage, rather than mostly outside.

 

Hey, I'm not happy either; I'm just pointing out that this team is falling apart from personnel, to how that personnel is being used, to indifference on the part of players, to just pure age and dumb luck. We're still playing defense like we have Strahan, a peaking Osi, and a healthy Tuck--and we just don't. We're trying to have a balanced offense at the coaching level, while the front office is trying to create a pass-protect line. I have no clue what they are trying to do at TE.

 

The only thing that's giving me any sort of hope is that Tuck is not going to be here with his cap number and niether will Webster. Snee and Diehl I would bet retire, and Manning's cap number goes down a bit next year. That's without making any decisions regarding any other players with huge numbers, and that should free up some room for what comes next.

 

I wouldn't be shocked if Coughlin retires as well, especially if Snee does; so everyone will get their wish for a new coaching staff.

 

This team had too many ifs going into training camp, and way too many didn't go the right way. It happens. This team is snake-bit, and the players know it. It's going to be a long season.

 

 

I could definitely see Coughlin retiring, and I wouldn't blame him. The more this goes on, the more convinced I am that if he were not the coach, the Giants would have never won those two Super Bowls.

[fishgutmartyr]

 

Outside of Eli, most of Ernies' guys should be out to pasture now.

 

Every team has injuries.

 

The issue with Reese is that he's constantly looking for the home run hitter when what a championship caliber team really needs is to get some good consistent contact hitters.

 

There's no excuse - none - that after 7 years of drafting and free agency that we are fielding the garbage I watched today. I watched the offensive line, defensive ends, and the linebackers play, and thought to myself that not only is this game over, but the season might be over too.

 

It's all on Reese....if he's as good as he thinks he is, he'll fix this.

 

I didn't title the thread, Joe. And most of them are. I'm not even sure why Jacobs is back on this team.

 

Every team does have injuries--but the general manager isn't at fault for them. And if they are career-ending, or as limiting as they were with a huge number of the drafted players I listed, that will really screw up any long-term strategy you might have. Would we have drafted Akamura if Thomas didn't go down? Would we have Rolle and his cap number if it wasn't for Phillip's knee? For all we know, those acquisitions might have been the linebackers we're missing now.

 

If you have a general manager looking for the Chase Blackburns of the world rather than a Jack Lambert, then fire him.

 

And remember: after 6 years of drafting and free agency, you also saw two SB victories, 5 winning seasons, and no losing seasons. It wasn't just what we saw today. I guess we're about due on the 7th.

[Storm]

They are about to miss the playoffs for 4 of the last 5 seasons. "Winning" seasons, be damned.

[Iceman_NYG]

Will the Giants ever have a LBer of note? Ever? Pierce was probably the last one....

[Nas]

Rain's is the post I agree with most. It seems that the front office and coaching staff is evident. We have Nicks a Reese pick who doesn't get a sniff of the ball till garbage time; Randle a less capable player but obviously a coaching favorite gets the touches...not catches. Lastly in terms of the defense...I believe they have really gone away from the line rotation that kept guys relatively fresh. Coach Out of Gas and yes St. Gibride have been found out. Their game plans are rudimentary at best with no ability to adjust.

 

Although we shouldn't judge Nicks and Randle based on this last game alone... and it's not Eli's fault he was being chased out of Charlotte all day... Nicks never got open... if you watch the game and focus on him, there was zero separation...