JackStroud Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Or is this just a business, like any other where filling the seats is #1, and avoidance of controversy #2 Do these people really want to win it all as bad as we do? I think not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMFP Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I'm guessing that is one of the reasons why they've retained Coughlin. They let Parcells and Belichick walk on them....don't think Mara would be too happy if Coughlin went to the 49ers and turned them into a playoff contender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I'm guessing that is one of the reasons why they've retained Coughlin. They let Parcells and Belichick walk on them....don't think Mara would be too happy if Coughlin went to the 49ers and turned them into a playoff contender. not the way i remember it. parcells said he was retiring AFTER Belicheck had left for Cleveland. don't see how they could've salvaged either guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Its one reason why Young ended up hating Parcells because he felt he was being two faced. What Young didn't realize was that Parcells has rules for everyone else and different ones for himself. Ever wonder why someone who can so easily leave from organization to organization always demands total loyalty from his coaches....basically because of his own issues of not trusting and/or inspiring trust in others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Its one reason why Young ended up hating Parcells because he felt he was being two faced. What Young didn't realize was that Parcells has rules for everyone else and different ones for himself. Ever wonder why someone who can so easily leave from organization to organization always demands total loyalty from his coaches....basically because of his own issues of not trusting and/or inspiring trust in others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Hey whats the matter....you actually believe Young could not connect with Parcells after Wellington said he wanted him back because Young did not understand the intricacies of voice mail .... Even though I called him the Prostitute and now the Slut does not mean that I did not want him back at the time instead of Dan Reeves... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Hey whats the matter....you actually believe Young could not connect with Parcells after Wellington said he wanted him back because Young did not understand the intricacies of voice mail .... Even though I called him the Prostitute and now the Slut does not mean that I did not want him back at the time instead of Dan Reeves... never liked reeves. he was a pussy. ray perkins though, he used to scare the crap out of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMFP Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 not the way i remember it. parcells said he was retiring AFTER Belicheck had left for Cleveland. don't see how they could've salvaged either guy. Young could have hired Parcells back....he didn't, a few times. I'll need to dig up the link, but Young had the chance to keep Belichick, but didn't think he had the personality to be a successful head coach. I credit Young for building and dismantling the Giants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Young could have hired Parcells back....he didn't, a few times. I'll need to dig up the link, but Young had the chance to keep Belichick, but didn't think he had the personality to be a successful head coach. I credit Young for building and dismantling the Giants. belicheck said he got the cleveland job, and young said go for it. because tuna was his coach. as far as what happened later, i don't know. when you said he " let them walk", i thought that was pertaining to the time they were actually here. my bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Its one reason why Young ended up hating Parcells because he felt he was being two faced. What Young didn't realize was that Parcells has rules for everyone else and different ones for himself. Ever wonder why someone who can so easily leave from organization to organization always demands total loyalty from his coaches....basically because of his own issues of not trusting and/or inspiring trust in others. You been breaking down films of Parcells? That psycho-analysis is spot on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 You been breaking down films of Parcells? That psycho-analysis is spot on... Not trying to be snarky....its what I do everyday at work whether in straight therapy...or trying to determine the motivations/mind set of any number of substance abusers in my care at my facility....lol. You think there is analysis at the UN or White House...step into a facility whose express purpose is the housing and treatment of 70 long term mentally ill chemical abusers. Its like stepping through the looking glass man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK-Giantsfan Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 never liked reeves. he was a pussy. ray perkins though, he used to scare the crap out of me. if you think Ray Perkins was scary ...........how scary was Ray ''must go'' Handley ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 never liked reeves. he was a pussy. ray perkins though, he used to scare the crap out of me. The man with the gunslinger eyes....his first and true love was to coach after Coach "Bear" Bryant. Interesting anecdote about Coach Bear Bryant. When his university team was playing against another university that had Black players and his team was getting waxed by those said Black players....he supposedly turned to an assistant and said "I wants me some of those....get it done". Another leap forward in integration. Brings a tear to my eye...should be highlighted during Black History Month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 if you think Ray Perkins was scary ...........how scary was Ray ''must go'' Handley ? You mean the "most intelligent man in the world" ...like the Dos Equis Man? I remember reading articles about him after Parcells bailed when it was written he was an expert Blackjack player and a card counter. He would apply his vast intellect toward analyzing his opponents.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Not trying to be snarky....its what I do everyday at work whether in straight therapy...or trying to determine the motivations/mind set of any number of substance abusers in my care at my facility....lol. You think there is analysis at the UN or White House...step into a facility whose express purpose is the housing and treatment of 70 long term mentally ill chemical abusers. Its like stepping through the looking glass man. Man that's awsome. I love psychology... spend 3 of my electives in college to try to figure out why my parents act the way they do... still can't figure it out though . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMFP Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 You mean the "most intelligent man in the world" ...like the Dos Equis Man? I remember reading articles about him after Parcells bailed when it was written he was an expert Blackjack player and a card counter. He would apply his vast intellect toward analyzing his opponents.... This was the guy that George Young thought would be a better fit than Bill Belichick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMFP Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Here's that link regarding the Madness of George Young (from just before Coughlin beat Belichick in the Super Bowl). PHOENIX - The multiple Super Bowl rings, the brilliant game plans, the fashion statement with the gray hoodie and the cutoff sleeves, the reputation-damaging SpyGate scandal, the charming personality. Take the whole package, even with the blemishes. Bill Belichick is headed to Canton. The most embarrassing entry on his resume, until SpyGate, is that former Giants GM George Young designated Ray Handley - Ray Handley - instead of Belichick as the eventual successor to Bill Parcells long before Belichick left for Cleveland. Now that Belichick has a chance to win his fourth Super Bowl with New England and Handley lasted two tumultuous years following Parcells, it's almost inconceivable what happened Now that Belichick has a chance to win his fourth Super Bowl with New England and Handley lasted two tumultuous years following Parcells, it's almost inconceivable what happened. "I don't know why," one Giants insider said. "George had his mind made up. You have to understand, George was a cerebral guy. Ray Handley was a cerebral guy. There is no use dragging that up." Belichick grew up as a coach with the Giants as Parcells' defensive genius. Young deserves credit for changing the culture of the Giants in 1979 when he hired Ray Perkins and then promoted Parcells when Perkins went to Alabama after the 1982 season. But Handley over Belichick? Giants co-owner John Mara, who joined the team full-time right after Belichick left for Cleveland following the Super Bowl 17 years ago, said he was not aware that Young wanted Handley over Belichick, but acknowledged, "I know George had some issues with Belichick." There was increasing speculation that Parcells was preparing to step down. He and Young never patched up their relationship after Young nearly fired Parcells and hired Howard Schnellenberger after Parcells went 3-12-1 in his first season, 1983. Both of Parcells' parents died during that season and Young was concerned that Parcells was overwhelmed. It was common knowledge around the Giants during the 1990 season that Handley, who was Parcells' running backs coach and clock management guru, was going to be Young's choice over Belichick and Tom Coughlin, who was in his third year as the Giants' receivers coach. Belichick and Coughlin have that in common besides meeting in the Super Bowl on Sunday. "To comment on what George's thinking was is really just conjecture," the insider said. So, when Boston College wanted Coughlin as the '90 season came to a close, the Giants didn't stop him, although he remained through the Super Bowl. And when it became evident the Browns were going to hire Belichick immediately after the Super Bowl, Young did not step in to ask him to wait out Parcells, whose future was the talk of Super Bowl week in Tampa. Parcells didn't do the Giants any favors by waiting until May 15, 1991, to resign, more than 3-1/2 months after the Super Bowl. Although he did not say it at the time, Parcells later revealed that heart problems were the reason he left. Parcells took Young off the hook because Belichick and Coughlin were already gone by the time he quit, clearing the way for Young to hire Handley without much second-guessing. Young, who died in 2001 after retiring following the 1997 season, clearly was not a big fan of Belichick. He was not thrilled with Belichick's communication skills and didn't think he was the right fit. It's interesting that Young's protégé, Ernie Accorsi, who was then the Browns' GM, recommended to Art Modell that he hire Belichick. Handley was such a disaster the players staged a mutiny and Young had no choice but to fire him after two seasons. Belichick lasted five seasons in Cleveland, went back to work for Parcells for one year in New England and three with the Jets, before quitting after one day as the HC of the NYJ in 2000 and going to the Patriots. Young also did not consider Belichick when he hired Jim Fassel in 1997. Now all Belichick does is win Super Bowls. New York let him get away twice, which all these years later, could finally be payback for the Red Sox sending Babe Ruth to the Yankees. "Belichick is a Giant at heart," Harry Carson said. "He is very fond of the Giants." Would Belichick have succeeded taking over for Parcells? He wouldn't have been as entertaining, but his defensive players loved him. The Giants obviously would have had a better chance with him than Handley. "I have an affinity for him as everyone knows," Carl Banks said. "I couldn't be happier for him. And for all the people that tried to bury the guy, they can sit and eat crow. I always wish him the best. But I can't sit here and say I hope he beats the Giants." Belichick has remained close to the Giants. When Wellington Mara died in 2005, Belichick came to New York to pay his respects. When the Giants held a luncheon in Manhattan for Carson before training camp in 2006 to honor his upcoming Hall of Fame induction, Belichick attended. It was at that luncheon that Belichick and Parcells became friends again after Belichick's acrimonious departure from the Jets six years earlier. Before the Patriots-Giants game last month, Belichick and John Mara spoke on the field. Belichick told him, "Let's hope we play again." After New England completed its undefeated regular season, Mara and Belichick shook hands outside the Patriots' locker room. It was fitting for Belichick to finish off the 16-0 regular season at Giants Stadium, where he became a cult hero to his Giants players. Young passed on a Hall of Fame coach. Modell fired a Hall of Fame coach. Handley, to this day, has never spoken to the media after he was fired. And now Belichick, the coach in the hoodie, is one victory from completing the greatest season in NFL history. Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/2008/01/28/2008-01-28_giants_blundered_with_ray_handley_hire_l.html#ixzz1A5dqE9cM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMFP Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Regarding the link above, I have to think this has a lot to do with why Mara retained Coughlin. Mara was there when his dad consented to George Young.....he watched Parcells, Belichick, and even Coughlin depart a team that was really close to becoming a dynasty. Mara was there - and couldn't do a thing about it - when George Young refused to consider rehiring Parcells or Belichick when both of them were there for the taking. He was there when Young hired Fasell instead. Mara also saw John Fox and Sean Payton leave, and achieve success. Coughlin, Parcells, and Belichick - they all come from the glory days. So there is a lot of loyalty there, and I'm sure Young's fuck ups have alot to do with Mara's unconditional support of Coughlin. Given all the great coaches that have been mentored within the Giants organization (Lombardi, Landry, Parcells, Belichick, Coughlin, Payton), you've got to credit their front office for attracting and developing coaching talent. And I can understand why they don't kick a Super Bowl winning coach out the door when his biggest crime is a 10 win season. Again, I don't see Coughlin EVER getting fired....he will retire, or else he'll be promoted/transferred into the organization. That's what sets the Giants franchise apart from other teams, and it's one reason why even if players sometimes bump heads with coaching, there is a common bond of respect....that's why when Coughlin was retained, the biggest Giants came forward to voice their support for the move. Management and players don't want change for change's sake. And like Osi said, that 8 minute meltdown was on the players, not the coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishgutmartyr Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 It's not so much the Lombardi as that damn NFC Championship trophy collecting so much fucking dust...it's like a magnet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 This was the guy that George Young thought would be a better fit than Bill Belichick. Yes he considered Belichick's obvious lack of social skills and the ability to gab with his betters (Young, Wellington and above) such a liability that he looked upon Junior Bill like a noisome deposit of dog shit on his loafers...and he was fast looking for a patch of grass to wipe him off in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 It's not so much the Lombardi as that damn NFC Championship trophy collecting so much fucking dust...it's like a magnet. Don't say that to Fassell...he still wears his Championship Ring from 2000....he asked his good buddy Brian Billick if he could wear it though... Fassell: Brian you are my bestest friend forever BFF forever dude, see my ring its not as kool as yours but its nice too Brian: ..."I could give a fuck....thanks for the Superbowl gameplan now run along..." Fassell: Sure Brian...thanks for being BFF's dude addendum: Brian: Wait a minute....I got a job for you bitch...yeah...Offensive Consultant...yeah...consultant...I like that...how about you bitch Fassell: Oh dude that's so dreamy thanks man, I knew you were my BFF....high five bro...no..no high five Brian: Yeah ...yeah...get to work bitch A couple of years later Fassell: Brian I need a ...click....why does Brian keep hanging up on me ....his BFF Brian: Yeah Baltimore Sun please....yes that sniveling he-bitch....all of our offensive woes are his fault...yeah...that's why I fired him...yeah what friends....fuck that ....in his dreams....yeah leave my name out....unnamed highly placed source who was once his BFF..sounds good Brian: Fuck off and drop dead...you've served your purpose and guess what I hope you never get a job in the NFL again....LOLOLOL Fassell: Brian that is so cold dude...but I'm still your friend... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Don't say that to Fassell...he still wears his Championship Ring from 2000....he asked his good buddy Brian Billick if he could wear it though... Fassell: Brian you are my bestest friend forever BFF forever dude, see my ring its not as kool as yours but its nice too Brian: ..."I could give a fuck....thanks for the Superbowl gameplan now run along..." Fassell: Sure Brian...thanks for being BFF's dude Brian: Fuck off and drop dead...you've served your purpose and guess what I hope you never get a job in the NFL again....LOLOLOL Fassell: Brian that is so cold dude...but I'm still your friend... that's almost verbatim. except you left out the "hey be my OC for a year so I can blame it all on you when we suck" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Or is this just a business, like any other where filling the seats is #1, and avoidance of controversy #2 Do these people really want to win it all as bad as we do? I think not. why would they care what we want? they had a season ticket list that was 30 years long at one point. the fans will keep showing up for games so they'll do what they want. coughlin fits the mara mold and that's all that matters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 that's almost verbatim. except you left out the "hey be my OC for a year so I can blame it all on you when we suck" Thanks man....I did not want the crew here to think I was making this shit up....lolololol!!!! I remember even crazy legs Collins was shocked the day of the Superbowl when Fassell told everyone that he was basically ditching what got them there cause of the awesome Ravens Defense and lets go with the plays I drew up on a napkin. How is the Arena League Fassell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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