Very interesting read from Arthur Staple's blog on Giants

[jranieli]

http://www.newsday.com/sports/football/gia...0,825811.column

 

 

f this were another season -- 2005, say, when the Giants also were 7-4 -- maybe Jerry Reese would have a better grasp of his team's future.

 

But this season's 7-4 is a far cry from the 2005 version, when Eli Manning was in his first full season as a starter, the Giants were fighting for the NFC East title and Tom Coughlin hadn't yet taken them to the playoffs.

 

"We've got a big few weeks coming up," Reese said. "It's going to tell us a lot."

 

Reese didn't want to talk much about Coughlin's future except to say, "He's coaching for his life out there." Reese meant it as a positive, that Coughlin is doing anything he can to win. But it may have another meaning that won't be determined until after the Giants' season ends, whenever that may be.

 

Reese's first year as general manager seemed, at the start, as if it might be a rebuilding season. He jettisoned some older regulars, had a coach on a one-year leash and a team leader AWOL.

 

But Reese has seen plenty this season that tells him things might not change one bit for 2008. Same coach, same quarterback, same Hall of Fame defensive end. But then ...

 

Here are the main areas Reese and his staff will be evaluating the next five weeks, and into January:

 

The coach. Reese is still feeling very positive about Coughlin, who could be the first Giants coach with three straight playoff appearances since Bill Parcells (1984-86). The owners feel the same way, and nothing has been decided. The true wild card in Coughlin's future may be Steve Tisch. Team president John Mara has never been one to make sweeping changes, but Tisch, in his third year as executive VP, may push to go in a different direction regardless of what Coughlin does, short of a Super Bowl appearance.

 

The quarterback. The Giants exercised a buy-back of the final two years of Manning's contract in March after those years were voided by Manning hitting performance clauses. Now, the Giants are on the hook for $8.45 million for next season and $8.9 million in 2009. There will be serious negotiations this offseason, and games like last Sunday's don't help Manning's case for a long, lucrative extension like the one the Cowboys gave Tony Romo last month.

 

And there has been, according to a team source, plenty of discussion about whether to draft a quarterback in April or sign a young one to groom for the future and possibly push Manning a bit. Jared Lorenzen and Anthony Wright haven't provided Manning any competition, and the Giants may want to change that going forward.

 

The veterans. Strahan might be headed to his eighth Pro Bowl, which will stoke his desire to play another season and ask for more than the $4 million he's due for '08. Amani Toomer is still a viable receiver at 33, but Reese has already shown a willingness to move on.

 

The young guys. A person outside the organization who is familiar with the Giants' thinking said the team initiated extension talks with Justin Tuck, Brandon Jacobs, Chris Snee and Gibril Wilson during the bye week, but nothing was signed. All four may be integral to the team's future. Only Wilson will be an unrestricted free agent after this season, but he's the sole veteran at a painfully thin safety spot, and the Giants may not be able to afford losing him.

 

Change is definitely coming for the Giants and Reese.

 

"Let's just say there's a lot on my mind right now," he said with a laugh. "But my main focus is the Bears, and where we're at this week. We've got to see where this thing goes before we make any other decisions."

[Lughead]

OH yeah baby, The Meadowlands are (still) burning

 

cant wait till Christmas to get my GM book.

 

 

You can clearly see the writting on the wall for coughlin . Who do we get for a head coach Parcells, Fox, Fisher?

 

Is this Toomers last year? trade bait?

 

Will Strahan return next year? with out the hold out?

 

Do we draft chase Daniels?

 

will we draft a stud LT?

 

Damn the season is not even over An I am thinking about the draft I must still be hurting from Sunday.

[Nesta]

Who do we get for a head coach Parcells, Fox, Fisher?

Cowher or Fox.

 

Is this Toomers last year? Yes

trade bait? No.

 

Will Strahan return next year? yes

with out the hold out? no

 

Do we draft chase Daniels? no, i think when he falls short of the nc, he'll come back for another year.

 

will we draft a stud LT? no diehl is doing fine there.

 

You have to love reese though. He cut a lot of fat from this team, and still left plenty to build and win with.

[fishgutmartyr]

What is the obsession with Fox? What has he done since that Superbowl loss? At BEST he's been up and down.

[Nesta]

What is the obsession with Fox? What has he done since that Superbowl loss? At BEST he's been up and down.

 

To be fair, since the superbowl, he did make it to the NFC championship after kicking our ass at home

and beating Chicago at home.

In 04, due to injury their leading rusher was Nick Goings (one of 8 rb's they used that year)

In 05 NFC Championship loss.

In 06 and 07 offensive woes.

 

You have to like Fox's defensive mind though. Since taking over his defense

is usually ranked top ten in pts allowed.

02=5th

03=10th

04=16th

05=5th

06=9th

[Sephiroth]

That actually all sounds really reasonable and sound. Jerry Reese might say some off-the-cuff things but overall I think he's the right man for the job.

[boohyah]

That actually all sounds really reasonable and sound. Jerry Reese might say some off-the-cuff things but overall I think he's the right man for the job.

 

 

He says a lot of off the cuff things, maybe he should say shut up a little more. If the players were talking like this it would be considered a crime like last year. It's one thing for the media and fans to say Eli is skittish, it's a whole lot worse to say it if you're the GM. He doesn't talk often, but when he does Reese always seems to mix it up with some dumb remark.

[Gspotter]

I'm not a bandwagon guy, but I'm nearly certain that TC is a goner either way...it's this type of collapse that we feared and even if you settle up right now, you've still seen it rear it's head. I really don't think that I can get with the current program: too inconsistent.

 

We need more from our team and if TC can't even curb the discipline on the field, then I'm uncertain of his contribution to the team.

 

I regret that I now (also) see Gilbride as a liability too. His playcalling seems suspect.

 

I still like Spags and it's his first season and first time doing this, so it's too hard to get on him.

 

I think we'll see a lot of change, that's for sure.

 

I also think we'll be weaning ourselves off of Eli Harrington.

[fishgutmartyr]

I'm not a bandwagon guy, but I'm nearly certain that TC is a goner either way...it's this type of collapse that we feared and even if you settle up right now, you've still seen it rear it's head. I really don't think that I can get with the current program: too inconsistent.

 

We need more from our team and if TC can't even curb the discipline on the field, then I'm uncertain of his contribution to the team.

 

I regret that I now (also) see Gilbride as a liability too. His playcalling seems suspect.

 

I still like Spags and it's his first season and first time doing this, so it's too hard to get on him.

 

I think we'll see a lot of change, that's for sure.

 

I also think we'll be weaning ourselves off of Eli Harrington.

 

We're 1-2 since the bye. If we beat Chicago, we're .500. Are we still in collapse then? You guys are making me sound like a pollyanna here, but the reality is we beat a team with a winning record, lost to a 10-1 team whose single loss was to the best team in football, and threw Sunday's game away. Literally.

 

This is the same amount of panic I saw on this board after the first 3 games in the first half of the season. I'm not saying that freefall isn't possible, but we're not there yet.

[NightFire]

We're 1-2 since the bye. If we beat Chicago, we're .500. Are we still in collapse then? You guys are making me sound like a pollyanna here, but the reality is we beat a team with a winning record, lost to a 10-1 team whose single loss was to the best team in football, and threw Sunday's game away. Literally.

 

This is the same amount of panic I saw on this board after the first 3 games in the first half of the season. I'm not saying that freefall isn't possible, but we're not there yet.

 

I am with you here Fish. This is just an average team that sometimes over achieves and sometimes under achieves. The Giants are what they are and are not a dominant team. Unless there is a great coach that want to be with Giants I say stick with Coulghlin and jettison Gilbride. He has been with Eli now for many years and hasn't corrected his issues or at least hide them. The only problem is that this would be Eli's third OC which won't help his progress.

[JMFP]

I am with you here Fish. This is just an average team that sometimes over achieves and sometimes under achieves. The Giants are what they are and are not a dominant team. Unless there is a great coach that want to be with Giants I say stick with Coulghlin and jettison Gilbride. He has been with Eli now for many years and hasn't corrected his issues or at least hide them. The only problem is that this would be Eli's third OC which won't help his progress.

 

I'm all for sticking with Coughlin at this point.

 

However, if they let go Coughlin, I'd really only be happy with Parcells, and not for nostalgia's sake.

 

Just look at every team that Parcells has inherited, and look what the results have been.

 

He set the table for the Giants - too bad George Young completely fucked up the sucessor (hmmmm Ray Handley or Bill Belichick.....let me think that one over).

 

He took a God-awful Patriots team to the Super Bowl.

 

He took a crap-sandwich Jets team and turned them into an AFC power.

 

He took a mediocre Cowboys team and gave them a winning record, and found them the best new QB in the NFL (not that the media will give him any credit for that.....they credit Wade Phillips "laid back style"....what a crock of shit that is).

 

Fact is, Parcells has wanted back in, and would jump at the chance. He could return this team to old time Giants football, and mentor a great new coach once he retires for good. Parcells wants to return to the Giants before it's all over. Mark my words.

[Sephiroth]

I'm all for sticking with Coughlin at this point.

 

However, if they let go Coughlin, I'd really only be happy with Parcells, and not for nostalgia's sake.

 

Just look at every team that Parcells has inherited, and look what the results have been.

 

He set the table for the Giants - too bad George Young completely fucked up the sucessor (hmmmm Ray Handley or Bill Belichick.....let me think that one over).

 

He took a God-awful Patriots team to the Super Bowl.

 

He took a crap-sandwich Jets team and turned them into an AFC power.

 

He took a mediocre Cowboys team and gave them a winning record, and found them the best new QB in the NFL (not that the media will give him any credit for that.....they credit Wade Phillips "laid back style"....what a crock of shit that is).

 

Fact is, Parcells has wanted back in, and would jump at the chance. He could return this team to old time Giants football, and mentor a great new coach once he retires for good. Parcells wants to return to the Giants before it's all over. Mark my words.

 

joe... c'mon guy... you've gotta be joking.

 

Parcells hasn't done ANYTHING without Belichick as his DC, besides take the Cowboys to a first-round playoff loss. Meanwhile Belichick has 3 rings without Parcells.

 

As far as George Young fucking up the successor... Parcells left the team in what, June? Belichick was long gone for the Browns by then... Parcells FUCKED THE GIANTS, not the other way around, and we got STUCK with Ray Handley for two years largely because of him.

 

If Parcells ever coaches this team again, I'm finding a new team to root for.

[RandolphScott]

OH yeah baby, The Meadowlands are (still) burning

 

cant wait till Christmas to get my GM book.

You can clearly see the writting on the wall for coughlin . Who do we get for a head coach Parcells, Fox, Fisher?

Is this Toomers last year? trade bait?

 

Will Strahan return next year? with out the hold out?

 

Do we draft chase Daniels?

 

will we draft a stud LT?

 

Damn the season is not even over An I am thinking about the draft I must still be hurting from Sunday.

 

 

If Coughlin is gone I expect Jason Garrett to get much consideration.

[gateb]

joe... c'mon guy... you've gotta be joking.

 

Parcells hasn't done ANYTHING without Belichick as his DC, besides take the Cowboys to a first-round playoff loss. Meanwhile Belichick has 3 rings without Parcells.

 

As far as George Young fucking up the successor... Parcells left the team in what, June? Belichick was long gone for the Browns by then... Parcells FUCKED THE GIANTS, not the other way around, and we got STUCK with Ray Handley for two years largely because of him.

 

If Parcells ever coaches this team again, I'm finding a new team to root for.

Agreed 100%!! There is no way Mara will take back Parcells, not after what he did in 91.

 

Never thought of Garrett, that's an interesting choice. If we don't get him I hope one team does. The guy is offensive gold, and is a huge reason why Dallas is so good offensively.

 

I was actually thinking Josh McDaniels OC from the Pats. He's been on my mind since last March...

[RandolphScott]

Agreed 100%!! There is no way Mara will take back Parcells, not after what he did in 91.

 

Never thought of Garrett, that's an interesting choice. If we don't get him I hope one team does. The guy is offensive gold, and is a huge reason why Dallas is so good offensively.

 

I was actually thinking Josh McDaniels OC from the Pats. He's been on my mind since last March...

 

 

You don't think the Giants are jealous over what he is doing with Tony Romo?

We all know Jerry Jones was/is gonna groom him to take over for Wade Phillips

but after the season Phillips is having do you think he is going to fire him? Fuck no.

 

If Garrett can get Tony Romo to be this good, no reason he can't get Eli Manning either.

 

 

The Giants need to make a splash in whoever they hire if they fire Coughlin. In 2003 they

needed a splash and hired an old re-tread because he is Irish Catholic and coached at BC.

I would hope Mara and Tisch 2.0 realize this and think outside of the box.

 

Hopefully they can sign a safety that is actually good, Gibril hasn't been good since his rookie

year.

[gateb]

You don't think the Giants are jealous over what he is doing with Tony Romo?

We all know Jerry Jones was/is gonna groom him to take over for Wade Phillips

but after the season Phillips is having do you think he is going to fire him? Fuck no.

 

If Garrett can get Tony Romo to be this good, no reason he can't get Eli Manning either.

The Giants need to make a splash in whoever they hire if they fire Coughlin. In 2003 they

needed a splash and hired an old re-tread because he is Irish Catholic and coached at BC.

I would hope Mara and Tisch 2.0 realize this and think outside of the box.

 

Hopefully they can sign a safety that is actually good, Gibril hasn't been good since his rookie

year.

Gibril's fine, it's just the guy next to him that sucks.

 

Hell, look at Ed Reed. What's he done after Will Demps left (when Demps was good).

[NightFire]

If Coughlin is gone I expect Jason Garrett to get much consideration.

 

Fuck I hope so. He used play for the Giants so maybe he will be interested. When I heard he was going to be the OC for Dallas I was like, why the fuck didn't we get him? I remember people saying that he was one of the major reasons Collins turned his career around (I am sure Fassell helped too). I wonder if he is ready though to be a HC already.

[RandolphScott]

Fuck I hope so. He used play for the Giants so maybe he will be interested. When I heard he was going to be the OC for Dallas I was like, why the fuck didn't we get him? I remember people saying that he was one of the major reasons Collins turned his career around (I am sure Fassell helped too). I wonder if he is ready though to be a HC already.

 

 

I don't think he is that far off, people criticized the Steelers for hiring Mike Tomlin

after one year at the Vikings defensive coordinator and look how that's turned out.

If the Giants wanted to hire a defensive guy I'd say Ron Rivera, but I'd assume he

turned alot of people off last year when he had like 6 interviews and came out with

no job offers.

[Clarence the Blue Puppet]

If they do fire Coughlin, I hope Spags stays.

[RandolphScott]

If they do fire Coughlin, I hope Spags stays.

 

 

 

I agree. You could say Spags has made chicken salad out of chicken shit too.

[Storm]

He says a lot of off the cuff things, maybe he should say shut up a little more. If the players were talking like this it would be considered a crime like last year. It's one thing for the media and fans to say Eli is skittish, it's a whole lot worse to say it if you're the GM. He doesn't talk often, but when he does Reese always seems to mix it up with some dumb remark.

 

Dude, he's looking at the business aspect, what he himself is PAID to do. We didn't drop 54 million on Eli so that he can be mediocre. Sure he could have waited till the offseason to diss ELI, but hopefully, this will put a fire under his underachieving ass.

[Storm]

And Gibril Wilson is an excellent safety. It's the Michael Johnsons and Butlers and other undrafted street free agents we get off the streets that suck.

[Treehugger]

I wonder if Nolan will be available for OC next year?

[RandolphScott]

And Gibril Wilson is an excellent safety. It's the Michael Johnsons and Butlers and other undrafted street free agents we get off the streets that suck.

 

 

Excellent he is not, he is above average and that's pushing it.

[NightFire]

I don't think he is that far off, people criticized the Steelers for hiring Mike Tomlin

after one year at the Vikings defensive coordinator and look how that's turned out.

If the Giants wanted to hire a defensive guy I'd say Ron Rivera, but I'd assume he

turned alot of people off last year when he had like 6 interviews and came out with

no job offers.

 

I remember hearing that Jones was thinking about giving him the HC job. Probably just rumor but makes you wonder that maybe he is that good and ready.