Update on Shockey trade rumors

[echochamber]

I see... So I should view what's considered to be a drop ball to your standards and not the NFL. Ok...Can't argue with that, really.

 

Shockey is a great recieving Tight End. (No pun intended) Does he drop balls? Yes, of course. But not as much as you think. Face it, you don't like Shockey, like many other Giants fans don't either, and every little mistake he makes you tend to blow things up out of propotion.

 

Psss... I got a little secret to tell you. You know Mark Bavaro? He use drop balls too.... In fact, one of the greatest plays in Giants history happened because Mark Bavaro dropped a balls. *****See Phil McConkey's TD in SB XXI. I know, I know...That was Mark Bavaro's only drop ball in his career.

 

Hey, it's not my fault the definition of a dropped pass is stupid. The stat is worthless like +/- in hockey.

 

Shockey pisses me off to no end, but I don't dislike him. Don't pick the parts of posts you disagree with and ignore the others. I said he's one of the best blocking TEs in the league and I don't want him traded unless we rob the other team with a top 15 pick. I'm not blowing out of proportion the simple fact that JS and Eli are not on the same page at all, and I firmly believe 90% of that is attributed to JS for the reasons given.

 

And I know Bavaro dropped balls. I watched virtually every game he played as a Giant. Big difference was he wasn't a complete asshole on the sidelines or in the huddle, or taking stupid penalties. He was the ultimate team player. I can live with mistakes if the player is a consumate pro like Bavaro and brings it every single down. Shockey still acts like a 5 year old, but at least he brings it every play.

 

Shockey is a great TE. Not because of his receiving skills which have regressed, but because he has rounded out his game to become an awesome blocker. If he would focus a little more, he'd be stud TE, like Bavaro.

[echochamber]

I completely disagree. Shockey & Plax took a lot of heat for Eli's inconsistancy last season. No way in hell the receivers were to blame for all those 'drops' and 'wrong routes'.

 

Eli was inconsistent, but I put an equal amount of the blame on Gilbride for terrible playcalling, which he fortunately corrected the last 4 or so games of the regular season. There is an article out there regarding Eli's inconsistency you should check out. I believe it's on espn. The dude broke down every INT he threw, and the vast majority were the receivers fault. That actually amazed me. Eli was definitely part of the problem, though.

[NeMesiS]

Hey, it's not my fault the definition of a dropped pass is stupid. The stat is worthless like +/- in hockey.

 

Shockey pisses me off to no end, but I don't dislike him. Don't pick the parts of posts you disagree with and ignore the others. I said he's one of the best blocking TEs in the league and I don't want him traded unless we rob the other team with a top 15 pick. I'm not blowing out of proportion the simple fact that JS and Eli are not on the same page at all, and I firmly believe 90% of that is attributed to JS for the reasons given.

 

And I know Bavaro dropped balls. I watched virtually every game he played as a Giant. Big difference was he wasn't a complete asshole on the sidelines or in the huddle, or taking stupid penalties. He was the ultimate team player. I can live with mistakes if the player is a consumate pro like Bavaro and brings it every single down. Shockey still acts like a 5 year old, but at least he brings it every play.

 

Shockey is a great TE. Not because of his receiving skills which have regressed, but because he has rounded out his game to become an awesome blocker. If he would focus a little more, he'd be stud TE, like Bavaro.

Well, I can agree drop passes are a matter of opinion, in a way. But to me, Shockey doesn't drop alot of passes. Not more than any other WR, TE in the league. Jason Whitten had 10 drop passes (I belive) and everyone one is under the impression he has great hands. I saw Antonio Gates drop 5 passes in one game against Washington. But I betcha people think he has great hands too. JS doesn't drop as many passes as people think... 3 (official) drop passes is not alot.

 

JS receiving skills have not regressed. He's just not used properly... And before you tell me that's not true. When I lived in San Diego and Kevin Gilbrite was the head coach there. A report asked him point blank, if he knew he can use a TE in the passing game. The fact of the matter is Kevin doesn't like to attack the middle of the field (except in the playoffs, and look what happened) with the passing game. When was the last time you saw JS do a seem route?

 

Wait..how do you know he's an asshole to his teammates? So far all his teammates, coaches, and GM have came out publicaly and stated JS is the heart and soul of this offense.

[Treehugger]

Eli was inconsistent, but I put an equal amount of the blame on Gilbride for terrible playcalling, which he fortunately corrected the last 4 or so games of the regular season. There is an article out there regarding Eli's inconsistency you should check out. I believe it's on espn. The dude broke down every INT he threw, and the vast majority were the receivers fault. That actually amazed me. Eli was definitely part of the problem, though.

Oh I have no problem blaming Gilbride for a lot of the issues and I'm still pissed he wasn't let go.

[xxi-xxv]

Well, I can agree drop passes are a matter of opinion, in a way. But to me, Shockey doesn't drop alot of passes. Not more than any other WR, TE in the league. Jason Whitten had 10 drop passes (I belive) and everyone one is under the impression he has great hands. I saw Antonio Gates drop 5 passes in one game against Washington. But I betcha people think he has great hands too. JS doesn't drop as many passes as people think... 3 (official) drop passes is not alot.

 

JS receiving skills have not regressed. He's just not used properly... And before you tell me that's not true. When I lived in San Diego and Kevin Gilbrite was the head coach there. A report asked him point blank, if he knew he can use a TE in the passing game. The fact of the matter is Kevin doesn't like to attack the middle of the field (except in the playoffs, and look what happened) with the passing game. When was the last time you saw JS do a seem route?

 

Wait..how do you know he's an asshole to his teammates? So far all his teammates, coaches, and GM have came out publicaly and stated JS is the heart and soul of this offense.

Gilbride does not like to attack the middle of the field? What? One of the biggest and most used plays in this offense is the deep pass, down the middle of the field. Numerous times this year(particularly off play action)you saw the success of this with ELI and PLAX.

 

Last I saw Shockey run a seam pattern? Plenty. One comes to mind, week 3 in Washington 4th quarter, 20 yard seam right down the middle. Hit Shockey in the hands, it was one of those drops you spoke of.

 

As far as not using the TE Shockey has averaged over 60 catches a season when he has played under this coaching staff and that is more than your average NFL TE, obviously dispelling the notion that the Giants do not use the TE. Here is the problem that I think some people do not get or do not want to admit. SHockey is NOT that electrifying player anymore that he was in 2002 and parts of 2003, injuries have taken their toll and he is never again going to be that player. With that being said a case can be made that he is a BETTER player now then he was then. He has become a better red zone reciever(1TD all of 2002 74 catch rookie season) and his blocking has improved 100%(something that despite what people want is required of a TE).

 

BTW Nem, although no one in the organization has bad mouthed him, no one has gone as far as to say he is the heart and soul of that offense. They would get laughed at at this point if they did.

 

As for trading him, I say no way. I suspect though that it could happen as where there is smoke there is fire.

[NeMesiS]

Gilbride does not like to attack the middle of the field? What? One of the biggest and most used plays in this offense is the deep pass, down the middle of the field. Numerous times this year(particularly off play action)you saw the success of this with ELI and PLAX.

Eh? Throwing the ball once or twice over the middle is not attacking the field. And i didn't say he didn't do it. I said Kevin doesn't like to do it. Once Steve Smith returned, it looked like he actually started to throw the ball (more often) towards the middle of the field. Why? I don't know... But I think it actually help Eli.

 

Last I saw Shockey run a seam pattern? Plenty. One comes to mind, week 3 in Washington 4th quarter, 20 yard seam right down the middle. Hit Shockey in the hands, it was one of those drops you spoke of.

I hate that play. But yes, that's one of the few seem plays Shockey had last year. He had another one the very same game, that set up a 1st and goal and a TD for Droughns.

 

As far as not using the TE Shockey has averaged over 60 catches a season when he has played under this coaching staff and that is more than your average NFL TE, obviously dispelling the notion that the Giants do not use the TE. Here is the problem that I think some people do not get or do not want to admit. SHockey is NOT that electrifying player anymore that he was in 2002 and parts of 2003, injuries have taken their toll and he is never again going to be that player. With that being said a case can be made that he is a BETTER player now then he was then. He has become a better red zone reciever(1TD all of 2002 74 catch rookie season) and his blocking has improved 100%(something that despite what people want is required of a TE).

Admit what? He may not be as fast as he use to be. But he still faster than that fat fucker Jason Whitten. I mean, anyone with half eye can see Shockey's Atheletism. That's why many teams are still interested in trading for him. I think what people don't want to admit is that Shockey is playing with a coaching staff that doest know how to get him the ball. Well, beside 3 yard curls...

 

 

 

BTW Nem, although no one in the organization has bad mouthed him, no one has gone as far as to say he is the heart and soul of that offense. They would get laughed at at this point if they did.

 

As for trading him, I say no way. I suspect though that it could happen as where there is smoke there is fire.

I think Kareem McKenzie said it, but I'm not sure.

 

[xxi-xxv]

Eh? Throwing the ball once or twice over the middle is not attacking the field. And i didn't say he didn't do it. I said Kevin doesn't like to do it. Once Steve Smith returned, it looked like he actually started to throw the ball (more often) towards the middle of the field. Why? I don't know... But I think it actually help Eli.

I hate that play. But yes, that's one of the few seem plays Shockey had last year. He had another one the very same game, that set up a 1st and goal and a TD for Droughns.

 

Admit what? He may not be as fast as he use to be. But he still faster than that fat fucker Jason Whitten. I mean, anyone with half eye can see Shockey's Atheletism. That's why many teams are still interested in trading for him. I think what people don't want to admit is that Shockey is playing with a coaching staff that doest know how to get him the ball. Well, beside 3 yard curls...

I think Kareem McKenzie said it, but I'm not sure.

 

Nem he averages 60 catches and more tds with this coaching staff then he did under the former one. He was more of a downfield threat then because A)he had a better ability to get YACS then he does now, as although not slow has lost a step and B)there was no leigitimate #2 WR to go along with Amani, it was Amani and Shockey, who for all intents and prurposes in years 1 and 2 was a glorified WR, who from time to time lines up next to the Tackle.

 

Again, 60 catches, 10 yards/catch. His production average under this staff is 8-10 catches less/year then 2002 and 200 yards less. Yet,more TDS. I will take this usuage of the TE then what he was under Fassel.

 

There should be no trading of Shockey, he has become a complete TE and with Boss could be a real matchup issue for linebackers and safeties all season. I cannot reiterate enough how Shockey has actually become a better TE despite the drop in production.

[NightFire]

Nem he averages 60 catches and more tds with this coaching staff then he did under the former one. He was more of a down field threat then because A) he had a better ability to get YACS then he does now, as although not slow has lost a step and B) there was no legitimate #2 WR to go along with Amani, it was Amani and Shockey, who for all intents and purposes in years 1 and 2 was a glorified WR, who from time to time lines up next to the Tackle.

 

Again, 60 catches, 10 yards/catch. His production average under this staff is 8-10 catches less/year then 2002 and 200 yards less. Yet,more TDS. I will take this usage of the TE then what he was under Fassel.

 

There should be no trading of Shockey, he has become a complete TE and with Boss could be a real match up issue for linebackers and safeties all season. I cannot reiterate enough how Shockey has actually become a better TE despite the drop in production.

 

I don't think may posters will argue that he is a good TE but that he is getting injured often now and his mouth/intensity is sometimes a problem. I think many people want him traded while he is still worth a lot and not wait until he is on the IR and too damaged goods. Maybe with Boss now showing potential he can rest on plays more and he will be able to stay healthy.

[gateb]

He's gotten so valuable as a blocker. After Shockey went down, Jacobs had that big game against the worst rush defense in the league then virtually dissappeared.

 

It's like trading a defensive catcher who still bats .290.

 

Boss was productive for us, but he had one or two catches a game when defenses weren't even focusing on him. Could be a nice player, but doesn't bring out the impact that Shockey does.

[BleedinBlue]

Something that hasn't been brought up in this discussion is making news this morning...and that is, that some people are saying that "Shockey wants to be traded and it's no secret to the Giants' staff". The news is also saying that "Shockey WILL be traded by draft day".

 

That changes everything in my opinion. It has been thought that the staff has entertained offers for Shockey, but they aren't "trying to trade him". But if they are recieving offers and it is known on the inside that Shockey wants out of New York.....in my opinion, he's as good as gone already.

[jranieli]

Bleedin, that news isn't new. I have been hearing the same for weeks now. Eli has said that he has talked to Shockey on a regular basis. I do believe the media is try to make a story but not sure how true it is that he wants to be traded.

 

http://blog.nj.com/ledgergiants/2008/04/el...key_around.html

[so-cal dub]

Surprised nobody posted about the Carolina rumor. Supposedly we give them Shockey and our 2nd round pick for Carolina's 1st, 13th overall. If this is true, we can guarantee a top CB or LB providing nobody jumps up over us. I for one would like that, but I am definitely on the fence becasue we all know what Shockey brings and I would love nothing more than to see a two TE set of Boss and Shockey.

 

 

 

...and Booyah, eat a bag of dicks ya fucking red on the head like a dick on dog son of bitch. I am the champ, never duplicated often imitated, undisputed, and undefeated. What you got sweet cakes?

 

 

Carry on, oh haters of me.

[jranieli]

Surprised nobody posted about the Carolina rumor. Supposedly we give them Shockey and our 2nd round pick for Carolina's 1st, 13th overall. If this is true, we can guarantee a top CB or LB providing nobody jumps up over us. I for one would like that, but I am definitely on the fence becasue we all know what Shockey brings and I would love nothing more than to see a two TE set of Boss and Shockey.

...and Booyah, eat a bag of dicks ya fucking red on the head like a dick on dog son of bitch. I am the champ, never duplicated often imitated, undisputed, and undefeated. What you got sweet cakes?

Carry on, oh haters of me.

 

 

You know that is a very popular line on BBI. A former member here who I have not seen in over a year likes to mention that phrase every once in a while.

[so-cal dub]

You know that is a very popular line on BBI. A former member here who I have not seen in over a year likes to mention that phrase every once in a while.

I can assure you, I'm not him. I know you guys think I have alter egos and all, but ya know... I'm all me playa. Seriously though, some of these people on here have sad minds. Ya know, the ones that were cool, then I leave and they decide to show how anti social they are, and why they have no lives...probably no real friends. I never thought anything ill of 98% of the posters here. It's amazing how easy it is to see who is real and is phony, "smile in your face, talk shit behind it", when they think you're gone. I'm really in tears over it all... BTW, I retired...and just like great champs do, they come back and kick ass. Jab, jab, jab, Upper cut...(So-cal raises his gloves as the SW amateurs fall face first) BTW, if you guys want to talk Giants football, talk shit, talk whatever...check out this place. It's the Giant Mafia's page and ustream.

---Gmob ustream---

---Gmob web page---

 

 

Anyhoo, I'll just say I dont want Shockey to leave, but if him leaving can net us Kenny Phillips or Cromartie, I dont know what to think. (get this back on topic)

[Ggirl]

You know that is a very popular line on BBI. A former member here who I have not seen in over a year likes to mention that phrase every once in a while.

"Eat a bag of dicks"?

 

Is that the popular phase?

 

Give me a break.

[jranieli]

"Eat a bag of dicks"?

 

Is that the popular phase?

 

Give me a break.

 

Yep, goes to show you the quality posters over there.

[Ggirl]

Yep, goes to show you the quality posters over there.

I always thought they were the more serious, polite types.

 

Guess I was wrong.

[jranieli]

I always thought they were the more serious, polite types.

 

Guess I was wrong.

 

Nope, you are thinking of giantsmafia.

[Ggirl]

Nope, you are thinking of giantsmafia.

I've been around the Mafia,

but never giantsmafia before.

 

Do you think Shockey will really get traded?

[gateb]

I would do it. We're moving up 51 slots at the cost of a TE.

 

I don't want to force trading Shockey but that'd be an absolute steal... if we have a plan on what to do at 13.

[xxi-xxv]

I can assure you, I'm not him. I know you guys think I have alter egos and all, but ya know... I'm all me playa. Seriously though, some of these people on here have sad minds. Ya know, the ones that were cool, then I leave and they decide to show how anti social they are, and why they have no lives...probably no real friends. I never thought anything ill of 98% of the posters here. It's amazing how easy it is to see who is real and is phony, "smile in your face, talk shit behind it", when they think you're gone. I'm really in tears over it all... BTW, I retired...and just like great champs do, they come back and kick ass. Jab, jab, jab, Upper cut...(So-cal raises his gloves as the SW amateurs fall face first) BTW, if you guys want to talk Giants football, talk shit, talk whatever...check out this place. It's the Giant Mafia's page and ustream.

---Gmob ustream---

---Gmob web page---

Anyhoo, I'll just say I dont want Shockey to leave, but if him leaving can net us Kenny Phillips or Cromartie, I dont know what to think. (get this back on topic)

 

Now that you are back are you going to stay?

[so-cal dub]

Now that you are back are you going to stay?

I guess I'll pop in here and there....

 

 

(I am ruining Bleedin Blue's thread and the big meanie Booyah is outraged, so this will be the last in this thread.)

[Taylorized56]

I saw this rumor on foxsports (#7 on the list),

 

I firmly believe — and so do three league sources I checked in with — that there is at least a 50-50 chance Jeremy Shockey is a Saint by the time the NFL draft is over.

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/8032770...62&ATT=2212

 

I want Shock back but one thing that I'm surprised about is his silence so far this offseason. I mean why isn't he coming out and denying all these rumors going around about him not being happy and that he would welcome a trade to the Saints?

 

I like the idea of using he and Boss in 2 te formations and I also think having Boss will keep Shock fresh. I love the guy but IF these rumors are true and he doesn't want to be a Giant than it's time to part ways IMO. I always figured him to finish his career with us and it would pain me to see him in another teams uniform.

[Treehugger]

He firmly believes there's at least a 50-50 chance? Time to bet the farm!

[BleedinBlue]

Sorta like the weatherman predicting a 50% chance of rain. That means virtually nothing!