fishgutmartyr

Good spot for Ryan. Gilbride? Wow. That looks like he's being set up to fail.

You're right. my mistake. Let's chalk that up to a combination of not wearing my glasses and wishful thinking. Still very good, though.

I would take it to mean that Beason had to show the young linebackers how to play their positions at this level.

Hey, I won't argue about Quinn, I wanted him gone a few years ago. Or our LB coach--hell, our linebackers showed more improvement in a few games with Beason than with multiple seasons with that fraud. And I'm still not sold on Fewell. I'm not even saying you're wrong about Ryan and Gilbride, since we don't know what those guys will ultimately be doing. And Ryan did ok with the WRs before he went to QB coach...so maybe it was a matter of putting him in the wrong spot. I just want to see what happens before judging. I don't even know if there is a right or wrong here. Ingram--early on, he was awesome: got Tiki out of his fumbling habit, brought up Jacobs, Bradshaw, and Ward. But he's also screwed the pooch on a 1st-rounder. Pope--71, got his pick with Adrien Robinson, who has done nothing. It might just be time for a change here. Not unreasonable to get your own guys in here. Maybe he should have wiped the slate. We'll see.

I knew it.

You guys are too much. You're holding a guy's donating a kidney against him? That's the important connection? Not that McAdoo and Langsdorf coached together? Or that Langsdorf was the OC at 9th-ranked Oregon? And how do you blame an offensive line coach who was stuck with 3 beat-up guys on an 8-man squad in September? Seriously, who the fuck was Dallas Reynolds? We started him...We started at least 3 centers...including the guy that was supposed to be our starting left guard. Show me any line coach that could overcome that with the weak backups we had. Then keep him in his lamp so you can rub it and ask him for a pot of gold--because he won't be human. We don't even know what Ryan and Gilbride Jr. will be doing. We do know it probably won't be what they were doing last year. McAdoo already said as much. We have a new OC with no ties to Gilbride. The only thing we know for sure is his former head coach (who ran a completely different offense) and the last guy he coached (one of the best at his position in the league) raved about him. He hasn't even finished forming his staff yet. Not a single Giants player has taken the field in any practice, let alone game, under him. Can we wait until that happens before proclaiming an NFL/NCAA-wide conspiracy to keep Gilbride's offense in place? I'm not even suggesting you need to love the guy--for all I know, McAdoo might be terrible. Just give him a chance.

All the best--great player for us, and it was appreciated.

I can understand the grief Nicks is getting for 2013, but 2012? He played hurt that entire season. Yeah, the numbers aren't good, but you can't fault the player for that. I think his game will improve next year. I don't think it will be with our team, though--something went wrong last off season, and I think it showed. Probably felt slighted with the Cruz signing.

Ward and Barber were good at it, too.

The real wildcard is the OC. Who knows how the pieces will fit until this next season? We might actually be better off with two slot-types. (I'm probably just kidding myself.)

Believe me, I hope you're right.

Actually, this is exactly what I don't want. The more time Tampa takes to make up its mind, the later in the FA/draft season it will be if we have to replace him. And how much energy is he spending on our draft at the moment? If I were Reese, I'd be furious right now.

Joe, agree with about all of this, except that as things stand there's no way we keep Snee. He costs too much for too little. I think more will be put into linebacker. Haven't given up hope with Paysinger, I think playing alongside Beason helped a lot. But it is a great chance to revive that squad, and they should take it. I'm not sure how they'll do it, though. I don't think it would be too bad if we got the 2012 Beatty back--the question is: will we? We won't know until it's too late, and we can't risk it. The interior line is a must with a pocket-passer. http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2014/01/ben_mcadoo_a_look_at_packers_offensive_free_agents_and_how_they_may_fit_giants.html Evan Dietrich-Smith might be the best choice at center. Knows a good chunk of the offense, a vet. If we go drafting guards, he's got to be the guy to hold it together. The time to draft a center was 3 years ago--when we had vet guards that needed less guidance. It isn't now.

Actually, i don't think we're disagreeing at all. Honestly, I don't. That scout should definitely be fired. I agree. But I would like you to keep in mind that in my opinion, 2005 was one of the best off-seasons I've ever seen. No matter how it ended, Pierce, MacKenzie and Burress gave us a ton of value for the money. Accorsi was masterful in free agency. The draft was impeccable:4 picks resulting in 3 multi-year starters/core players--with Moore ending up a starter elsewhere. And the guy who was giving him the information he needed for the draft was Reese. Accorsi made the final calls, but it was based on information Reese gave him. Reese, like Accorsi before him, has to concern himself with contracts for the active roster, the practice squad, and the guys on IR. He's got to look at potential free agents, draft choices, and picking players from other practice squads. And do it all under the cap. There's no way Reese can invest the time in the draft that he did when he was the head of scouting. The GM has to rely on his head of scouting to compile the information he needs. Bad information results in bad picks. The GM might have an idea of positions that need to be selected, but if the scouting says there's better value at that draft spot outside of those positions, it's difficult to overrule it. Reese hasn't had his 2005 free agency yet--he's been hit or miss, although the Canty/Rolle deals weren't as bad as people say. And god knows Accorsi had his stinkers, too. And after many more years of experience. Reese will get better. But he needs to ditch Ross. We're both waaayyy over our depth here, but that's what it looks like to me.

That's the draft--you're actually blaming Reese for Mark Ross' responsibility. 2007 was the last draft that Reese was primarily in charge of. Say Mark Ross is Reese's responsibility, and the argument ends; but it's the draft scouting that really needs to be looked at. Although with time, I'm beginning to appreciate Accorsi's ability to find decent free agents.

And the guy who started every game his rookie season 32 years ago proved to be a HOF'er. On a pretty weak team. I'm fond of Kelly, Lloyd, Carson and Van Pelt, but come on, now...that was a no-brainer. Frankly, a team that has had the records the Giants have had over the past 8 years shouldn't need to play rookies as starters from game one. If they did, we should be shitting all over Reese & Co. Which, of course, is what is happening now.

Agree. Even the notorious benching of Wilson happened his rookie year, so obviously the original plan was to get him into games. I see nothing wrong with letting rookies watch for a while before putting them into games, if the team can afford to. And if Randle was having as much difficulty as he did his second season, how bad would he have been in 2012? To be fair: Hankins: DTs did just fine all season--there was no need to rush him out there. He still had playing time. Moore: He was drafted with the idea that he wouldn't be playing much at all this year. This coming year will probably be a different story, especially with a year in the weight room under his belt. Nassib: We had a line that was letting our starter get mauled. Why would you bring in a guy with no experience at this level and let him lose whatever confidence he has? I would have let Painter take the beating, too.

Very true. Is there a guard worthy of the 12th pick, though? I'm all for trading down and getting a guard later on, but it's been 8 years since we did something like that. We don't have a whole lot behind Beatty and Pugh. Beatty comes with a LOT of questions next season. If he comes back at the same level he played this year, or if one of them becomes injured, we're screwed. It makes sense to get a tackle when we have a chance.

That's good news for him, but I don't know if that translates to going back on the field. A running back has to take a lot of punishment.

When is the best time to replace scouts? I guess you could try to replace Ross now, but what if the entire structure is falling apart? Aren't we in the middle of things for the upcoming draft, and we would be limiting what we would know of the players come April? I'm not defending anyone, I'm curious. It might be easier to get good personnel after the draft. A good scout probably wouldn't want to jump ship for a lateral move right now--and if he did, would you want him? They might be biting the bullet on this draft, and be planning an overhaul in April/May. This isn't the same thing as a team dumping a GM/coach, where you are starting exactly at zero. I'm not quite at the same spot some of you guys are, since a ton of players we drafted were good and wound up out of the league due to injuries, but I see where you are coming from, and understand how bad these drafts appear when we look at what's left outside of the injuries. There's definitely a failure in the system. I'm just not sure what it is, or where. Right now, changing up the front office might be the same as changing coaches mid-season. At least it seems that way to me.

True, and maybe that was the point of the move. I assume McAdoo would have a level of comfort in finding a TE coach, knowing through experience what's needed.

Kind of interesting that Flaherty is still here, considering the state of the oline. Most of our picks have been busts. McCants get cut and becomes a starter for the Raiders. Beatty fell off. And other than Pugh, the only other player he developed that played a reasonable level this year is Boothe. Maybe Cordle. Not that I think he's a bad coach, but based on the measuring stick for Pope and Ingram, I would have thought he would be gone, too.

http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2014/01/giants_rb_coach_jerald_ingram_will_not_be_retained.html Apparently, he is.

http://www.giants.com/news-and-blogs/article-1/Ben-McAdoo-named-Offensive-Coordinator/75fcdfe8-a926-4598-ab5a-43d53602ae1a ... For what it's worth, it sounds like Coughlin is into the hire. So who knows? I don't think you can ignore your coach--you either accept his feedback, or fire him. From the way Coughlin described the guy, they're very similar.

Sounds good. Just have to see how it translates. We'll see. Wonder how bad Sullivan interviewed? He was supposed to be a shoo-in.