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QB SUCCESS


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Pressures QBs face in first full-time role

 

 

By Pat Kirwan

NFL.com Senior Analyst

 

 

 

 

(July 5, 2007) -- The quarterback is the most important position in football and no one should disagree with the fact. There isn't a coach in this league who really believes a player can walk onto the field in his first year as the full-time starter and be totally prepared. There are always bumps in the road, issues that only experience can take care of and the supporting cast can damage a talented player faster than his own learning curve.

 

 

Looking strictly at the results, Rex Grossman had a good year.

Heck, Rex Grossman in his first season as a 16-game starter got his team to the Super Bowl. He threw more touchdowns than interceptions and completed 47 passes over 20 yards. Yet he hasn't been accepted or embraced by Chicago fans. This year, there could be 10 starting quarterbacks in the NFL who have never been full-time starters. But once they take the field, the honeymoon will be over. The real question is however, what's fair when it comes to evaluating a young inexperienced starting QB in his first attempt at being a 16-game starter?

 

Here's an example of how perception and reality can conflict, especially in a big market versus a smaller one. In their first 16-game season, Peyton Manning and younger brother Eli Manning both threw exactly the same number of passes (557) -- Peyton completed more, 336, compared to Eli's 294. But the younger Manning threw for more yards, more passes over 20 yards and had a much better touchdown to interception ratio than the elder sibling. Peyton Manning had 26 touchdowns to 28 interceptions and Eli Manning had 24 touchdowns to just 17 interceptions. Yet most Giants fans can't see a bright future for Eli. Big city fans want instant success and they define that as a Super Bowl ring. That's why some of the new 2007 starters are going to crumble under the pressure and expectations.

 

Will there be a Tom Brady in the group who can step on the field and produce a winning record, throw more touchdowns than interceptions, and win a Super Bowl? I doubt it. But then again my expectations for a successful first season include something more inline with the Drew Brees of 2002 when he led his team to an 8-8 record, threw 17 touchdowns to just 16 interceptions and completed 320 of 526 passes.

 

The great Brett Favre threw only 19 touchdowns to 24 interceptions his first year as a starter, but that small-town market gave him a chance to grow. Are Washington's Jason Campbell, Dallas' Tony Romo, Arizona's Matt Leinart, or Denver's Jay Cutler going to get that kind of breathing room? We'll just have to wait and see.

 

Here's a list of potential/probable first time 16-game starters. When you think that Daunte Culpepper's first season produced 33 touchdowns/16 interceptions and a 62.7 percent completion rate and now he has very little chance of being a starter in 2007. Or Aaron Brooks with his 123 scoring passes to just 92 picks can't even find a team. and Jake Plummer being sick of playing football. You wonder how long these young signal-callers will last if they are just average in 2007.

 

Just thought I'd point out the comparison between Peyton and Eli in thier first yr. The last 2 years injuries have really had an affect on Eli's play, not wholeheartedly, but an affect none the less.

Even with no injuries, Eli's still has learning to do. But he has done better than some give him credit, and he has ALL the tools to make it big.

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Our offense with Eli at the helm has put up over 22 points per game against division rivals. We've outscored our division 341 to 319, with Eli. His 3 best games last year ratings-wise, were all against division rivals. And, Eli has a winning regular season record against every divisional rival. We're patient with the kid because he's extremely talented. And if you're fool enough to believe you should give up on a qb just because he struggles to win his first playoff game, history shows you would've given up on some future hall of famers.

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Our offense with Eli at the helm has put up over 22 points per game against division rivals. We've outscored our division 341 to 319, with Eli. His 3 best games last year ratings-wise, were all against division rivals. And, Eli has a winning regular season record against every divisional rival. We're patient with the kid because he's extremely talented. And if you're fool enough to believe you should give up on a qb just because he struggles to win his first playoff game, history shows you would've given up on some future hall of famers.

 

Exactly. I know this is beating a dead horse, but I thought it was an interesting article for those who have given up, on Eli. I too, noticed his better games against div rivals. And if he's gonna have success against anyone to start, Im glad its the div rivals!

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Exactly. I know this is beating a dead horse, but I thought it was an interesting article for those who have given up, on Eli. I too, noticed his better games against div rivals. And if he's gonna have success against anyone to start, Im glad its the div rivals!

 

 

Actually, in many of their wins Eli was unimpressive: In 2005, 36-0 win over the Redskings: 12 for 31 146 yards; Giants 17 Dallas 10, Eli 12 for 31 152 yards...

 

In 2006: Giants 34 Skins 28, Eli 12 for 26 101 yards; Giants 36 Cowboys 22, 12 for 26 189 yards...

 

In 2006, the year Eli was supposed to show us how much he improved, they swept Washington, were 1-1 against Dallas, and were 1-2 against the Eagles (pedestrian 4-3). In the meadowlands against the Eagles, Eli had a chance to win it in the end and threw the ball to Cole who returned it for a TD.

 

These are his "better" games? Really?

 

What's even more damning is the issue of how good this division really is? Unless I am mistaken, the Eagles are the only team to win a playoff game in recent years years...Maybe this explains why the Panthers owned Eli two years ago...

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Actually, in many of their wins Eli was unimpressive: In 2005, 36-0 win over the Redskings: 12 for 31 146 yards; Giants 17 Dallas 10, Eli 12 for 31 152 yards...

 

In 2006: Giants 34 Skins 28, Eli 12 for 26 101 yards; Giants 36 Cowboys 22, 12 for 26 189 yards...

 

In 2006, the year Eli was supposed to show us how much he improved, they swept Washington, were 1-1 against Dallas, and were 1-2 against the Eagles (pedestrian 4-3). In the meadowlands against the Eagles, Eli had a chance to win it in the end and threw the ball to Cole who returned it for a TD.

 

These are his "better" games? Really?

 

What's even more damning is the issue of how good this division really is? Unless I am mistaken, the Eagles are the only team to win a playoff game in recent years years...Maybe this explains why the Panthers owned Eli two years ago...

 

 

9/17/06- vs Philly-W- 31-43 371 yds 3 TD's 1INT

 

10/8/06 - vs Wash - W -23-33 256yds 1TD 0 INT

 

12/03/06 - vs Dallas - L - 24-36 270 yds 2 TD's 0 INT's

 

11/20/05 - vs Philly - W - 17-26 218 yds 3 TD's 0 INT

 

01/02/05 - vs Dallas - W - 18-27 144 yds 3 TD's 1 INT

 

I threw that last one in because what was so significant about it was Eli was able to read the D on that game winning drive, he called an audible for a Tiki running play and it was the right call. ;)

 

There were some other decent outings for Eli against rivals, but Tikis mad running overshadowed them.

 

Oh, BTW, nice how you picked and chose the games you wanted to mention. :doh:

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9/17/06- vs Philly-W- 31-43 371 yds 3 TD's 1INT

 

10/8/06 - vs Wash - W -23-33 256yds 1TD 0 INT

 

12/03/06 - vs Dallas - L - 24-36 270 yds 2 TD's 0 INT's

 

11/20/05 - vs Philly - W - 17-26 218 yds 3 TD's 0 INT

 

01/02/05 - vs Dallas - W - 18-27 144 yds 3 TD's 1 INT

 

I threw that last one in because what was so significant about it was Eli was able to read the D on that game winning drive, he called an audible for a Tiki running play and it was the right call. ;)

 

There were some other decent outings for Eli against rivals, but Tikis mad running overshadowed them.

 

Oh, BTW, nice how you picked and chose the games you wanted to mention. :doh:

 

Really, Eli only played well in 1/2 games against division rivals. The rest of the time he was mediocre. I also believe the Eagles were decimated by injuries in 2005, and that they may have even been swept by their division rivals...

 

But I am growing tired of the Eli debate. As a Dallas fan, I am grateful to SanDiego, and hope that Eli starts every game next season... :clap:

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Really, Eli only played well in 1/2 games against division rivals. The rest of the time he was mediocre. I also believe the Eagles were decimated by injuries in 2005, and that they may have even been swept by their division rivals...

 

But I am growing tired of the Eli debate. As a Dallas fan, I am grateful to SanDiego, and hope that Eli starts every game next season... :clap:

 

 

And you only pointed out 2 bad games, so your point is??

 

Of course your growing tired. Thats what happens when you lose a debate.

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And you only pointed out 2 bad games, so your point is??

 

Of course your growing tired. Thats what happens when you lose a debate.

 

Actually, I pointed out 5. But who is counting? And my point is... :doh:

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Actually, I pointed out 5. But who is counting? And my point is... :doh:

 

You pointed out FOUR, I only recognize two, because the 36-0 win over the Skins and the 36-22 trashing of the Girlz were not bad games by Eli, just a monster game by Tiki and the D respectively.

 

 

Dont worry, the usage of the 'doh' smiley face to cover up little knowledge, your secret is safe with me.......UH OH!

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You pointed out FOUR, I only recognize two, because the 36-0 win over the Skins and the 36-22 trashing of the Girlz were not bad games by Eli, just a monster game by Tiki and the D respectively.

Dont worry, the usage of the 'doh' smiley face to cover up little knowledge, your secret is safe with me.......UH OH!

 

Granted Tiki had monster games. But how did Tiki's monster games PREVENT ELI from completing 50% of his passes? If anything, the running game should have opened up the passing game...Eli should have had a field day...I'll bet Dave Brown would have... :LMAO:

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Granted Tiki had monster games. But how did Tiki's monster games PREVENT ELI from completing 50% of his passes? If anything, the running game should have opened up the passing game...Eli should have had a field day...I'll bet Dave Brown would have... :LMAO:

 

How do you have a field day when your RB is running the ball all over the place? Maybe he could have completed a few more passes to make his comp. ratio a little higher, but hey, were not all here to please you!

 

 

You know what Quincy Carter would have done.......A LINE!!!!!!!!!!

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How do you have a field day when your RB is running the ball all over the place? Maybe he could have completed a few more passes to make his comp. ratio a little higher, but hey, were not all here to please you!

You know what Quincy Carter would have done.......A LINE!!!!!!!!!!

 

The Dog wonders, is it likely Carter could have gotten that line from your football hero Lawrence Taylor...

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In the meadowlands against the Eagles, Eli had a chance to win it in the end and threw the ball to Cole who returned it for a TD.

 

Anyone on these boards knows I'm no Eli lover... but since this is the second time you've pointed this out, I'd like to point out that the ball was tipped to Cole. It was much more of an athletic play by a D-lineman than a fault of Eli.

 

There are plenty of other bad decisions Eli's made that you can use as your examples (Pac Man Jones, anyone).

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The Dog once had a friend who said that the best conversations you will have in life are with yourself...please tell the Dog, is that true?

hey Guido please shut the fuck up.

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Actually, in many of their wins Eli was unimpressive: In 2005, 36-0 win over the Redskings: 12 for 31 146 yards; Giants 17 Dallas 10, Eli 12 for 31 152 yards...These are his "better" games? Really?

 

What's even more damning is the issue of how good this division really is? Unless I am mistaken, the Eagles are the only team to win a playoff game in recent years ...Maybe this explains why the Panthers owned Eli two years ago...

The Panther owning Eli thing is old as hell. Egg has no comeback. And BTW you are not "mistaken".. Eagles have won playoff games in recent years, DALLAS HAS NOT...what's up with that?

 

I will take the liberty to remind you of all the QB's Dallas has had since their ZERO playoff win 'streak'. (Last playoff win: A 40-15 win vs. the Vikes, 1996)

 

final record in parenthesis

1996 - Aikman (10-6)

1997 - Aikman (6-10)

1998 - Aikman (10-6)

1999 - Aikman (8-8)

2000 - Aikman/Cunningham (5-11)

2001 - Q. Carter/R. Leaf (5-11)

2002 - Q. Carter (5-11)

2003 - Q. Carter (10-6)

2004 - Testaverde (6-10)

2005 - Bledsoe (9-7)

2006 - Bledsoe/Romo (9-7)

 

As I look at that above list, I ask myself WHY? Why hasn't Dallas won any playoff games in so long? Aikman was a really good QB and very experienced. What's up? Then Aikman started getting those cncussions and Dallas got Randall Cunningham as a 'insurance backup'. Randall a decent QB that should win you a playoff game, what's up? I can just skip over the Carter/Leaf/Testaverde years...I understand! Now enter Bledsoe...rocket arm, smart vet and re-united with a system he's familiar with with Parcells. No wins in the post season??? What is up? Romo is a young cat and I guess we'll have to see IF he can get over that 'botched snap' last year. Can Romo do it? (Can he win a playoff game for your Cowboys?)

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