BIGBLUE01 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Interesting, Big Blue. You have interviewed all of these coordinators or present with them when they were devising game plans. And what other players, besides LT, do you know? Yes, at time Lt was the only player they worried about when playing the Giants. That's because the other 20 stunk... Thats like an 8th grade response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishgutmartyr Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 And for the record, the measure of a linebacking corp's greatness should not be impacted by the team's inability to win a Super Bowl...the Dog has said a number of times, there are many factors that go into winning a Super Bowl... Indeed, if that were the only reason, I would agree. But the ability to play in a high stakes game such as a playoff is a consideration. My point was that Pittsburgh had a crew doing an amazing job both in regular season and playoff situations, something the N.O. crew was not able to replicate. In fact, if I recall correctly, they were known for laying down and dying in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBLUE01 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Not true - Shanahan's focus was on that specific player because of his tendencies vs. the run and playaction...so, really, the Dog cites little to no difference...and Bad Egg's point about Sanders (who the Dog despises by the way, cursed dion sanders and his flash) - teams did in that time specifically design the passing game plan to account for and throw away from him... Sanders and Rice are close seconds. But a Coordnator was never flat out focused on just them. Look at golfinkids quote from Gibbs, it was LT that he was plannin for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksm7 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 The kid doesn't consider LeRoy Butler in Lawrence Taylor's category. The kid is also providing a link from Coach Gibbs: Interesting...the Dog wonders, if he reviewed the game tapes from the times the Giants and REdskins played, would Joe Gibbs spend every down in a two tight end H back set, or only in blitzing situations...because the Dog is pretty sure the answer is that he was not in this specific set all game... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandolphScott Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Interesting...the Dog wonders, if he reviewed the game tapes from the times the Giants and REdskins played, would Joe Gibbs spend every down in a two tight end H back set, or only in blitzing situations...because the Dog is pretty sure the answer is that he was not in this specific set all game... The kid is seeing that the dog is the master of the obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadEgg Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Sanders and Rice are close seconds. But a Coordnator was never flat out focused on just them. Look at golfinkids quote from Gibbs, it was LT that he was plannin for. Big Blue, how can you continue with this argument? Really, you are claiming that LT was the ONLY player in history that teams "flat out" focused on...This is crazy...Teams focused on Deon Sanders, Barry Sanders, to name a few... Who in Cleveland did teams "flat out" focus on, back in the day, besides Jim Brown? How many sucky Bears teams did Walter Payton play on? Not ONE, defensive coordinator believed that, well, if they stopped Walter they stopped the Bears? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandolphScott Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Indeed, if that were the only reason, I would agree. But the ability to play in a high stakes game such as a playoff is a consideration. My point was that Pittsburgh had a crew doing an amazing job both in regular season and playoff situations, something the N.O. crew was not able to replicate. In fact, if I recall correctly, they were known for laying down and dying in the playoffs. To get away from all this third person bullshit, I have not seen the Saints of the Mora year, but could they have picked the Saints LBs because Sam Mills is dead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksm7 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 The kid is seeing that the dog is the master of the obvious. You have much to learn, but the Dog thinks you ar emaking strides...so then, if he didn;t stay in this set designed specifically for Taylor, is it not safe to say that his game plan included other aspects of the Giant's defense? Certainly he focused on stopping Taylor in blitz situations, but this happens frequently (many offensive coordinators discussed having to focus on Ray Lewis the year the Ravens won it on every play...)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandolphScott Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Big Blue, how can you continue with this argument? Really, you are claiming that LT was the ONLY player in history that teams "flat out" focused on...This is crazy...Teams focused on Deon Sanders, Barry Sanders, to name a few... Who in Cleveland did teams "flat out" focus on, back in the day, besides Jim Brown? How many sucky Bears teams did Walter Payton play on? Not ONE, defensive coordinator believed that, well, if they stopped Walter they stopped the Bears? To be far and play both sides of the spectrum, Tom Landry devised the 4-3 defense to stop Jim Brown, it freed up Sam Huff to put the hurtin' on him. In my opinion, there was no way you could possibly plan for Barry Sanders, the guy was like a pinball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandolphScott Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 You have much to learn, but the Dog thinks you ar emaking strides...so then, if he didn;t stay in this set designed specifically for Taylor, is it not safe to say that his game plan included other aspects of the Giant's defense? Certainly he focused on stopping Taylor in blitz situations, but this happens frequently (many offensive coordinators discussed having to focus on Ray Lewis the year the Ravens won it on every play...)... Well of course Mr. Dog, although it has never really been published because L.T. was a once in a lifetime/generation player. People are still looking for the next L.T. and the Kid thinks they will never find one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksm7 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Well of course Mr. Dog, although it has never really been published because L.T. was a once in a lifetime/generation player. People are still looking for the next L.T. and the Kid thinks they will never find one. You have done well...The Dog thinks you have potential...so you see, it is impossible to say that a team would design a game plan completely specific to one player...that was all the Dog was getting at... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishgutmartyr Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Who in Cleveland did teams "flat out" focus on, back in the day, besides Jim Brown? Otto Graham? Do I win anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadEgg Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Otto Graham? Do I win anything? Yes, a trip to Cleveland's home opener with BigBlue. Enjoy your weekend! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 You have much to learn, but the Dog thinks you ar emaking strides...so then, if he didn;t stay in this set designed specifically for Taylor, is it not safe to say that his game plan included other aspects of the Giant's defense? Certainly he focused on stopping Taylor in blitz situations, but this happens frequently (many offensive coordinators discussed having to focus on Ray Lewis the year the Ravens won it on every play...)... so let me guess, is ray lewis why you are saying taylor is 'possibly' the best LB ever? what a surprise, the guy who murdered the giants in the superbowl.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBLUE01 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Yes, a trip to Cleveland's home opener with BigBlue. Enjoy your weekend! LMAO!!! OK, now can you shut up eggy? LOL...He told you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksm7 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 so let me guess, is ray lewis why you are saying taylor is 'possibly' the best LB ever? what a surprise, the guy who murdered the giants in the superbowl.... Not what the Dog is suggesting...just citing an instance where other NFL players have had coordinators design game plans to account for them...the Dog could have gone so far as to say that despite the fact that he is mediocre in his position, coordinators still have to design game plans to deal with Michael Vick and his specific talents...Reggie White was another player that was given special attention...the list goes on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBLUE01 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 You have done well...The Dog thinks you have potential...so you see, it is impossible to say that a team would design a game plan completely specific to one player...that was all the Dog was getting at... LOL...good try dog, What I said still stands, esp. since I said it was my OPINION, he was the best ever. Teams, much like the Gibbs lead Redskins, DID in fact devise a gameplan around stopping LT. Wheteher you want to admit it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksm7 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 LOL...good try dog, What I said still stands, esp. since I said it was my OPINION, he was the best ever. Teams, much like the Gibbs lead Redskins, DID in fact devise a gameplan around stopping LT. Wheteher you want to admit it or not. Read the thread my friend - the Dog never denied the fact that teams developed parts of their game plan to account for Taylor...the point is that this happens frequently with a number of players throughout history, not just Taylor...You are entitled to your opinion, it is just that individuals the likes of Rice, Montana, Payton, Sanders (Barry and Deon), Reggie White etc could all be legitimately considered to be the best ever...but since they all play various positions with their own specifc and unique talents, it is impossible to pick just one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBLUE01 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Read the thread my friend - the Dog never denied the fact that teams developed parts of their game plan to account for Taylor...the point is that this happens frequently with a number of players throughout history, not just Taylor...You are entitled to your opinion, it is just that individuals the likes of Rice, Montana, Payton, Sanders (Barry and Deon), Reggie White etc could all be legitimately considered to be the best ever...but since they all play various positions with their own specifc and unique talents, it is impossible to pick just one... OK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Not what the Dog is suggesting...just citing an instance where other NFL players have had coordinators design game plans to account for them...the Dog could have gone so far as to say that despite the fact that he is mediocre in his position, coordinators still have to design game plans to deal with Michael Vick and his specific talents...Reggie White was another player that was given special attention...the list goes on... im not talking about that argument, im talking about your choice of words in originally saying taylor was 'possibly' the best linebacker ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksm7 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 im not talking about that argument, im talking about your choice of words in originally saying taylor was 'possibly' the best linebacker ever The Dog still contends that it is difficult to state whether or not a player is the best ever, even in their respective positions...the game has changed immensly over time...it is impossible to compare players in positions that played in the 60s or 70s to players in that position in the 90s and beyond...not to mention that playing outside linebacker is significanty different then playing inside...Obviously Montana was exceptional, and could be considered the best QB ever, but is that fair to QBs in the 60's when there was less passing involved? And who is to say that Montana is not a product of a great system and supporting cast...perhaps Marino and Elway would have had the same success or more in that system with that team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadEgg Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 The Dog still contends that it is difficult to state whether or not a player is the best ever, even in their respective positions...the game has changed immensly over time...it is impossible to compare players in positions that played in the 60s or 70s to players in that position in the 90s and beyond...not to mention that playing outside linebacker is significanty different then playing inside...Obviously Montana was exceptional, and could be considered the best QB ever, but is that fair to QBs in the 60's when there was less passing involved? And who is to say that Montana is not a product of a great system and supporting cast...perhaps Marino and Elway would have had the same success or more in that system with that team... Good point, Dog...Had Quincy Carter played for Bill Walsh there is no telling if the 49ers would have ever been stopped... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBLUE01 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 The Dog still contends that it is difficult to state whether or not a player is the best ever, even in their respective positions...the game has changed immensly over time...it is impossible to compare players in positions that played in the 60s or 70s to players in that position in the 90s and beyond...not to mention that playing outside linebacker is significanty different then playing inside...Obviously Montana was exceptional, and could be considered the best QB ever, but is that fair to QBs in the 60's when there was less passing involved? And who is to say that Montana is not a product of a great system and supporting cast...perhaps Marino and Elway would have had the same success or more in that system with that team... The dog must realize that sometimes all the infinite wisdom, bob dole like speaking and era comparing means crap when it comes to some players. LT WAS THE BEST LB. Period. Have you ever seen him play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksm7 Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 The dog must realize that sometimes all the infinite wisdom, bob dole like speaking and era comparing means crap when it comes to some players. LT WAS THE BEST LB. Period. Have you ever seen him play? The Dog has seen him play...he was a great linebacker...impossible to say that he is the best ever linebacker, and even more impossible to say that he is the best ever player...it is just fact...the Dog will concede: Taylor was the best outside linebacker ever during the 80s...Fair? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeMesiS Posted July 5, 2007 Share Posted July 5, 2007 I was surprise that the Saints LB core was picked number one. I would of placed them 4th or 5th, I mean they were that good. But number?Hell no. The only thing they have going for them is fact that they didn't have any up-front help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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