So...

[fishgutmartyr]

Yes, because we would not have won the Super Bowl if any players were hurting. The game on Sunday. like all other games, could result in an injury to a vital first line player. That, would have an impact that the team doesn't need or want. A win, on Sunday, is what Toxic Tom desires because it feeds his ego.

You might want to check and see who was out for the Tampa game last season. Grey Ruegamer was our starting center.

[ppodlesny]

I don't need or want an award from the DUMBEST member of this board !! You may know about golf but you lack knowledge about a physical contact sport like football.

well when make a stupid post like the one you did....you get an award...kind of like being on Herb Blackwell's worse dressed list...you didn't ask to be there, but since you dress like a throwback from the 70s you go on it nonetheless.

[Herc]

Yes, because we would not have won the Super Bowl if any players were hurting. The game on Sunday. like all other games, could result in an injury to a vital first line player. That, would have an impact that the team doesn't need or want. A win, on Sunday, is what Toxic Tom desires because it feeds his ego.

 

it's a debatable issue--otherwise so many teams wouldn' tbe doing different things. look at tampa last year, they rested their players for two weeks and then looked like crap in their game against us. meanwhile new england and the giants went all out in the last agme of the season and they both made it to the superbowl.

 

but i think considering that playing all out in week 17 resulted in a superbowl for us the obvious move is to go with what worked for us.

 

as for 'toxic' tom. nobody was a harsher critic of his than me prior to last season--ask anyone on this board. but he won a superbowl and im wrong. you should probably make the same admission. besides, he's an angry old man i would think you'd be a big fan of his.

[Allstarjim]

I'm by no means calling Tom toxic, but it is a stupid idea to throw Jacobs and McKenzie out there, particularly, and Robbins as well. Those 3 guys definitely need the game off. Play everyone else if you want, but all three are crucial to our success in the playoffs and all three are playing banged up. Particularly Jacobs. Hell, I even sit Tuck... All you guys that are saying play them all, well if Justin Tuck and Brandon Jacobs both get injured and miss the playoffs... you will curse the ground that Coughlin walks on.

 

Last year is completely irrelevant here. Last year we were just a wild card team, and we had great team health going into the playoffs. The team, and Tom, had to prove to the players that they could play with anybody, and give New England their best shot. Certainly, that game made a difference in the minds of Giants players'. But the team's relative health was equally as important. It wouldn't have mattered if we beat New England last year by 40, if Strahan had went down. That is the truth.

 

There is nothing to win here... nothing to gain, and EVERYTHING to lose. The only thing that can happen in this game is something damaging to our SuperBowl run. Momentum is overrated. It's the playoffs, the Giants will be up for their divisional round game no matter what. Momentum is especially overrated in this game where we will have 2 whole weeks before they even compete again. The players know this game doesn't mean anything. They are not going to let a loss, should we lose, affect the playoffs.

 

Besides, WE CAN BEAT THE VIKINGS ANYWAY. We can beat them with David Carr at QB, Ward and Bradshaw at tailbacks, and Terrell Thomas at the opposite corner (Aaron Ross needs to sit also, concussion).

 

You tell the guys that are playing to go give them hell. THAT would be a lift to the team, beating a team playing for their playoff lives with your backups.

 

 

[Nesta]

as for 'toxic' tom. nobody was a harsher critic of his than me prior to last season--ask anyone on this board. but he won a superbowl and im wrong. you should probably make the same admission. besides, he's an angry old man i would think you'd be a big fan of his.

 

This is true. Although I think I gave you a run for your money. Luckily we were both wrong. For the first time EVER.

 

I think we started a trend by playing starters the last game. I'll bet we'll see more teams doing it this year.

[Allstarjim]

it's a debatable issue--otherwise so many teams wouldn' tbe doing different things. look at tampa last year, they rested their players for two weeks and then looked like crap in their game against us. meanwhile new england and the giants went all out in the last agme of the season and they both made it to the superbowl.

 

but i think considering that playing all out in week 17 resulted in a superbowl for us the obvious move is to go with what worked for us.

 

as for 'toxic' tom. nobody was a harsher critic of his than me prior to last season--ask anyone on this board. but he won a superbowl and im wrong. you should probably make the same admission. besides, he's an angry old man i would think you'd be a big fan of his.

 

 

Completely different animal. Last year our Giants needed the confidence boost and were enjoying relative health amongst the guys that were playing. This year neither is true.

 

Tampa example is irrelevant also, because they were barely a playoff team last year, and they are a fringe playoff team this year. They lost because they are just a mediocre team, an inferior team, not because they rested their starters in Week 17. They just aren't serious contenders.

[Herc]

i agree w/ sitting or limiting a select few guys that are already banged up like jacobs, but i still think we should play to win this game. also, as fish mentioned already, we did suffer injuries in the NE game last year and it didn't really affect us too much. if we can lose o'hara and still win the next playoff game then im pretty confident that it's not as risky to play all out as one would think

[Herc]

Completely different animal. Last year our Giants needed the confidence boost and were enjoying relative health amongst the guys that were playing. This year neither is true.

 

Tampa example is irrelevant also, because they were barely a playoff team last year, and they are a fringe playoff team this year. They lost because they are just a mediocre team, an inferior team, not because they rested their starters in Week 17. They just aren't serious contenders.

 

people would've said the same thing about us prior the NE game. in fact on a neutral field i'd bet tampa would've still been favored over us

[BlueInCanada]

Sit: Jacobs, Tuck, Robbins, McKenzie and Ross..let them rest up the next couple of weeks.

 

Let the starters come out for the first half then have the second string come out in the second half.

[Allstarjim]

Also you really think that New England playing all out in week 17 had anything to do with it? They had the greatest offense of all time. And even still, they probably would have lost the AFC title game if Rivers didn't try to be a hero and they had just gone with Volek. Rivers was a statue back there and the NE defense capitalized. It sooooooooo doesn't matter what happens in Week 17 two weeks from then and in conference championship games... to say otherwise is completely ridiculous. The only time it does matter is when you lose a key player in that game for the playoffs.

[Nesta]

Tampa example is irrelevant also, because they were barely a playoff team last year, and they are a fringe playoff team this year. They lost because they are just a mediocre team, an inferior team, not because they rested their starters in Week 17. They just aren't serious contenders.

 

Tampa was barely a playoff team last year? They won their division 2 weeks before the final game. That's why they were 9-7 because they sat their starters for those two games they could've easily won.

 

 

[Allstarjim]

people would've said the same thing about us prior the NE game. in fact on a neutral field i'd bet tampa would've still been favored over us

 

 

They were favored against us. Doesn't matter, though.... what other people's opinions were don't count. We had greatness in us that was just being discovered. Tampa doesn't have it, and still doesn't have it. That is why they lost.

 

 

i agree w/ sitting or limiting a select few guys that are already banged up like jacobs, but i still think we should play to win this game.

 

So you DO agree with me!

 

 

Guys, I'm not saying go out there and lay down. If I'm Coach Coughlin I'm taking the guys that are going to be playing and firing them up, and I'm working hard to draw up a winning gameplan... doing EVERYTHING I can to get a W versus Minny. But at the same time, McKenzie, Jacobs, Ross, and Robbins are not going to see the field.

[Allstarjim]

Tampa was barely a playoff team last year? They won their division 2 weeks before the final game. That's why they were 9-7 because they sat their starters for those two games they could've easily won.

 

 

The division was weak last year. Tampa is a good football team, not great. They were not ever going to make noise in the playoffs. You can put them in the same class as the Redskins. They are good enough to compete, but not serious contenders. Believe me, I live in Tampa and see most of their games, I know what the Bucs are. They are who I thought they was.

[Herc]

This is true. Although I think I gave you a run for your money. Luckily we were both wrong. For the first time EVER.

 

I think we started a trend by playing starters the last game. I'll bet we'll see more teams doing it this year.

 

most def. it's a copycat league. i wonder what tampa will do since they are in the exact same positio as last year

[Herc]

They were favored against us. Doesn't matter, though.... what other people's opinions were don't count. We had greatness in us that was just being discovered. Tampa doesn't have it, and still doesn't have it. That is why they lost.

 

 

 

 

So you DO agree with me!

 

 

Guys, I'm not saying go out there and lay down. If I'm Coach Coughlin I'm taking the guys that are going to be playing and firing them up, and I'm working hard to draw up a winning gameplan... doing EVERYTHING I can to get a W versus Minny. But at the same time, McKenzie, Jacobs, Ross, and Robbins are not going to see the field.

 

well i agree about resting jacobs and maybe some other guys who are really banged up. jacobs is too important to our offense to risk getting hurt again. plus our running game is decent with ward and bradshaw. but i dont think we should be benching eli and other guys who are perfectly healthy just because they MIGHT get hurt

[Allstarjim]

most def. it's a copycat league. i wonder what tampa will do since they are in the exact same positio as last year

 

 

Tampa's not in the same position... they have to win just to have a chance at the playoffs... last year they didn't.

[Nesta]

most def. it's a copycat league. i wonder what tampa will do since they are in the exact same positio as last year

 

nah this year they have to win their final game and dallas has to lose. they can't afford to sit anyone.

[Nas]

basically we got 3 weeks of jacking off till real Giants football starts?

 

Yep.. and that sucks but on the other side, people need to heel. Getting over the Flu (Tuck and Suebert) can take a while... and whatever injuries we need to nurse.

[Nesta]

The division was weak last year. Tampa is a good football team, not great. They were not ever going to make noise in the playoffs. You can put them in the same class as the Redskins. They are good enough to compete, but not serious contenders. Believe me, I live in Tampa and see most of their games, I know what the Bucs are. They are who I thought they was.

 

Doesn't change the fact they made the playoffs and it wasn't 'barely'. They were an 11-5 team if they wouldn't have sat anyone.

 

No one would've called us a 'great' team last year either no?

[fishgutmartyr]

Who said EVERYONE had to play? Of course you don't play a guy like Robbins--he has what? Two broken hands and a bad shoulder? But Tuck had the flu last week, right? (Oh, and a sore lower leg, but it was the flu that really messed him up.)

 

So, you want to rest people? Keep Robbins out. Give Jacobs a lighter load this week and use Bradshaw more. Keep Hixon off the field as much as possible, and rotate him with Manningham. Do the same with McKenzie and Boothe. Sit Ross and let Thomas or Dockery start.

 

You have to keep them in the game somewhat--half a month of not playing at this point in the season might mess them up more than help them. Joints stiffen, etc.

 

Hunh, Ward had a bad ankle before the last game? Maybe "Toxic Tom" could stomp on it this week.

[Herc]

jim my whole point was that nobody regarded us any more highly than tampa. they were obviously favored in the playoff game since it was at home but even in a neutral site they would've been favored. they showed way characteristics of a superbowl team than us until we played NE in week 17.

[Allstarjim]

Doesn't change the fact they made the playoffs and it wasn't 'barely'. They were an 11-5 team if they wouldn't have sat anyone.

 

No one would've called us a 'great' team last year either no?

 

 

Nesta, there is a difference. You cannot say they would've won their final two games had they played their starters and been 11-5. Either way, they were not a great team 11-5, 9-7, doesn't matter. The fact is, they showed their true colors like I knew they would. I watch Tampa football a lot, and I wasn't scared of them one iota in that playoff game. They are not in the class of the elite football teams. Their offense was ranked 18th in the NFL. They have Jeff Garcia, who is the perfect emodiment of the team... pretty good QB, just not good enough to go all the way.

 

And no, nobody would've called us a great team last year, either.

 

But we had it in us, because Eli hadn't taken off yet.... but he was about to.

 

I watch almost every Tampa game. They have a very good defense and a marginal offense. They are basically the same team this year as last year. Their division last year was weak to say the least. Still not impressed.

[Allstarjim]

jim my whole point was that nobody regarded us any more highly than tampa. they were obviously favored in the playoff game since it was at home but even in a neutral site they would've been favored. they showed way characteristics of a superbowl team than us until we played NE in week 17.

 

 

Point granted... but no one can convince me that because they rested their starters late in the year, that that was the reason they lost. They lost because they were not better than us. They were the best team in a shitty division. They won on a de facto basis. And if we rest our players in week 17, that will likewise have nothing to do with us winning or losing in the divisional playoff game.... UNLESS a key player gets hurt.

 

 

I will argue this point to death... Brandon Jacobs should not even suit up. He is running on two bad knees at this point and needs these 2 and a half weeks to heal. Same for McKenzie, same for Ross, same for Robbins. And I wouldn't play Hixon, either.

 

I'm not saying everybody. Play to win. But we are a deep team and we should give some other players a chance to contribute this week, if that is how you want to look at it. I totally think we can win against the Vikings with half a dozen backups starting. Even with David Carr starting! The guy is not a bad QB, and personally, I'd LIKE to see what he's got in this game!

 

We should all be thankful that we are in this position where we have nothing to play for for three weeks. This is a blessing and a gift, to be able to go into the divisional round with rested and healed bodies.

[Herc]

i hear you. i don't think there's a right and wrong answer to this question otherwise teams wouldn't be doing different things every season. i thought coughlin was wrong to go all out last year and he proved me wrong, so i will put my full trust in whatever he decides to do.

[Nesta]

Nesta, there is a difference. You cannot say they would've won their final two games had they played their starters and been 11-5. Either way, they were not a great team 11-5, 9-7, doesn't matter. The fact is, they showed their true colors like I knew they would. I watch Tampa football a lot, and I wasn't scared of them one iota in that playoff game. They are not in the class of the elite football teams. Their offense was ranked 18th in the NFL. They have Jeff Garcia, who is the perfect emodiment of the team... pretty good QB, just not good enough to go all the way.

 

And no, nobody would've called us a great team last year, either.

 

But we had it in us, because Eli hadn't taken off yet.... but he was about to.

 

I watch almost every Tampa game. They have a very good defense and a marginal offense. They are basically the same team this year as last year. Their division last year was weak to say the least. Still not impressed.

 

Whether they would or wouldn't have doesn't change anything Jim. Saying they 'barely made they playoffs' is ridiculous given that they sat their starters for two weeks. And yeah there's no guarantee they would've beaten a 4-10 SF team or the 6-9 panthers without Delhomme, but it would've been a pretty damn safe bet. All of that means nothing because they were locked into the playoffs already. What does the number of Tampa games you see have to do with it?