parlintm Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 As it stands, assuming Allen walks and Peterson isn't healthy, the Giants top three CBs are Webster, Deloatch, and Walker. The Giants have a chance to add a veteran CB (who can still play) with 5 Pro Bowls on his resume as a short-term stop-gap. I don't understand why anyone would be against this move ... there aren't many better alternatives. Also, both Webster and Madison are press CBs who work best in bump-and-run coverage. On a team with DEs like Strahan and Osi, CBs with those skills are very useful. I agree completely. If the Giants can sign a top CB (Madison or Law come to mind), I think they instantly become SB contenders. We can fill our other needs through the draft. Getting a quality, starting CB is BY FAR the biggest priority and in my opinion, the only one that can't be done through the draft. What do you think the price on Madison and Law will be if there is an agreement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pizan Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Is there a link to the actual article? or is this idle conjecture This from KFFL.com Giants | Team to meet with Madison Monday Mon, 6 Mar 2006 06:02:33 -0800 Alex Marvez, of the Sun-Sentinel, reports agent Drew Rosenhaus said Sunday night, March 5, on Channel 7 (WSVN-TV) that free agent CB Sam Madison (Dolphins) will meet with the New York Giants Monday, March 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nutty Sack Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Let me repeat myself please. We have the two best ends in the league who despite being nuetralized with double teaming on every play still put up great sack numbers. The real problem is that there is no pressure to the QB from the middle giving ample time to set up and throw. Yes the secondary needs help but the first priority is to cut down on the QB's and receivers time to connect. Lets get the best DT to be a prescence up the middle so that the secondary doesn't have to work so hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
420 Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Let me repeat myself please. Like you don't all day anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Money Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Let me repeat myself please. We have the two best ends in the league who despite being nuetralized with double teaming on every play still put up great sack numbers. The real problem is that there is no pressure to the QB from the middle giving ample time to set up and throw. Yes the secondary needs help but the first priority is to cut down on the QB's and receivers time to connect. Lets get the best DT to be a prescence up the middle so that the secondary doesn't have to work so hard. Sign Madison. Draft Bunkley and Jason Allen or Donte Whitner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parlintm Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Let me repeat myself please. We have the two best ends in the league who despite being nuetralized with double teaming on every play still put up great sack numbers. The real problem is that there is no pressure to the QB from the middle giving ample time to set up and throw. Yes the secondary needs help but the first priority is to cut down on the QB's and receivers time to connect. Lets get the best DT to be a prescence up the middle so that the secondary doesn't have to work so hard. Having a gread Dline doesnt matter if your CB's have to give the receivers a 10 yard cushion. The DT job is to stop the run, not get to the QB. Yes we could upgrade here, but getting a better CB is a bigger priority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Money Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 I've got the Giants going LB, DT, CB in rounds 1-3. For the LBer in round 1, I'm thinking Ernie Sims, DeMeco Ryans, or Bobby Carpenter. For DT in round 2, I'm looking at Claude Wroten or Roderique Wright. For CB in round 3, I'm thinking Anwar Phillips or Will Blackmon. And in case you're curious, I'd go WR in round 4 with Cory Rodgers, Devin Aromashodu, or Brandon Marshall. I've also got the Giants signing a veteran CB (Will Allen, Ronde Barber, Ricky Manning Jr, Ike Taylor, or apparently Sam Madison). I've also got the Giants getting an OLB via free agency (Will Witherspoon, Lavar Arrington, Julian Peterson, Cato June). I've also got the Giants finding a free agent safety (Cory Chavous, Adam Archuleta, or Chris Hope). Chances are we get another backup QB to replace either Lorenzen or Hasselbeck, but that move won't be major I don't think. I would not be opposed to having both these guys back. Draft players, not positions... Also, the Giants do not have the cap flexibility to get 3 of the free agents you listed ... they'd be lucky to get two... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boohyah Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Let me repeat myself please. We have the two best ends in the league who despite being nuetralized with double teaming on every play still put up great sack numbers. The real problem is that there is no pressure to the QB from the middle giving ample time to set up and throw. Yes the secondary needs help but the first priority is to cut down on the QB's and receivers time to connect. Lets get the best DT to be a prescence up the middle so that the secondary doesn't have to work so hard. Wow, now that's FAB!. No team can afford to double, double teaming ends. A full back may block down on an end but he won't stay in the block. Our Tackles did a good job getting pressure, they got no help from guys like Brent Alexader and Terrell Buckley. Our Secondary should always would hard don't you think?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesShowMeTheWay Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Wow, now that's FAB!. No team can afford to double, double teaming ends. A full back may block down on an end but he won't stay in the block. Our Tackles did a good job getting pressure, they got no help from guys like Brent Alexader and Terrell Buckley. Our Secondary should always would hard don't you think?? This is one of the reasons I like Thomas Howard in the draft because he's a good blitzing LB. I'm not sure whether his stock has risen or dropped due to the combine yet but if we could get him in the 2nd, he's a great talent at the position and could prove to be one of the best in a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Let me repeat myself please. We have the two best ends in the league who despite being nuetralized with double teaming on every play still put up great sack numbers. The real problem is that there is no pressure to the QB from the middle giving ample time to set up and throw. Yes the secondary needs help but the first priority is to cut down on the QB's and receivers time to connect. Lets get the best DT to be a prescence up the middle so that the secondary doesn't have to work so hard. absolutely 100% agreed! its not being talked about nearly enough. Pressure needs to come from the middle as well as to limit the double teams on the ends. IF we dont have those DT's that can do that then we need to blitz up the middle and stunt and do the types of things that will keep our ends one on one more. Both ends maybe the best in the league and its time we create more opporunitys for them and others. Joseph must sit ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plax 4 Prez Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 In my "What Accorsi will actually do" link -- Madison fits in. When I wrote it, he wasn't on the market but now that he is, he's actually a better fit than law. I would be suprised if Accorsi didnt sign a top CB. I'd rather have Deshea Townsend...he's younger and could have some solid seasons with us... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gateb Posted March 6, 2006 Author Share Posted March 6, 2006 As it stands, assuming Allen walks and Peterson isn't healthy, the Giants top three CBs are Webster, Deloatch, and Walker. The Giants have a chance to add a veteran CB (who can still play) with 5 Pro Bowls on his resume as a short-term stop-gap. I don't understand why anyone would be against this move ... there aren't many better alternatives. Also, both Webster and Madison are press CBs who work best in bump-and-run coverage. On a team with DEs like Strahan and Osi, CBs with those skills are very useful. Agreed 100%. I don't really think you can go wrong with this type of player. He would be sure to be a help with guys like Webster. But if the new CBA does get done like anticipated now, then will the Dolphins bring him back with their extra money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxi-xxv Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Draft players, not positions... Also, the Giants do not have the cap flexibility to get 3 of the free agents you listed ... they'd be lucky to get two... unless of course the new CBA gets approved and the cap goes to the expected 104-110, but in that case all the teams would have extra coin to spend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Money Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Agreed 100%. I don't really think you can go wrong with this type of player. He would be sure to be a help with guys like Webster. But if the new CBA does get done like anticipated now, then will the Dolphins bring him back with their extra money? No, he was cut outright. He is free to sign with anyone he wants, unlike other player whose fates are predicated on the outcome of the CBA negotiations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Money Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 unless of course the new CBA gets approved and the cap goes to the expected 104-110, but in that case all the teams would have extra coin to spend. Yep ... if the CBA gets approved and the cap expands to $107 million or so, then this year's UFAs are the big winners. That's why I think it's vital that the Giants sign Madison prior to the new CBA (assuming it gets completed), otherwise he will be more expensive. I would not be surprised if Madison and Rosenhaus decide to wait for the CBA to go through in order to get more money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Money Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 absolutely 100% agreed! its not being talked about nearly enough. Pressure needs to come from the middle as well as to limit the double teams on the ends. IF we dont have those DT's that can do that then we need to blitz up the middle and stunt and do the types of things that will keep our ends one on one more. Both ends maybe the best in the league and its time we create more opporunitys for them and others. Joseph must sit ! Not sure what you have against Joseph ... he played well last year. Did you notice the drop-off in performance after he got injured? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goliath Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 In the event that we do sign CB Sam Madison of the Miami Dolphins, Goliath would support that transaction. He's a very good player, a former probowler who could come right in and contribute while teaching Corey Webster, Curtis Deloatch and WAIT FOR IT, WAIT FOR IT...Antonio Cromartie. Madison would be an upgrade over Will Allen. The only two negatives are his age and his demands money-wise. And if you read that article in the NY Post by Paul Schwartz, it says that Will Peterson's damage to his back is permanent. It says that he will never play the same again. So I assume that he will be cut and Will Allen will walk And the starters will be Sammy Madison and Cromartie, Webster and Deloatch competing for the #2 spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goliath Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Draft players, not positions... Also, the Giants do not have the cap flexibility to get 3 of the free agents you listed ... they'd be lucky to get two... Money, that concept has changed for many teams. Now it goes by either system or draft the best player available at a needed position. But I agree, draft the BPA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
so-cal dub Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 gateb, in the future don't make thread titles that are cliffhangers ... make them as specific as possible ... I'll edit the title for the time being... You should type that in German next time.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxi-xxv Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 In the event that we do sign CB Sam Madison of the Miami Dolphins, Goliath would support that transaction.He's a very good player, a former probowler who could come right in and contribute while teaching Corey Webster, Curtis Deloatch and WAIT FOR IT, WAIT FOR IT...Antonio Cromartie. Madison would be an upgrade over Will Allen. The only two negatives are his age and his demands money-wise. And if you read that article in the NY Post by Paul Schwartz, it says that Will Peterson's damage to his back is permanent. It says that he will never play the same again. So I assume that he will be cut and Will Allen will walk And the starters will be Sammy Madison and Cromartie, Webster and Deloatch competing for the #2 spot. speaking of yourself in the 3rd person is very dickish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesShowMeTheWay Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Ricky Manning is an RFA. He's not going anywhere this year... A tender can still be offered. It may be worth a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Money Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 You should type that in German next time.. Nein! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Money Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 A tender can still be offered. It may be worth a shot. And give up a 3rd round pick for him? No thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Money Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Money, that concept has changed for many teams. Now it goes by either system or draft the best player available at a needed position. But I agree, draft the BPA BPA/Need is the accepted draft strategy. But, gmenroc was suggesting we enter the draft with a laundry list (a different concept altogether) ... that's a silly approach. If we decided pre-draft to take a DT in the 1st round, but at pick 25 the best DT available grades out as a 3rd rounder, then the laundry list is problematized, is it not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxi-xxv Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Yep ... if the CBA gets approved and the cap expands to $107 million or so, then this year's UFAs are the big winners. That's why I think it's vital that the Giants sign Madison prior to the new CBA (assuming it gets completed), otherwise he will be more expensive. I would not be surprised if Madison and Rosenhaus decide to wait for the CBA to go through in order to get more money... yeah no doubt and I am sure that was the thinking with some recent signings like Alexander and now apparently Chris Hovan and the apparent signing of Ben Leber by the Vikes(something that saddens me) I wonder if there is some odd chance that if the CBA is done and we get that extra money we make a play at Arrington? Probably not, but I still remember this guy at Penn State and he was such a good player. My guess is the teams that are grosssly over the cap will be able to at least make some signings and the teams that are under will act the same as they would have under the 94.5 mil number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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