osi724dasack Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 Ok we have a top 5 CB in Webster and I would put Dockery in the top 50 cbs in the NFL. and TT will soon be in the top. But Aaron Ross has played awful weather we realized it or not he was a lousy CB for us. here take a look at these numbers. Dockery: 40 attempts, 5.53 YPA, 32.50 Forced INC%, 0 TDs, 1 INT Ross: 81 attempts, 9.11 YPA, 19.75 Forced INC%, 4 TDs, 3 INTs Webster 66 attempts, 3.92 YPA, 65.15 Forced INC%, 1 TD, 3 INTs I do like Ross's size and ability but the guy is gonna have to show up to camp ready togo or else he could easily be traded or used as our PR/KR or dimeback. The guy has size and strength and is still 25, 26 years old, so if Butler walks then we could play Ross at FS where he may excel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 nah, it was only his 2nd year and remember how bad everyone thought webster was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osi724dasack Posted January 17, 2009 Author Share Posted January 17, 2009 nah, it was only his 2nd year and remember how bad everyone thought webster was that is true. but it seemed as if Ross has regressed from 07's form where he was rather good for a rookie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 that is true. but it seemed as if Ross has regressed from 07's form where he was rather good for a rookie. I dont think he regressed. He played very little as a rookie and only player near the end of the year and even then dislocated/broke? his arm in the playoffs. This was his first full season as a starter, being game planned against ect. Show me one cornerback who didnt struggle in their first full year? I say give him acouple more seasons to see what he can do it takes time for a CB to learn and gain experience, besides it's not like he is playing horribly out there. Even Webster was beaten multiple times this year..it happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osi724dasack Posted January 17, 2009 Author Share Posted January 17, 2009 I dont think he regressed. He played very little as a rookie and only player near the end of the year and even then dislocated/broke? his arm in the playoffs. This was his first full season as a starter, being game planned against ect. Show me one cornerback who didnt struggle in their first full year? I say give him acouple more seasons to see what he can do it takes time for a CB to learn and gain experience, besides it's not like he is playing horribly out there. Even Webster was beaten multiple times this year..it happens. i agree that Ross deserves more time. however TT and Dockery are younger and are showing more game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osi724dasack Posted January 17, 2009 Author Share Posted January 17, 2009 I would consider a position change to FS though for Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 i agree that Ross deserves more time. however TT and Dockery are younger and are showing more game Thomas has shown alot but Ross was in that same position as him last year. The third string CB who comes in fresh off the bench and makes a good play. I think Ross and Thomas will fight it out the next couple of seasons to see who will be the number two CB which should be a good competition. Whoever doesnt get the spot we know can play well in the nickel/third CB position. Dockery will never push the starting line up...he's a good back up CB though and serviceable in those situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 I would consider a position change to FS though for Ross Naww alot of CBs who convert to Safety end up playing like crap. Our future safetys are Phillips and Johnson(thanks to Spags most are safetys can play either position) Maybe we draft some kid in this years or next years draft to also fight it out for the safety position as well but I'm comfortable with Phillips and Johnson. ...now a pass coverage LB..thats what we need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osi724dasack Posted January 17, 2009 Author Share Posted January 17, 2009 Thomas has shown alot but Ross was in that same position as him last year. The third string CB who comes in fresh off the bench and makes a good play. I think Ross and Thomas will fight it out the next couple of seasons to see who will be the number two CB which should be a good competition. Whoever doesnt get the spot we know can play well in the nickel/third CB position. Dockery will never push the starting line up...he's a good back up CB though and serviceable in those situation. good points. Dockery is a much better cover corner than Ross or Thomas at this point though. but Ross and TT have a higher upside and were high draft picks of Reese and co which is why Dock will be our dimeback next year. Dock will get a good contract when he hits the market which means hes a gonner in 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osi724dasack Posted January 17, 2009 Author Share Posted January 17, 2009 Naww alot of CBs who convert to Safety end up playing like crap. Our future safetys are Phillips and Johnson(thanks to Spags most are safetys can play either position) Maybe we draft some kid in this years or next years draft to also fight it out for the safety position as well but I'm comfortable with Phillips and Johnson. ...now a pass coverage LB..thats what we need. Im really big on Phillips really big love the kid. Glad hes on our side for many years. Im not a Johnson fan though, hes missed alot of tackles, taken poor angles and gotten thrown around alot. he is a mediocre safety that could be upgraded. I would be comfortable if we resign Butler, or else were gonna need to draft a safety that can help us day 1 to spell Johnson and KP since the Safety market is rather expensice nowadays Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 good points. Dockery is a much better cover corner than Ross or Thomas at this point though. but Ross and TT have a higher upside and were high draft picks of Reese and co which is why Dock will be our dimeback next year. Dock will get a good contract when he hits the market which means hes a gonner in 10 I wouldnt say that..alot of picks he has had during the year have come off of arrant passes by the QB or jump balls to the WR, though on most jump balls he has made good plays as well. I don't see Dock getting much of a contract, he is a dime back like you said and most teams dont offer them much. I can see him re-signing with us when the time comes..he knows he isnt starter material so he should stay where he works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 Im really big on Phillips really big love the kid. Glad hes on our side for many years. Im not a Johnson fan though, hes missed alot of tackles, taken poor angles and gotten thrown around alot. he is a mediocre safety that could be upgraded. I would be comfortable if we resign Butler, or else were gonna need to draft a safety that can help us day 1 to spell Johnson and KP since the Safety market is rather expensice nowadays I liked Johnson, I remember last year I was really harsh on this kid and remember calling alot of posters "stupid" because they said he would be a good safety. I thought he was going to be a flop. The kid plays good and has tremendous speed which sometimes hurts him by over running tackles. At the same time he has made some great plays for us with his speed and is really good in pass coverage on those faster WRs. Butler makes me laugh, he looks out of place 100% of the time and is a child playing a mans game. Heck most of his Ints are the most ugly ints you have ever seen. I'm glad he will be off the team this year. You are right though that we will needs to draft/sign a safety sometime for depth and competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osi724dasack Posted January 17, 2009 Author Share Posted January 17, 2009 I wouldnt say that..alot of picks he has had during the year have come off of arrant passes by the QB or jump balls to the WR, though on most jump balls he has made good plays as well. I don't see Dock getting much of a contract, he is a dime back like you said and most teams dont offer them much. I can see him re-signing with us when the time comes..he knows he isnt starter material so he should stay where he works. Ints beside. when it comes to one on one coverage the guy can do the job a nice level. he is only the dimeback because he has 2 high picks that play at a good level as well in front of him and it would be real tough to beat them out no matter how well he looks in camp. I liked Johnson, I remember last year I was really harsh on this kid and remember calling alot of posters "stupid" because they said he would be a good safety. I thought he was going to be a flop. The kid plays good and has tremendous speed which sometimes hurts him by over running tackles. At the same time he has made some great plays for us with his speed and is really good in pass coverage on those faster WRs. Butler makes me laugh, he looks out of place 100% of the time and is a child playing a mans game. Heck most of his Ints are the most ugly ints you have ever seen. I'm glad he will be off the team this year. You are right though that we will needs to draft/sign a safety sometime for depth and competition. what i like about Butler are his smarts for the game and his size (although he doesnt use it for his advantage that much) if we could keep Butler at a nice price then we should keep him to compete with Johnson man do i wish we had Gibril sometimes. it would be so nasty to have him and KP starting alongside each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigblue25 Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 I dont think he regressed. He played very little as a rookie and only player near the end of the year and even then dislocated/broke? his arm in the playoffs. This was his first full season as a starter, being game planned against ect. Show me one cornerback who didnt struggle in their first full year? I say give him acouple more seasons to see what he can do it takes time for a CB to learn and gain experience, besides it's not like he is playing horribly out there. Even Webster was beaten multiple times this year..it happens. He's not playing horribly out there? he's possibly the worst corner in the NFL, i said oh oh when we drafted him. Hank Fucking Baskett scored on Aaron Ross once again Hank Fucking Baskett, the guy has no idea how to play the ball in the air constantly has his back turned to the wide reciever, Braylon Edwards,Santana Moss,Kevin Curtis?(don't get that one)Patrick Crayton all made Aaron Ross look absolutely foolish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 He's not playing horribly out there? he's possibly the worst corner in the NFL, i said oh oh when we drafted him. Hank Fucking Baskett scored on Aaron Ross once again Hank Fucking Baskett, the guy has no idea how to play the ball in the air constantly has his back turned to the wide reciever, Braylon Edwards,Santana Moss,Kevin Curtis?(don't get that one)Patrick Crayton all made Aaron Ross look absolutely foolish Obviously you dont remember Will Allen. I like how people gave up on Ross after this one season. I guess Webster never gets beaten as well...oh lets not talk about those times... Hey I heard Champ Bailey never gets beaten as well, no WR ever in the history of the NFL has beaten Champ Baily. I really dont see what point your trying to make BBlue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 thomas isn't ready to be a starter. ross and webster are a good tandem, we should try to keep them together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 Ross is fine- I didn't even know he was in the game against Philly until the 3rd Q- that means McNabb and Reid thinks he's good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boohyah Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 Ross/Webster/Thomas and Dockery are a very good group and all are young and their best years ahead of them, we're lucky. It's the safety help in coverage that has to improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurnThePhilFans Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurnThePhilFans Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 He's a second year player and a pretty solid one at that. Sure he has gone through some growing pains, but corner is a brutal position to get the hang of in the NFL and he is a pretty good second year player - Better than Webster was in his second year. You can't compare him to Webster who has become one of the top 3 corners in the NFL IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurnThePhilFans Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 I dont think he regressed. He played very little as a rookie and only player near the end of the year and even then dislocated/broke? his arm in the playoffs. This was his first full season as a starter, being game planned against ect. Show me one cornerback who didnt struggle in their first full year? I say give him acouple more seasons to see what he can do it takes time for a CB to learn and gain experience, besides it's not like he is playing horribly out there. Even Webster was beaten multiple times this year..it happens. Webster was most certainly not beat many times this year. He was a shutdown corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigblue25 Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 Obviously you dont remember Will Allen. I like how people gave up on Ross after this one season. I guess Webster never gets beaten as well...oh lets not talk about those times... Hey I heard Champ Bailey never gets beaten as well, no WR ever in the history of the NFL has beaten Champ Baily. I really dont see what point your trying to make BBlue. Will Allen and Will Peterson weren't all that bad, they fell off when Tim Lewis became D-Coordinator and i mean Deion Sanders would of probably sucked under Tim Lewis (still almost fell like puking just metioning Tim Lewis was a part of this organization. I know every corner gets beat in the NFL but it's almost an every week thing with Aaron Ross, he had a good game against Baltimore that was all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
so-cal dub Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 Are you an idiot? Nevermind, dont answer. Ross is a 2nd year player, he'll get better. Reason he wasn't so dazzling this season is because everyone threw his way, knowing he isnt so polished. Where as Webster was fucking lights out (though becasue he didnt have goddy INT #s, he gets no respect.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurnThePhilFans Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 Are you an idiot? Nevermind, dont answer. Ross is a 2nd year player, he'll get better. Reason he wasn't so dazzling this season is because everyone threw his way, knowing he isnt so polished. Where as Webster was fucking lights out (though becasue he didnt have goddy INT #s, he gets no respect.) So true... you know the fans are getting spoiled from our secondary and Webster specifically if they actually have the nerve to complain about Ross... the fact is this is the best secondary we've had in the last 2 decades probably Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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