Red Sox win Daisuke Matsuzaka

[Blue Jeans]

The Red Sox bid $42 million for the rights to Daisuke Matsuzaka, sources told ESPN's Peter Gammons, and Boston's bid far exceeded any other team's offer.

 

Added confirmation that the reports were right. Gammons didn't have info on any of the other bid amounts, though SI's Jon Heyman said he believed the Mets and Yankees both bid around $30 million. If the Red Sox won Matsuzaka's rights, they'll have 30 days to work out a contract with the right-hander. It's been speculated that Matsuzaka would much rather go to the Yankees, but since he can't become a free agent before April 2008, it'd be risky for him to turn down a big offer now.

[so-cal dub]

The Red Sox bid $42 million for the rights to Daisuke Matsuzaka, sources told ESPN's Peter Gammons, and Boston's bid far exceeded any other team's offer.

 

Added confirmation that the reports were right. Gammons didn't have info on any of the other bid amounts, though SI's Jon Heyman said he believed the Mets and Yankees both bid around $30 million. If the Red Sox won Matsuzaka's rights, they'll have 30 days to work out a contract with the right-hander. It's been speculated that Matsuzaka would much rather go to the Yankees, but since he can't become a free agent before April 2008, it'd be risky for him to turn down a big offer now.

Gammons reported it, I dont believe it.

[K3VIN]

the ghey sox can have him for 42 million.

[Virginia Giant]

Basically they committed around$70 - $80 million on an unproven flach in the pan pitcher. When did Tom Hicks buy the Redsocks?

[so-cal dub]

Basically they committed around$70 - $80 million on an unproven flach in the pan pitcher. When did Tom Hicks buy the Redsocks?

The Sox fans can no longer say we bought a team..never again! They go and pay all that for DM, then sign JD Drew for a boat load(forget exactly how much like 40 mil range, but it was waste anyway).

 

Welcome to over paying, and ending up with nothing. We are now level petty.

[gateb]

The Sox fans can no longer say we bought a team..never again! They go and pay all that for DM, then sign JD Drew for a boat load(forget exactly how much like 40 mil range, but it was waste anyway).

 

Welcome to over paying, and ending up with nothing. We are now level petty.

Wait, they signed Drew? Am I missing something?

[mickeef2]

Wait, they signed Drew? Am I missing something?

 

Yeah, you're missing the fact that Tubby doesn't know what he's talking about.

[so-cal dub]

Yeah, you're missing the fact that Tubby doesn't know what he's talking about.

Sorry, it BEEN reported that by your idol, Gammons. And I do know what I'm talking about, you guys cant talk shit about the Yanks over spending on flops and wash-ups.

[Blue Jeans]

When did they sign Drew?

[so-cal dub]

When did they sign Drew?

Welcome to the party.

 

I corrected myself allready, read-up.

[mickeef2]

Sorry, it BEEN reported that by your idol, Gammons.

 

lol For the record, I've never mentioned Gammons name here until this post. Nice try to deflect attention away from your stupidity, though. For the record as well, Gammons never reported that. You might be too stupid to talk baseball, junior.

[LorfTVP]

The Red Sox spent 51 million dollars to win the posting rights to Daisuke Matsuzaka. JD Drew, still unsigned, is considered the favorite for the Red Sox' right field slot. I'm tired of all these bullshit "Red Sox are spending money now" arguments. Honestly, the posting process has nothing to do with the team's payroll and it will hurt us while we try to recoup through the opportunities opened by Matsuzaka's signing including merchandise and international recognition. At least a portion of the 51 million dollars will be regained. Say the Red Sox pay 13 million a year for Matsuzaka and 12 million a year for Drew, it's true that that adds 25 million to the payroll, but we've lost the salaries of players such as Trot Nixon as well. We'll see where the Red Sox end up in terms of payroll by the end of the offseason but with new rules, we're well within our rights. Watch, the Yankees will still sign a starting pitcher at upwards of 13-14 million themselves. The Red Sox are a shrewd organization and will find a way to keep payroll down through trades or any number of intelligent moves. This whole "Mini-Yankees" thing is just pissing me the fuck off.

[so-cal dub]

The Red Sox spent 51 million dollars to win the posting rights to Daisuke Matsuzaka. JD Drew, still unsigned, is considered the favorite for the Red Sox' right field slot. I'm tired of all these bullshit "Red Sox are spending money now" arguments. Honestly, the posting process has nothing to do with the team's payroll and it will hurt us while we try to recoup through the opportunities opened by Matsuzaka's signing including merchandise and international recognition. At least a portion of the 51 million dollars will be regained. Say the Red Sox pay 13 million a year for Matsuzaka and 12 million a year for Drew, it's true that that adds 25 million to the payroll, but we've lost the salaries of players such as Trot Nixon as well. We'll see where the Red Sox end up in terms of payroll by the end of the offseason but with new rules, we're well within our rights. Watch, the Yankees will still sign a starting pitcher at upwards of 13-14 million themselves. The Red Sox are a shrewd organization and will find a way to keep payroll down through trades or any number of intelligent moves. This whole "Mini-Yankees" thing is just pissing me the fuck off.

Thanks Lorf. Mickeef, blow me you cockless fackwad! Nice effort making it seem as though I dont know what I'm talking about, you fricken butt pirate.

[jambrosio]

yankees might go with what they have:

 

In the Bronx, while Cashman is wiping his roster clean of players (Gary Sheffield and Jaret Wright) that insiders say he wanted nothing to do with in the first place, word is that he's focusing on his minor league depth as much as the improvements needed to improve his club at the major league level.

Frankly, that's unheard of for a Yankee GM not named Gene Michael, but a clear message to the rest of baseball that the Yankees are not going to squander their young players for someone else's costly mistakes.

 

Of course, that won't stop dopey sportswriters from proposing lopsided deals, as we learned in last week's Rumor Mill.

 

More importantly, Cashman's growing role as a major player and power broker is scaring the "bejeezus" out of the mid-market teams, says one MLB scout, who says that "a Yankee team looking at the big picture and long-term franchise screws up the market.

 

"Teams that call the Yankees are facing the reality that Cashman actually wants All-Star caliber players in return for his highly-rated prospects, not the one-dimensional veterans that used to litter the Yankee roster every year. That's bad for baseball."

 

Well, that's nonsense. But is sure is thought-provoking, to say the least.

 

Another baseball official, who was recently rebuffed by the Yankees in one trade discussion, said that "Cashman is telling teams that (Phillip) Hughes is not available -- under any circumstances."

 

According to others, however, the Yankees are "very much in the market for another veteran starter, likely a left-hander". If this is the case, wouldn't it be interesting to discuss which one would make the most sense?

 

Not if it's based on fantasy, said one AL scout.:

 

"The Yankees may think about Ted Lilly, but they've been there, done that. The Yankees can't get Willis without Hughes, and Mark Mulder's health is a concern. Honestly, I see the Yankees going with kids and the guys they already have."

[so-cal dub]

yankees might go with what they have:

 

QUOTE

In the Bronx, while Cashman is wiping his roster clean of players (Gary Sheffield and Jaret Wright) that insiders say he wanted nothing to do with in the first place, word is that he's focusing on his minor league depth as much as the improvements needed to improve his club at the major league level.

Frankly, that's unheard of for a Yankee GM not named Gene Michael, but a clear message to the rest of baseball that the Yankees are not going to squander their young players for someone else's costly mistakes.

 

Of course, that won't stop dopey sportswriters from proposing lopsided deals, as we learned in last week's Rumor Mill.

 

More importantly, Cashman's growing role as a major player and power broker is scaring the "bejeezus" out of the mid-market teams, says one MLB scout, who says that "a Yankee team looking at the big picture and long-term franchise screws up the market.

 

"Teams that call the Yankees are facing the reality that Cashman actually wants All-Star caliber players in return for his highly-rated prospects, not the one-dimensional veterans that used to litter the Yankee roster every year. That's bad for baseball."

 

Well, that's nonsense. But is sure is thought-provoking, to say the least.

 

Another baseball official, who was recently rebuffed by the Yankees in one trade discussion, said that "Cashman is telling teams that (Phillip) Hughes is not available -- under any circumstances."

 

According to others, however, the Yankees are "very much in the market for another veteran starter, likely a left-hander". If this is the case, wouldn't it be interesting to discuss which one would make the most sense?

 

Not if it's based on fantasy, said one AL scout.:

 

"The Yankees may think about Ted Lilly, but they've been there, done that. The Yankees can't get Willis without Hughes, and Mark Mulder's health is a concern. Honestly, I see the Yankees going with kids and the guys they already have."

I'd be content with signing Lilly as a 5th. You have to factor in Pavano and his nonstop yeast infections. If he does get his pussy baking bread again, bring up Hughes or Sanchez and let em rip. I like hearing this, Cashmoney using his head now, and not Georgie's. Please be true.

[LorfTVP]

I still see the Yankees trying to sign a frontline starter considering their rotation is Johnson, Mussina, Wang, and Pavano so far, two coming off of surgeries. Let's say that you go with what you have and Hughes wins the fifth slot, that won't stand a chance compared to the Red Sox rotation of Schilling, Beckett, Matsuzaka, Papelbon, and Wakefield. Well, I'm stretching it a bit, but out of these two theoretical rotations, I think the Red Sox' is better. I don't see the Yankees standing pat...I mean, they'll try to sign someone, whether or not they do is another story.

[jambrosio]

I still see the Yankees trying to sign a frontline starter considering their rotation is Johnson, Mussina, Wang, and Pavano so far, two coming off of surgeries. Let's say that you go with what you have and Hughes wins the fifth slot, that won't stand a chance compared to the Red Sox rotation of Schilling, Beckett, Matsuzaka, Papelbon, and Wakefield. Well, I'm stretching it a bit, but out of these two theoretical rotations, I think the Red Sox' is better. I don't see the Yankees standing pat...I mean, they'll try to sign someone, whether or not they do is another story.

hey you never know, by the end of the season, our starting rotation might be wang, mussina, hughes, clippard, rasner, why frankly doesnt bother me at all... personally, schilling getting old doesnt scare me all that much anymore, beckett after last year's performance, you cant rely on him... wakefield, his age is going to bring down his production eventually, papelbon truthfully is an unproven starter right now as well, which leaves you with matsuzaka, and despite the fact i wanted him on the yankees, if you do happen to follow through and sign him, he is also unproven.

[so-cal dub]

I still see the Yankees trying to sign a frontline starter considering their rotation is Johnson, Mussina, Wang, and Pavano so far, two coming off of surgeries. Let's say that you go with what you have and Hughes wins the fifth slot, that won't stand a chance compared to the Red Sox rotation of Schilling, Beckett, Matsuzaka, Papelbon, and Wakefield. Well, I'm stretching it a bit, but out of these two theoretical rotations, I think the Red Sox' is better. I don't see the Yankees standing pat...I mean, they'll try to sign someone, whether or not they do is another story.

You gotta be kidding me right? Paplebon, has never proven himself as a starter. DM is a totally unknown and Wakefield is old news. Please, our staff is even if not better.

[Herc]

yanks will sign gil meche

[Ditto]

yanks will sign gil meche

For what, batting practice? We just unloaded a Jarrett Wright. We're better off going with our youth.

 

I can't believe the Sox went with $51 mil. They have to negotiate with Matsuzuka yet.

[mickeef2]

They signed JD Drew

 

 

JD Drew, still unsigned...

 

 

Thanks Lorf.

 

Yup, sounds like Lorf was saying you know exactly what you're talking about.

[LorfTVP]

hey you never know, by the end of the season, our starting rotation might be wang, mussina, hughes, clippard, rasner, why frankly doesnt bother me at all... personally, schilling getting old doesnt scare me all that much anymore, beckett after last year's performance, you cant rely on him... wakefield, his age is going to bring down his production eventually, papelbon truthfully is an unproven starter right now as well, which leaves you with matsuzaka, and despite the fact i wanted him on the yankees, if you do happen to follow through and sign him, he is also unproven.

 

Okay, do we have to play the merit game again? You're just throwing out the worst possibilities of every single Red Sox starting pitcher.

 

Curt Schilling - Despite no longer being a number one starter in terms of performance, what is there to complain about a guy who starts 31 games with a 3.97 era, 183 Ks, and a 1.22 WHIP which ranked sixth in the league. He once again led the league in K/BB ratio with 6.54, heads and shoulders above the next closest competitor Johan Santana who had 5.21 K/BB. Even with his age, his knowledge of the game and continued ability to pitch will allow him to lead our staff.

 

Josh Beckett - Beckett (finally) proved that he could last a full year in 2006. Despite finishing with a career high 5.01 era, his WHIP (1.29 vs. 1.25) and his BAA (.245 vs. .237) are both within career norms. In fact, his .245 BAA was 12th in the majors last year. His major problems were his 36 longballs, by far a career high, and his inability to effectively use his changeup which he avoided all year. With a new pitching coach and a year in the AL East under his belt, there's no reason to think that Beckett can't lower his HR rate. With his peripherals, his era should have been closer to 4 than 5.

 

Daisuke Matsuzaka - Presuming that he is signed, you can't use the "unproven" argument. He's dominated the NPB for six years and strutted his stuff during the WBC, dominating opponents. "The Hardball Times ran an article projecting a couple of different scenarios for Matsuzaka, the worst-case scenario pinning Matsuzaka at an ERA around 3.50, which would be very respectable here in the states, but not necessarily worth $100 million, or a high draft pick. However, the great Matsuzaka Watch ran their own analysis using Jim Albright’s formula and came up with the following numbers: 17 Wins, 181 Ks, 2.52 ERA, and 1.04 WHIP." Now, the problems with Matsuzaka arise when you consider his PAP (Pitcher Abuse Points). Based off of his statistics last year, he ranked as being abused more than Carlos Zambrano and Livan Hernandez. Also consider that in Japan, he had an extra day of rest in between starts. In the states, despite one less day of rest, he should be treated with kid gloves and injuries shouldn't play too big a role. There isn't any reason for Matsuzaka not to become a force initially. Worst case scenario, he fits the number three slot from which he'll be pitching. Best case scenario, he's an ace.

 

Jonathon Papelbon - Papelbon had about a 2.56 era in 48 starts between A+ and AAA. He proved in three starts at the end of 2005 that he could start. With an offseason of training and conditioning for the starter's role, Papelbon could well have a mid 3 era throughout the year. The reason that there have been so few questions surrounding Papelbon's return to the rotation is because of the confidence throughout the organization. I must admit though, that of everyone in the Red Sox starting rotation, Papelbon has the least certainty surrounding him as to his performance.

 

Tim Wakefield - Wakefield was actually our best starter until his injury in early June. Throughout the years, he has been a model of consistency, and before his injury, his era stood at 4.05 after 18 starts. Ahh, the magic of the knuckleballer.

 

As for the Yankees rotation...

 

Randy Johnson - His statistics were nearly identical to Beckett's last year. He still strikes guys out and is learning to evolve with his diminishing fastball. I would be surprised to see him pull a Mussina next year, despite the surgery, as he becomes a smarter pitcher. Thing is, he is coming off of surgery and his old. His stats don't give as much hope as Schilling but he'll still be a good pitcher. There's no denying his diminishing skills though.

 

Mike Mussina - I was honestly as surprised as anybody by Mussina's resurgence last year. I thought that he was done, but hey, you guys got lucky. Being the smart pitcher that he is, I see no reason that Mussina can't keep this up and continue to be one of the best pitchers on your staff.

 

Chien-Mien Wang - Talk about surprises, here's Wang. He still gives up too many hits and his WHIP and BAA are too high, but as a sinkerball pitcher, he can get away with it. He is lucky enough to avoid the Derek Lowe references by not being a nutcase (a positive). I do have to say that he was slightly on the lucky side, finishing second in the majors in GDPs. As with most pitchers of his type, his performance may vary based on defense. His inability to strike people out could hurt him as well.

 

After these three, there are no guarantees in the Yankee rotation. Is Pavano going to recover from his multitude of injuries and perform? There are young guys with hopes of entering the rotation but they are unproven, unlike Matsuzaka who has performed in Japan and on the world stage. SoCal, "Please, our staff is even if not better", that's complete bull. Both of our staffs have questions, as they do every year, but beyond Wang and Mussina, there are no sure things in your rotation. I still think the Yankees are going to sign a top tier starter, and if not, there are a bunch on a lower tier that they can throw into the fourth or fifth slot...the likes of Suppan, Padilla, Wolf, etc. The Red Sox will have three flame throwing 26 year old righthanders next year in Beckett, Papelbon, and Matsuzaka and two elders bracketing them. As of now, you have one young guy in Wang and a young guy with the body of a geriatric in Pavano. I admit that the Red Sox rotation is pretty much set so I can't really compare with the Yankees' yet, but I don't see how you can argue that the Yankee rotation, in its current state, is better than the Red Sox'.

[Ditto]

If the Sox are really serious about signing Matsuzaka, and that’s a big ‘if’, I would give them a slight edge in the starter dept. as of now. In my opinion, though, you will see two, and possibly three rookies added to our pitching staff that would put us over the top. (I’m hoping, anyway)

 

You underestimate Wang. It doesn’t matter that he has a low SO count. He gets ‘em when he needs ‘em. He has also been improving with each outing, and you’ll probably see him call his own games next season.

[LorfTVP]

If the Sox are really serious about signing Matsuzaka, and that’s a big ‘if’, I would give them a slight edge in the starter dept. as of now. In my opinion, though, you will see two, and possibly three rookies added to our pitching staff that would put us over the top. (I’m hoping, anyway)

 

You underestimate Wang. It doesn’t matter that he has a low SO count. He gets ‘em when he needs ‘em. He has also been improving with each outing, and you’ll probably see him call his own games next season.

 

I don't understand where you get this "slight" idea from. You are comparing rookies vs. proven major league veterans. How would rookies put you over the top? I mean sure, they could perform out of the gate, but you have to realize, for every Verlander and Liriano there's a Billingsley or Cain. Your pitchers, though good, aren't the tops in the minor leagues and they will undoubtedly have their share of growing pains. I'm saying this from experience with the likes of Lester, Hansen, Delcarmen, and Alvarez of the Red Sox. Clearly, at this point, the Red Sox starting rotation is stronger, and I won't budge until I hear a reasonable argument against that. As for Wang, he's a smart guy and he's surviving, but based off of the type of pitcher he is, I'm simply saying that there's a lot of luck involved. Not getting the key SO or DP at the right time could mean danger. I'm trying my best to be objective in my analysis of the Red Sox vs. Yankees, though bias will creep in. I will admit that the Yankee's offense and bullpen are better than the Red Sox but the Red Sox clearly have rotation if things stand. If the Yankees were to get Schmidt, I'd reconsider.

[Ditto]

I won’t even mention Hughes, but the Yankees haven’t seen enough of Karstens and Rasner to make an honest assessment. When they were pitching regularly, they showed a lot of promise against good line ups, more so than the likes of RJ and Pavano. And Wang has shown he can get the SO and DP when needed.

 

Incidentally, Proctor will be given a chance to make the rotation this year, and I still won’t count out Sean Henn.

 

IMO, if the Sox want to compete with the Yanks pitching wise, even if the sign Matsusaka, they better go after Zito or Schmidt.