fishgutmartyr

I know I am dating myself but the

Joe Pisarchek / Herm Edwards Disaster

ranks as one of my worst moments

because it was the Eagles and

in those days winning was rare

 

I was young and me and my dad's jaw

dropped to the floor like in a cartoon.

 

Stunned and SHocked !! ]

Not easy being a Giants fan!!!

Same here--It was the first time my dad ever heard me curse!

He stopped his 4 minute/4 letter diatibe to tell me to watch my mouth. :lol:

There was another game a year or so later against Dallas at home--The defense was putting up a heroic effort, the stadium was rocking, and we were in the lead despite a totally ineffective offense. Staubach pulled off a 2 minute drill, and we lost, and the camera focused on Harry sitting on the bench, despondent. I never felt so much for a player than I did for Harry that day.

Craig Morton going to the Superbowl in '78 pissed me off, too.

Then it has to be Minn in '97 and SF in 2002. I spent all of 2000 waiting for the other shoe to drop, so I wasn't that upset with the loss.

"If Eli Manning continues to struggle with consistency, New York will likely underachieve.

Another concern for the Giants' coaching staff is wide receiver Plaxico Burress, who basically disappeared in the playoffs loss to Carolina. If he doesn't get the ball a lot early in games he can drift away mentally and start to underachieve. For this offense to play up to its potential, Burress must be focused in every game and become the go-to guy, especially in the red zone.

 

The Giants also need to keep tight end Jeremy Shockey and Barber healthy for an entire season. In Shockey's case, he just seems to be a brittle guy who is plagued by annoying nicks and bruises that slow him down."

 

Key points, often noted here by a few of the more astute among us. Those glaring holes noted, combined with a brutal schedule, and my prediction of a 6-10 season remains intact.

Burress is our only wide-receiver? But I thought Kerry Collins would make this offense sing with our talent?

We're in trouble if Barber gets injured? Hey, if we have multiple injuries on our o-line, we're sunk too. Or the linebackers, defensive line, wide receivers, etc. In other words, no shit.

Shockey's broken collar bone last year was one of those "annoying nicks and bruises?"

Where are these "glaring holes"? Your quote sites a couple of potential problems as "if" statements, and talks about Barber not getting an injury, which he hasn't had in years.

Will we win the NFC East? Too close to hazard a guess, but we're definitely in the hunt.

10-6 isn't winning the East.

I disagree. Not because the teams are poor, but because the East is going to beat the crap out of each other. The team that wins the division is going to be the team that manages a sweep of one of the other three teams. Most of the series are going to be splits.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are two teams with 10-6 records, with tie-breakers determining the final standings.

If we get through this schedule and get to the championship game, we're not losing. The big if is getting through this schedule without having an entire group of players on IR.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to recall that the coaches liked him last year. If he's improved, he might be useful.

in short who cares...

Yeah, that's another way of putting it.

The guy was constantly dinged even before going on eternal IR. It's a shame, because when he was able to stay on the field for more than a play or so, he was actually pretty good. But he's never on the field, so any talent he has is moot.

The Giants have basically remained the same losing Will Allen and Kendrick Clancy, while replacing them with an aging Sam Madison and inury proned headcase Lavar Arrington.

Lavar Arrington replaces Kendrick Clancy? Huh. Tim Lewis is writing some innovative schemes, that's for sure.

thanks, i was worried for a second......at least bunkley will play his 1st year.

 

i look for mathias kwikimart to be a special team ace for the next few years as he waits for strahan to retire!!!!

Having your 1st round pick not start his first year because of the pre-existing talent level is hardly a dilemma.

I don't know if you could consider this a bust, but I think that Mario Williams is going to seem like it for a long time. When you think about Houston passing on Reggie Bush and how the Houston fans reacted to that, he is going to have to be outstanding almost immediately in order to get past the circumstances in which he was drafted. That he's a defensive lineman, the liklihood of that happening is going to be very small.

I think he's going to be good, maybe even with Houston, but it won't be recognized until he ends up on another team.

I'm not so worried about our depth at linebacker as you should be with your starters...

With the flubbed first surgery, this is really the first time Taylor is coming into camp completely healthy. With all of his nagging injuries last year having to do with his legs, I'd hazard a guess that they were stemming from the surgery last year. That being said, it's "shit or get off the pot" time.

I wouldn't look too deep into Carter's contract. I think it was more of an insurance signing in case we didn't pick up Moss. Carter managed to go through last season relatively uninjured (at least for him). Still, he didn't contribute anything of significance, so I wouldn't really consider him a lock for anything.

if anything i think collins got a bum rap in this town and on these boards--just like fassel. but that can be attributed to the steinbrennerization of ny sports fans

I was going to ask "How so?" until I realized that you were going to bring up his "even seasons," just like I brought up his "odd seasons."

That's really another reason he drove me crazy: he could actually play very well, but the things in which he was bad, he was very bad.

Again, I'm not saying he shouldn't be respected for what he did, I just think that the regard that he is held at by some fans is higher than what he actually achieved.

I would have to say Carlos Emmons, until another former eagle joins the roster.

Getting a team to a SB (schedule not withstanding) holds a lot of weight with any fanbase.

 

Collins is worthy of selective esteem because he flashed with greatness, you needn't look to the MInnesota game, just look to our Monday night against Dallas two season ago when the entire offense played poorly (due in large part to an unnecessary rearrangement of the OL that season).

 

No KC is not a great player, but he could have been and if you're a football fan sometimes you have to learn to love players. I mean really, Tiki was a work in progress and nobody loved, loved him a few years back...he too just seemed like he had a lot of promise.

I can understand what you're saying, Gspotter. I'll even agree with you, in that he did flash. But I spent more Sundays frustrated with him than not, and never felt the confidence with the team that I had this past year with him at the helm.

Who is praising Collins so much?

I've seen it on the GMB, BBI...not necessarily here. But there seems to be a lot of Giants fans on a whole that think he was the greatest.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but what's the deal?

For every good game Collins had, he had a disasterous one. He holds the record for fumbles in a season, and that doesn't include his interceptions for that year; he was a sitting duck in the pocket, and if anyone got around the LT, the ball was hitting the ground. If he scrambled in the red zone, the ball was going to be intercepted. I actually sat there during games and called his fumbles and ints. I even called his fumble during the Raider game last year.

I'm not saying he's the worst QB ever to play in a game for the Giants ("Dandy" Randy Dean holds that title), but I wouldn't hold him in the same esteem as a Phil Simms or YA Tittle, either. I think he was a mediocre player during a time when most QBs coming out of college were sub-par (Besides Farve and McNair, name great QBs in the 90's that weren't finishing their career--I'll even give you Aikman, because his career finished earlier than it should have).

I understand how bad our QBs were in the mid/late-90's. But really, what does that have to do with Collins' play? If you are using that logic, then you need to hold Phil Simms in higher regard than Joe Montana, because I would definitely take Brown, Graham, and Kanell over Pisarcik, Golsteyn, and Dean.

Again, I'm not trying to trash the man, he did play his best for us, but I really don't understand why his pedestal is so high.

I think Emmons is staying. We have two guys that can play WILL at a competent level, or at least we hope we do. Before the draft, I thought he was going, but with Arrington going SAM, and Emmons going weakside, I don't think that would make sense any longer.

I think the competition is between Blackburn and Short. And it is going to come down to where the coaches are going to place the highest value: backup at a single position and specials, or backup at two positions. Short is slow, but Blackburn had herniated discs in his upper spine. Short is mediocre but has starting experience, Blackburn is fast but has only played linebacker in 1 1/2 games.

i think everyone on the planet is familiar with the photo of Eli being drunk last year before the playoff game against Carolina with the college chick.....and if not, here is the photo

 

Look how calm he is. No pressure, he's getting laid. He's willing it so.

Donovan, of course, would suddenly get the "flu."

cool.....i just got a rubik's cube and a teddy ruxpin

wanna come over to play????

When is the next Kennedy Presidency? Seems to be the only time the Eagles can win a championship.

Agreed, and that is why Ernie is so gone now - the Mara's are already getting their list in order and Bill Parcells should be the top of the list. The Giants can keep their cap guy and have a negotiator, but let Bill select the players in the draft and free agency, he won't bring in the aged, injured and unneeded like Ernie does.

Parcells is notorious for bringing in old players that he drags with him from team to team. So far with Dallas, he's brought in Testaverde, Bledsoe, and Johnson, all of them past their prime.

Parcells as a GM would be a disaster. I never considered his ability to choose personnel his strength, even when he was here. If George Young wasn't calling those shots, we'd still be waiting for Superbowl rings.

If you're going to constantly talk about replacing EA with a great GM anyway, at least pick a good one.

Hell think about Mario Williams for a second, that's pressure.

That's really my point. If Bush turns out to be just one of the best RBs in the league, that poor SOB is going to have to play like Reggie White to get any acceptance from Houston fans. He hasn't played a down, and he's already in disfavor.

Okay, I get it. We drafted the guy now let's build a case for why EA made such a good move with this pick.

 

IMO, it's simply not a good move.

 

Years ago, we needed a tight end, the best one available was Shockey, we traded up to get him.

 

We needed a running back when we picked up Dayne.

 

We needed a corner: we traded up to get Will Allen

 

We held our ground and picked Shaun Williams up because we needed safety help.

 

Ike Hilliard was a need, hell you could say Eli was a need because of the fact that Collins had one year on his contract.

 

We needed help at DT a few years back when we drafted William Joseph.

 

Even last year, Corey Webster was a need at corner.

 

Fact is, in previous drafts, we've filled needs, you cannot deny this. Even though Allen, Williams, Dayne and to a lesser extent Hilliard never became studs that you expect from first rounders, the Giants did the right thing with those drafts and can be only faulted for bad scouting.

 

DE was not a need before this years draft. How many people here were calling for Strahan's eventual replacement prior to this draft.? About as many as were looking for Tiki's, a guy who has hinted that when his contract is up, he's gone, Strahan hasn't said anything!. Yet we never thought about getting a running back.

 

DT was a need, did we address it with Cofield, I hope so, I truly hope we did and he pans out because I want the Giants to win. But everything points to the fact that McCargo was the better pick. Be it late first round or late 2nd round. We could have had him at 25 because he went 26.

 

I find it funny to hear guys say we have to pick the best available player, but isn't the purpose of that defeated when you trade down seven spots, just to get later round picks. We're giving up on the possibility of the 25th best player in the draft and are satisfied with getting the 32nd best. Very strange.

Of the 5 guys that were drafted by need in the first round (Eli really wasn't a need, we could have extended Collins if we wanted to; Webster was 2nd round), 3 of those players were, to put it mildly, disappointing. Other than a superbowl due to an incredibly weak NFC that year, what has our record been after drafting by need? Some of it has to do with scouting, but some of it also has to do with us getting guys who simply didn't deserve to be drafted in the first round, even if they were the best available at their position. If it makes you feel any better, I was just as confused when we drafted Carl Banks back then.

Even Shockey, we only traded up 2 spots for him. To get a great DT, we would have had to trade up 12 spots to get Bunkley, as it turned out. What would that have left us as far as draft picks are concerned?

Even if we blew off the trade and picked McCargo (which is what we would have had to do, considering the huge reach the Bills did), there is no way he would have been able to meet the expectations we would have had if he was our first round choice. The pressure on the kid would have been off of the charts, especially with the "reach" tag he would have gotten from the media. Hell, look at the pressure Kiwi is going to feel, and he was pegged to be a first-rounder.

Just some thoughts.

"Working out with Jeremy and Plaxico" means hanging out at your house or the swimming pool all day, getting drunk and patronizing nudie bars at night.

...

Hey Drew, Can I work out with Jeremy and Plax?

EVERY PLAYER SHOULD BE PRACTICING WITH HIS TEAM...

 

espcially when it was apparent last season when the wheels fell off of our passing game completely, and neither QB nor WR was comfortable or on the same page with eachother...

This argument conflicts itself.

The "wheels fell off" in the second half of the season. They had already played numerous games together, so chemistry should not be an issue, even with less practice time in the offseason. If that had taken place at the beginning of the season, you would have a point.

By your argument, if chemistry fell apart in the second half of the season, not only should they not work out together now, but they shouldn't practice with each other in training camp in order to make sure that chemistry is maintained throughout the season. Obviously, I'm not advocating that, I'm simply pointing out a major flaw in your position.