BurnThePhilFans Posted December 11, 2007 Share Posted December 11, 2007 Say what you will about Coach Fassel, but the guy knew how to utilize Shockey. He split Shockey out wide and wasn't afraid to throw deep to him. Coughlin/Gilbride keep Shockey at the line nearly all the time, barely utilize him, and when they do utilize him its at very predictable times (ex. goal line situations). I am not a Coughlin basher by any stretch, but he is severely under utilizing a guy that could have revolutionized the position. If I had to pick anyone in the NFL who have been screwed out of a few great years of their career because of how they are utilized, it would clearly be Shockey. Its only a matter of time before he will look elsewhere to get more balls thrown to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxi-xxv Posted December 11, 2007 Share Posted December 11, 2007 I have never seen a fanbase overrate a player more so than we Giant fans do with Jeremy Shockey. There are a couple of things that I think Giant fans must come to grips with. 1)he is not the player he was in 2002/03 because of the abuse his body took, that physically was the best we were going to see from him. 2)He drops a ton of balls. 3)He is not even the best TE in his own division and very well might be #3. 4)he is maddeningly dumb, has run the wrong routes for years, whiffs on blocks, not because he is lazy, but because he does not know the plays. 5)he is selfish. I think when all Giant fans start to admit these things as I did the past year, you will appreciate him now for what he is, an average to at times above average TE, but not to be mentioned with the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted December 11, 2007 Share Posted December 11, 2007 i think you're both right- he's not as good as we thought he was but he is under-utilized- and each may be a product of the other. tony gonzalez isn't given even half as much blocking responsibility as shockey. neither is dallas clark or whitten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 i agree w/ blue. he's far from flawless but his blocking his improved a lot since his rookie year making him more of an all-around te than a pass catching force, but i think his numbers would be way better on different teams or for different coaches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nesta Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Is it just me, or has he put on so much muscle that he no longer has wr speed. He used to be a sure thing vs a lb, but now.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 i think you're both right- he's not as good as we thought he was but he is under-utilized- and each may be a product of the other. tony gonzalez isn't given even half as much blocking responsibility as shockey. neither is dallas clark or whitten. My sentiment exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurnThePhilFans Posted December 12, 2007 Author Share Posted December 12, 2007 900 yards in his rookie year wasn't a fluke... if we use him better you would see that. Yes he drops balls, but he is still capable of 800 yard seasons, not the trash numbers he has now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 900 yards in his rookie year wasn't a fluke... if we use him better you would see that. Yes he drops balls, but he is still capable of 800 yard seasons, not the trash numbers he has now. he's a major contributor on a 9-4 team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishgutmartyr Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 I have never seen a fanbase overrate a player more so than we Giant fans do with Jeremy Shockey. There are a couple of things that I think Giant fans must come to grips with. 1)he is not the player he was in 2002/03 because of the abuse his body took, that physically was the best we were going to see from him. 2)He drops a ton of balls. 3)He is not even the best TE in his own division and very well might be #3. 4)he is maddeningly dumb, has run the wrong routes for years, whiffs on blocks, not because he is lazy, but because he does not know the plays. 5)he is selfish. I think when all Giant fans start to admit these things as I did the past year, you will appreciate him now for what he is, an average to at times above average TE, but not to be mentioned with the best. Wow, I knew he dropped off this year, but I didn't realize by how much! He's 3rd in the division this season, and it's not close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treehugger Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Aside from TDs (partially his own fault) his stats are pretty consistant. link I thought he'd see more balls with Tiki gone. We're all over the coaches for being too pass happy as it is, where should the extra passes come from? Plax or Amani? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Aside from TDs (partially his own fault) his stats are pretty consistant. link I thought he'd see more balls with Tiki gone. We're all over the coaches for being too pass happy as it is, where should the extra passes come from? Plax or Amani? I'd have to say from the incompletions early on in the game. Shockey needs to be the focal point of our passing attack early. Then when the defense focuses on him Plax and Toomer will have an easier time getting open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treehugger Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 I'd have to say from the incompletions early on in the game. Shockey needs to be the focal point of our passing attack early. Then when the defense focuses on him Plax and Toomer will have an easier time getting open. I agree with that completely. The 5-15 yard range between the LBs and Safeties needs to be the primary threat in the passing game, not the 30 yard bombs down the sideline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gspotter Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Having come off a career game a few weeks ago and being asked to stay in and block so often, I can't imagine what prompts this nonsense. No we don't use him the way Fassel did. Yes, he can be a force to reckon with... you want Howard Cross back? Do you look at how many teams have elite TE's...not many. Yes, he could make more catches and I don't know if we keep him or not, certainly not for big money, but he is still a stud. This conversation cannot be measured by yards or points, he stays in too often. Instead, we should all relax and be glad we have him. The wild child of his first two years was an unusual situation, can't always use him that way, it wouldn't work... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gspotter Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Having come off a career game a few weeks ago and being asked to stay in and block so often, I can't imagine what prompts this nonsense. No we don't use him the way Fassel did. Yes, he can be a force to reckon with... you want Howard Cross back? Do you look at how many teams have elite TE's...not many. Yes, he could make more catches and I don't know if we keep him or not, certainly not for big money, but he is still a stud. This conversation cannot be measured by yards or points, he stays in too often. Instead, we should all relax and be glad we have him. The wild child of his first two years was an unusual situation, can't always use him that way, it wouldn't work... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Having come off a career game a few weeks ago and being asked to stay in and block so often, I can't imagine what prompts this nonsense. No we don't use him the way Fassel did. Yes, he can be a force to reckon with... you want Howard Cross back? Do you look at how many teams have elite TE's...not many. Yes, he could make more catches and I don't know if we keep him or not, certainly not for big money, but he is still a stud. This conversation cannot be measured by yards or points, he stays in too often. Instead, we should all relax and be glad we have him. The wild child of his first two years was an unusual situation, can't always use him that way, it wouldn't work... G- that's what a lot of us were saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boohyah Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 There's about 20-25 teams in the league right now that if he became an unrestricted free agent, they'd have major interest in him...........he sucks so much. I love how upset people get at guys like Shockey because they are emotional and demonstrative. Honestly, it's getting to the point that even with him getting open in the endzone and Manning missing him by almost 2 yards, that Shockey didn't get open enough!. But guys like Witten would have gotten a pass on that. It's tiring, he's a good Tight end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishgutmartyr Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Aside from TDs (partially his own fault) his stats are pretty consistant. link I thought he'd see more balls with Tiki gone. We're all over the coaches for being too pass happy as it is, where should the extra passes come from? Plax or Amani? Simultaneously, his stats are consistant, and yet Coughlin isn't using him like Fassel did. Not suggesting you say that, Tree. Having come off a career game a few weeks ago and being asked to stay in and block so often, I can't imagine what prompts this nonsense. No we don't use him the way Fassel did. Yes, he can be a force to reckon with... you want Howard Cross back? Do you look at how many teams have elite TE's...not many. Yes, he could make more catches and I don't know if we keep him or not, certainly not for big money, but he is still a stud. This conversation cannot be measured by yards or points, he stays in too often. Instead, we should all relax and be glad we have him. The wild child of his first two years was an unusual situation, can't always use him that way, it wouldn't work... His best year was 2005, going by Tree's stats. He had his highest average per catch, most touchdowns and was only 3 yards below his rookie season in total yards. And he sat there and bitched about having to block that year. 2005 New York Giants 15 15 65 891 13.7 59 7 -- But these are the stats I care about. Witten, Cooley, Shockey stats for this season: 2007 Dallas Cowboys 13 13 80 955 11.9 53 7 2007 Washington Redskins 13 13 58 677 11.7 39T 7 2007 New York Giants 13 13 55 601 10.9 29 3 If his stats are consistent with past years, what does that tell you? I'm sure baltimore, washington, dallas, san diego, cleveland, pittsburgh, indianapolis, kansas city, and green bay are chomping at the bit to get him; although Heap is also having a sub-par season. The man is simply not a "stud." He's better than average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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