Well it was obvious

[xxi-xxv]

Pedro was nowhere near 100%. This is a huge loss and most of the experts will write the Mets off because of this, thats all fine and good. As far as I am concerned Pedro has done more for this franchise than any player since Mike Piazza, he brought back credibility to the Mets and was probably why they were able to also get Beltran. He made Shea a place to be again, especially on the days and nights he was pitching.

 

With that being said, its very simple as to where this can be traced back to and thats last off season and the big toe issue. Pedro was unable to do his normal off season workouts. These cardio workouts are something that he has talked about and said are the reason his legs stay strong late in the year, despite his small stature. In fact I remember a Mike and the Mad Dog interview in the spring where Dog asked him something like "what do you do pedro run on the treadmill for 30 minutes?" and Pedro was like "no more like 2 2 and a half hours". Dog seemed shocked and he and Mike talked afterwards about his legs and how important they are. IMO this broke him down as the year went on. Early in the season he did not need it as much as he was fresh, evidenced in his early season success.

 

Hindsight is 20/20, but maybe Pedro should have had more than 9 spring innings and an early season stint on the DL to get his legs up to speed with the new shoe for the toe.

 

Tough break, but I do not blame Pedro and hope the idiots in the media that questioned his toughness realize that the guy was trying to pitch hurt.

[Blue Jeans]

Again, we one the division without Pedro. We will win in the playoffs without Pedro.

[xxi-xxv]

Again, we one the division without Pedro. We will win in the playoffs without Pedro.

 

No early in the year when Pedro was tossing 7 inning gems and getting ZERO run support he was as valuable a member of this team as anyone. He went like a month with an ERA under 2 and NO wins.

 

Saying they won this division without Pedro is short sighted, when the big lead was built and the division was really won then he had as much to do with that as anyone on the roster.

 

He probably should have had 5-6 more wins at the break. Had he gotten half the run support of Tracshel or Rany "mr 7.5 runs/game" Johnson he would have.

[Blue Jeans]

No early in the year when Pedro was tossing 7 inning gems and getting ZERO run support he was as valuable a member of this team as anyone. He went like a month with an ERA under 2 and NO wins.

 

Saying they won this division without Pedro is short sighted, when the big lead was built and the division was really won then he had as much to do with that as anyone on the roster.

 

He probably should have had 5-6 more wins at the break. Had he gotten half the run support of Tracshel or Rany "mr 7.5 runs/game" Johnson he would have.

 

I can't deny it... but the point is while Pedro was gone we continued to win the games we needed to win, and I have enough confidence in this team that something will happen and we have the ability to win in the playoffs, too.

[xxi-xxv]

I can't deny it... but the point is while Pedro was gone we continued to win the games we needed to win, and I have enough confidence in this team that something will happen and we have the ability to win in the playoffs, too.

 

 

We did not win playoff games, thats the difference. We pounded mediocre pitching in the regular season.

 

This is a first ballot, hall of famer, who has seen big game after big game in the playoffs in his career and has a WS ring. This is a huge loss no matter how you cut it.

 

We are going to need EL Duque to have a 1998 rebirth and Trachsel has to step up, simple as that.

[Herc]

Pedro was nowhere near 100%. This is a huge loss and most of the experts will write the Mets off because of this, thats all fine and good. As far as I am concerned Pedro has done more for this franchise than any player since Mike Piazza, he brought back credibility to the Mets and was probably why they were able to also get Beltran. He made Shea a place to be again, especially on the days and nights he was pitching.

 

With that being said, its very simple as to where this can be traced back to and thats last off season and the big toe issue. Pedro was unable to do his normal off season workouts. These cardio workouts are something that he has talked about and said are the reason his legs stay strong late in the year, despite his small stature. In fact I remember a Mike and the Mad Dog interview in the spring where Dog asked him something like "what do you do pedro run on the treadmill for 30 minutes?" and Pedro was like "no more like 2 2 and a half hours". Dog seemed shocked and he and Mike talked afterwards about his legs and how important they are. IMO this broke him down as the year went on. Early in the season he did not need it as much as he was fresh, evidenced in his early season success.

 

Hindsight is 20/20, but maybe Pedro should have had more than 9 spring innings and an early season stint on the DL to get his legs up to speed with the new shoe for the toe.

 

Tough break, but I do not blame Pedro and hope the idiots in the media that questioned his toughness realize that the guy was trying to pitch hurt.

 

i doubt it. the media loves pedro

[Herc]

We did not win playoff games, thats the difference. We pounded mediocre pitching in the regular season.

 

This is a first ballot, hall of famer, who has seen big game after big game in the playoffs in his career and has a WS ring. This is a huge loss no matter how you cut it.

 

We are going to need EL Duque to have a 1998 rebirth and Trachsel has to step up, simple as that.

 

just hope you play the cards. cuz you're going to have rotation matchup problems against the pads and especially against the astros

[xxi-xxv]

just hope you play the cards. cuz you're going to have rotation matchup problems against the pads and especially against the astros

 

Dude no offense, I could care less how the Pads are playing now, I am salivating over playing that team. As was seen this regualr season the Mets are clearly more talented then they are 1-25 and that lineups does not strike fear into me at all. The ability for the Mets to use their athleticism against Piazza is something I also relish.

 

I do not see the matchup problem with the Pads or Dodgers based solely on the fact there is not one lefty there that scares me. I could care less about Wells, he can an easily pitch a horrid game as he can come up lame with a bad back due to the fact he is 40 something and overweight(see 2003 WS).

 

Like I have said all year and the stats and games have proved it the Mets are the class of the NL and should despite no Pedro win the NL, it would be a collassal upset on their part if they do not.

[so-cal dub]

as he can come up lame with a bad back due to the fact he is 40 something and overweight(see 2003 WS).

Had to go there, didn't you!? :brooding:

[xxi-xxv]

Had to go there, didn't you!? :brooding:

 

Hey Wells whom every yankee fan loved let them down in a big spot, then became a Red Sox, this is why most of them have wised up and hate the fat phony now.

[Herc]

Dude no offense, I could care less how the Pads are playing now, I am salivating over playing that team.

 

no one in your rotation scares me. no one. your only hope is that you can knock our pitching around, good luck with that.

 

As was seen this regualr season the Mets are clearly more talented then they are 1-25 and that lineups does not strike fear into me at all.

 

 

The ability for the Mets to use their athleticism against Piazza is something I also relish.

 

i feel the same way about dave roberts and mike cameron vs lo duca and his cannon

 

I do not see the matchup problem with the Pads or Dodgers based solely on the fact there is not one lefty there that scares me. I could care less about Wells, he can an easily pitch a horrid game as he can come up lame with a bad back due to the fact he is 40 something and overweight(see 2003 WS).

 

you're citing one game from a long time ago. he pitched great last year in the postseason

 

Like I have said all year and the stats and games have proved it the Mets are the class of the NL and should despite no Pedro win the NL, it would be a collassal upset on their part if they do not.

 

frankly im surprised at you. i can see some of the kids on here notknowing any better but you should know there's a huge difference between the regular season and the postseason. pitching, defense, bullpen. we got the edge in pitching. say what you will about our 3rd starter but you're completely ignoring the fact that you're 100% overmatched in games 1 and 2 from a SP standpoint. and thebullpens are a wash even though meredith and hoffman are obviously the better 8th/9th tandem.

 

you were the class all season (by 8 games at this point) but your ace is done and the rest of your rotation is shaky at best. in a 162 game series i'll take the mets, in a 5 game series.....?

[xxi-xxv]

you're nuts. no one in your rotation scares me. no one. your only hope is that you can knock our pitching around, good luck with that.

i feel the same way about dave roberts and mike cameron vs lo duca and his cannon

you're citing one game from a long time ago. he pitched great last year in the postseason

frankly im surprised at you. i can see some of the kids on here notknowing any better but you should know there's a huge difference between the regular season and the postseason. pitching, defense, bullpen. we got the edge in pitching. say what you will about our 3rd starter but you're completely ignoring the fact that you're 100% overmatched in games 1 and 2 from a SP standpoint. and thebullpens are a wash even though meredith and hoffman are obviously the better 8th/9th tandem

 

I know the difference between the regular season and post season and I feel the Mets are better than the Pads, simple as that.

 

Cameron? Worry more about him getting on base in the post season than running on LoDuca.

 

Meredith is better than heilman? Hoffman? I do not know everytime I see him in a big spot, 98 WS, games against Piazza years ago, this years All Star game he spits the bit.

 

100% overmatched with Glavine, you are completely dismissing a hall of fame pitcher. You say this and expect me to give credit to Wells? Who by the way, who cares how he pitched in the post season last year, I can give you the same arguement about El Duque, who's team swept Wells team in 05 and in fact got the three biggest outs in that series last year.

 

El Duque in a big spot is as battle tested as any pitcher in either league. he has pitched great of late and his resume gives optimism.

 

THe Mets lineup 1-8 is far and away superior to the Pads, what has given them trouble has been left handed starters, the Mets hit right handed pitching.

 

The Pads overall offense is so unimpressive to me that I feel the Mets starting pitching will look even better facing them. Last I saw 2 guys the Mets had no use for were hitting 3 and 4 in their lineup.

 

There is a reason the Mets are 10 games better than every team in the NL, if anyone beats them its an upset, simple as that.

[so-cal dub]

Hey Wells whom every yankee fan loved let them down in a big spot, then became a Red Sox, this is why most of them have wised up and hate the fat phony now.

I was just bugged by the fact you mentioned, let alone the 2003 series, but that game when he did fuck up his back. That pretty much was the cherry on top of that series.

 

Other that, yeah, fuck Wells.

[Herc]

I know the difference between the regular season and post season and I feel the Mets are better than the Pads, simple as that.

 

Cameron? Worry more about him getting on base in the post season than running on LoDuca.

 

Meredith is better than heilman? Hoffman? I do not know everytime I see him in a big spot, 98 WS, games against Piazza years ago, this years All Star game he spits the bit.

 

100% overmatched with Glavine, you are completely dismissing a hall of fame pitcher. You say this and expect me to give credit to Wells? Who by the way, who cares how he pitched in the post season last year, I can give you the same arguement about El Duque, who's team swept Wells team in 05 and in fact got the three biggest outs in that series last year.

 

3 outs. what a huge sample size. not the same thing as being relied on to anchor a postseason rotation.

 

and yeah, meredith's better than heilman. look up the numbers.

 

 

 

and you obviously haven't seen billy wagner in the postseason or have a selective memory. yeah, hoffman blew a save in the world series against arguably the greatest team ever and would've been out of the all-star game (which means shit) if garner had rolen in the game or didn't have cabrera stradling the line with two outs. piazza owned hoffman over his career. no arguments here. what team is piazza on now? you're gonna tell me all 500 saves weren't big spots? are games only YOU watch big spots? sorry, doens't work that way. moves saves ever, best save percentage ever. period.

 

tom glavine is 3-5 and has an ERA of 4.68 in the second half. i'm not scared.

 

worry about cameron getting on base? i'm assuming when you talked about running on piazza you had jose reyes in mind right? cameron has a better OBP than reyes.

 

 

wells and el duque have VERY similar postseason resumes--which not coincidently were earned playing for a dynasty. el duque is 9-3 with a 2.55 ERA and accumulated ALL of his positive postseason stats with one of the greatest dynasties in baseball history. wells is 10-4 with a 3.15 ERA in the postseason and he accumulated these stats with toronto, cincinatti, NYY, baltimore and boston. if you write off wells, i can surely write off el duque. you do realize that the last time el duque won a postseason start was 2001 right? in 2004 he started a postseason game and got LIT UP for a 5.40 era. and you can talk about the world series game in 2003 all you want, but his back went out. what happened in his two starts before that against the twins and red sox? 2-0 with an ERA under 2.00. AND wells is our 3rd starter and el duque is being counted on to anchor your entire postseason rotation. why isn't tom 'hall of fame' glavine being asked to do that? oh right, his 2nd half numbers suck, but i shoudln't write him off cuz he won a few cy youngs 30 years ago

[xxi-xxv]

3 outs. what a huge sample size. not the same thing as being relied on to anchor a postseason rotation.

 

and yeah, meredith's better than heilman. look up the numbers.

and you obviously haven't seen billy wagner in the postseason or have a selective memory. yeah, hoffman blew a save in the world series against arguably the greatest team ever and would've been out of the all-star game (which means shit) if garner had rolen in the game or didn't have cabrera stradling the line with two outs. piazza owned hoffman over his career. no arguments here. what team is piazza on now? you're gonna tell me all 500 saves weren't big spots? are games only YOU watch big spots? sorry, doens't work that way. moves saves ever, best save percentage ever. period.

 

tom glavine is 3-5 and has an ERA of 4.68 in the second half. i'm not scared.

 

worry about cameron getting on base? i'm assuming when you talked about running on piazza you had jose reyes in mind right? cameron has a better OBP than reyes.

wells and el duque have VERY similar postseason resumes--which not coincidently were earned playing for a dynasty. el duque is 9-3 with a 2.55 ERA and accumulated ALL of his positive postseason stats with one of the greatest dynasties in baseball history. wells is 10-4 with a 3.15 ERA in the postseason and he accumulated these stats with toronto, cincinatti, NYY, baltimore and boston. if you write off wells, i can surely write off el duque. you do realize that the last time el duque won a postseason start was 2001 right? in 2004 he started a postseason game and got LIT UP for a 5.40 era. and you can talk about the world series game in 2003 all you want, but his back went out. what happened in his two starts before that against the twins and red sox? 2-0 with an ERA under 2.00. AND wells is our 3rd starter and el duque is being counted on to anchor your entire postseason rotation. why isn't tom 'hall of fame' glavine being asked to do that? oh right, his 2nd half numbers suck, but i shoudln't write him off cuz he won a few cy youngs 30 years ago

 

David Wright has as many stolen bases himself against the Pads as the entire Pads team has against the Mets. Reyes, Beltran, hell even Valentin or Chavez should join that party. You realize that Reyes has more runs scored this year than any player on the Pads? Camerons OBP is .06% points higher. I have seen Cameron when he is in one of his spells, he is a strikeout machine. In fact an interesting stat about reyes, no player in majoe league baseball history has ever had a season with as many runs scored, as many hits, as many homers and as many steals as Reyes has. But hey he has not struck out 139 times and has a .06% OBP less than Cameron.

 

Yeah Hoffman is money in the big spot, thats why the NL has homefield right? and Brosius did not destroy him in 98?

 

Want to recite Glavines second half stats? Fine. Do not give the "post season is a different game young man" arguement then.

 

David Wells won 7 of his 10 post season games as a member of that "dynasty" as well. Guess cause the Yankees were so good those stats do not count?

 

Guess that is why they play the games, glad you are so confident the Pads will probably be going to the WS. The oddsmakers have still made the mets the favorites and guess you expect an upset. Its why they play the games I suppose and I assume every team has their reasons they will win. I just feel the Mets are far and away 1-25 better than the rest of the NL. Thus far that opinion has held true. Suppose we shall see.

[Herc]

anyway i'm not trying to make this about met bashing. they're a good team and have a great lineup. but with pedro out and beltran hobbling you've kind of been brought back down to the pack--as evidenced by the way you guys have played in september. i'm not saying the padres will beat the mets in the NLDS because we have a few flaws of our own, but show some respect.

[xxi-xxv]

anyway i'm not trying to make this about met bashing. they're a good team and have a great lineup. but with pedro out and beltran hobbling you've kind of been brought back down to the pack--as evidenced by the way you guys have played in september. i'm not saying the padres will beat the mets in the NLDS because we have a few flaws of our own, but show some respect.

 

 

BY the way Beltran is fine and after homering last night had another 2 hits tonight. Do not worry about Carlos he is fine, thats why they gave him 9 days off.

 

The Pads are winning the west anyway, they will not face the Mets in the LDS, it will be the LCS.

 

Pads are probably the best team on paper outside the Mets in the Nl entering the playoffs. I have zero use for the Cards(watch them get hot now ) and the Dodgers do nothing for me either. As for the Stros, that pitching is all fine and good, but Clemens can be shaky(as seen tonight) and pettite is banged up. Their lineup is so weak that it is quite possible the Mets or anyt other team could match them inning for inning based purely on that fact alone. Plus their overall pen is a disaster and their manager IMO is an utter idiot.

 

One thing the Pads have and this goes for Larussa is the best manager in the playoffs.

[Herc]

see that's all i wanted

[xxi-xxv]

see that's all i wanted

 

eww Dbacks up 3-1

 

Giants up on the Dodgers 3-0 though

[Herc]

i know, im watching on gamecast. last chance for the pads. thank god the dodgers areplaying their biggest rival and wont have some team rolling over for them

[so-cal dub]

i know, im watching on gamecast. last chance for the pads. thank god the dodgers areplaying their biggest rival and wont have some team rolling over for them

This game is becoming prety damn exciting for an NL West game...

[feefifoefum]

anyway i'm not trying to make this about met bashing. they're a good team and have a great lineup. but with pedro out and beltran hobbling you've kind of been brought back down to the pack--as evidenced by the way you guys have played in september. i'm not saying the padres will beat the mets in the NLDS because we have a few flaws of our own, but show some respect.

 

Beltran is not hobbling and the Mets of September weren't exactly the same Mets who ran away with the league. Tonight's lineup included Chris Woodward, Michael Tucker, Julio Franco, and Endy Chavez. On the bench were Reyes, Wright, and Shawn Green. Floyd hasn't played in awhile, but should be ready for game 1 of the NLDS. This has been going on for weeks now, and the Mets have been without the real Pedro since May.

[so-cal dub]

Dodgers win....

 

 

Uh oh Midas, 2 games left. Gonna make for a good weekend of baseball.

[Plax 4 Prez]

Dodgers and Padres tied at 86-74

Dodgers 5 game winning streak

Padres have lost 1

 

2 HUGE games on FOX today at 4pm!!!!

 

Go Padres!!

 

I so want to rock the hell out of Maddux for old time's sakes!!!

[xxi-xxv]

Dodgers and Padres tied at 86-74

Dodgers 5 game winning streak

Padres have lost 1

 

2 HUGE games on FOX today at 4pm!!!!

 

Go Padres!!

 

I so want to rock the hell out of Maddux for old time's sakes!!!

 

I want tons of extra inning games and possibly one of them to have to play a 1 game playoff Monday. Tire them out