CrazedDogs

holy crap guys... spend some time in Bengals country, or hell, literally any other NFL market other than Green Bay, Pittsburgh, or Boston. The negative perspective of the Giants recent success among their own fans is like a mass delusion.

Look at how much money Mario Williams makes ($12-$15 million per, depending on your methodology), then stack up his stat line and his age against JPP... seriously guys, I wish I were wrong, but there is no way that JPP is coming back for less than $10 million per season. And it will probably be north of $12 million per season. Williams got paid far, far too much, but unfortunately that set the market and (I assume) JPP's expectations.

High end this season: 9.5 sacks, and he leads all defensive lineman in tackles. I expect him to command somewhat more than that. And while I argue that a lot of you guys are underestimating what he is going to be offered, I think I agree with your point that it doesn't make sense to pay any defensive player $10 million+ per season.

And for what its worth, there are several players on that list that haven't come close to matching JPP's production at his high end, and/or have been similarly inconsistent. Whether due to age or production, there is not a chance in hell any of the crossed out players are worth more on the open market than JPP.

Not sure what you think we are determining; all I was getting at by asking the 'name ten better' question was what some team will be willing to offer him. And that in itself is agnostic on the question of whether or not the Giants should meet that price.

okay, so Nas thinks relative value is not the issue in salary or contract negotiations. Noted! I'll keep that in my back pocket for future discussions....

Can anybody name ten better defensive ends than JPP?

I had no clue when he was drafted that he could be anywhere near this good.

He doesn't seem to have much speed, but he's tall and plays the ball well... may be exactly the kind of player the team needs that Randle wasn't.

No, it was a correct, to the letter of the rule call to overturn the TD. It only aesthetically looked like a TD. Am I the only one who remembers a similar but somewhat more clear cut play going against the Giants? I can't recall exactly who or when, but when I saw the ball come out of RGIII's hands on the replay, I instantly thought 'here we go, we got screwed on this once, its time to get even.... Giants ball on the 20'. Or end of half, whatever.

Good point. But the exception that proves the rule is Andy Dalton, whose absurd "$100 million" contract only really pays $100 million if he's playing at a Pro Bowl level. Dallas is trying an extreme version of this with Dez too.

oh, he was close. Just because he didn't get home and get credit for a sack doesn't mean he wasn't making an impact. And lets not completely discount that he was coming back from a very dinged up 2012 and a wasted 2013 season. As raw as he still is, all that lost time had to have an impact on the field. Is it a coincidence that he's come on later this season? I doubt it. About Hankins... yeah, the man can play. But he generally isn't out there on passing downs. I'll tell you what, if the Giants can get JPP back long term for anything under $10 million per, fuck yeah. I'll take it. My only concern is that perhaps he won't be a worker after the contract... at his high end, he'll be the best in the game. Absent a work ethic he'll stay raw and physically revert as he ages. So I'm all for an incentive laden contract that rewards him richly for high-end play, and provides the Giants an out if he doesn't keep developing.

the draft is such a crap shoot, I couldn't care less about draft position. And generally I believe that playing well to close the season does more to elevate the team the following season than any draft pick could hope to offer. ...As long as its next season's players that are having success and gaining confidence, and not the players of yesteryear enjoying their career's death rattle.

"invisible in the big games".... when was the last time the Giants even played a big game? I haven't seen him as 'invisible' all season... the sacks come in bunches, and when he wasn't getting them, he was drawing relentless double-teams. The problem is a lack of pass rush from the other side of the defensive line and a lack of linebackers who can.... well, I was going to say rush the passer, but really they can't do anything.

He's much, much closer to Strahan than he is Osi. He's not merely "nice"... he's one of the top five all-around defensive lineman in the game. And he could still improve. A lot. Obviously there's a price at which you have to say its just too much, but its a damn high price for JPP.

And its a little sickening how the new coaching staff has already tossed him under the bus too.

JPP is a flawed player, but there are aspects of the position at which he's the best in the game. We'd be damn fools to let him walk.

If that is accurate, then he'll be the first player off the board, no question about it.

probably, yeah. he did turn out to be a good guard though.

I feel kind of bad for RGIII, I thought he would turn out to be a good player. But as soon as he was the 'Skins pick, I knew how it would go for him.

true, but thats not how its going to play in their own locker room. He is Gregg Williams' butt buddy, so you're probably right about that. But the man knows how to get a football team to play for him.

lol, 'least mediocre play'.... not exactly what you have in mind from a first round pick.

I disagree that pass rushing is one of his strengths, the man has the leg length of a 7'er. He's never been able to get low and turn the corner on NFL offensive tackles. You have a point though about moving the guy around too much, and he was definitely asked to cover far too much. The position that I liked him best in, aside from the obvious, as a 3rd or 4th pass rusher, was as a downhill SAM backer - minimal coverage, just take on blockers and win at the point of attack. He was damn good at that. And he wasn't bad in coverage either as long as it was an in-line TE not named Jason Witten.

the obvious answer is somebody sold their soul for those Lombardis.

I remember that game... can't remember the linebackers, all I remember is the lack of linebackers probably cost the Giants that game.