gateb

Dude, Albert Pujols is having one of the most amazing seasons I've EVER seen. What he did in the first half of the season was ridiculous; and he did it in a lineup that was definitely worse than the Phillies. He's easily the MVP.

That's not the argument. Can you deny Ibanez will easily be in the top 5 for MVP voting by the end of the year? We could have had that on our team, but that went to our biggest rival.

GAteB a case can be made that we have not had a legitimate run producing corner outfielder since Bernard Gilkey in 1996. When we had a catcher and 2nd basemen that put up 30 100 and 100 we could compensate for the lousy corner spots. We do not have that anymore. The neglect of the corner OF spots goes back to the Philips days, only then it was made up for elsewhere in spots that usually did not produce those numbers. I overesitimated Murphy as well, I think his lack of defense hurt him offensively if that makes sense. I know he can hit.

 

Bottom line is the Phillies are much better, have been for a while. Now, with our 100% healthy team minus Delgado we were 28-21 and 1.5 games ahead in the division, so I suspect we would have competed with them had things remained equal, but ultimately they are better, have been for a while.

Jason Bay could provide some stability in the corner outfield spot. I'm not sure what his asking price will be and I have a feeling Boston will overwhelm him before he can hit the market. But he'd be the most reasonable fit.

I think Ibanez would have been realistic had we not had the false sense of comfort in Murphy playing LF.

Him going to the Phils was a huge shift in the balance of power. We've been in a year long platoon in left while the Phillies might have the league's MVP there.

So I clicked on the NFLN the other night and rewatched a game, Big Ben vs ELI from late in the year 2004 one week(6 days actually) after a young ELI had his 0.00 rating day vs the Ravens. Anyway couple of things stuck out to me.

 

That may have been the day that ELI was able to see the light at the end of the tunnel. He was coming off that awful week, facing Big Ben who was undefeated as a starter at that point and was hearing all the crap. He played very well that day(better than Ben in fact) and showed that Eli unflappable demenor that we all now know. One thing, he is such a better QB now, they completely simplified things for him that day and watching him now its like night and day.

 

Our O line consisted of a man named Winey and Whittle and quite frankly I always like Jason Whittle but he was really not any good, at least as compared to this line.

 

The overall depth was garbage. Kevin Lewis was the starting MLB, Kendrick Allen and Lance Legree anchored up front, while a man named Hollowell played significant time at LB. All players that on todays team would be lucky to even make the practice squad.

 

Tim Lewis was awful, just plain awful.

 

The Wills could not cover or catch a cold.

 

We've come a long way baby...thats for sure. Thankfully.

A few bitter recollections about the game:

The non roughing call on Polamalu when he threw Barber when he was way out of bounds.

The roughing call the Giants were on the wrong side on third or forth down, I forgot which. Pitt didn't punt the whole game right?

Amani's non PI call.

If they are going to do something and give up on the season then trading Sheff, with the season he has had would probably get us a couple of good prospects. I wouldn't trade Reyes, though. We have no heir apparent to him right now. Even though he is hurt, a trade of Delgado near the deadline, particularly if he looks like he is doing well in his rehab assignment in Port St Lucie at the time (which is probably what he will be doing) could very well net us something of value. Church is another I would explore a market for.

If we could attain Reyes' heir in the trade would you consider it then?

Think about it. A Future ace. A solid SS. And a future 1b slugger. Would you do that?

It'd be tough to at least not consider.

This could be a little off, and I'd think players might have come out and said something if it were true, but is it possible having the Mohegan Sun Sports Bar being the batters eye is helping the players track the ball better? Has the batters eye ever been glass before?

It's the wind currents. Look at how many balls hit softly are landing in the first or second rows of of the stands.

You could be partially right but it's obvious the ball is carrying at an unnatural rate.

SportsCenter did a "Not So Top Ten" Mets version today. Maybe if you watch again later this afternoon, they'll replay it. You can relive Daniel Murphy dropping balls, the F-Mart face plant (still makes me laugh), Ryan Church air mailing it home from centerfield, and of course, Luis blowing the game against the Yanks.

 

Murphy had three appearances! Safe to say LF is not his position.

I saw it. I can't believe how bad it actually has gotten.

Right on the day after the Phils rack up 22 too.

I would keep guys like Cora who could be valuable if we resurrect in 2010.

Sheff is really the only guy I would trade that would warrant at least something.

I don't know what we're going to do this off-season. Our farm sucks, so we need to start stockpiling our draft picks. By doing that we can't keep signing prized free agents. I just want this team to go in a direction.

And yes, I would listen to offers for Reyes. I wouldn't look to trade him but if we can get some serious value in return Omar should consider it.

IMO the Omar Minaya watch is on. The lack of a farm system and any prospects worth a damn under his watch is glaring. Any GM can spend money and sign Beltran, Krod, Pedro, etc. or make a no brainer deal like JOhan and hand him 140 mil. The good ones keep churning out players in the low levels and above.

 

To see the Mets awful minor league situation all you need to do is look at the records of the AAA Buff Mets and the AA Bing Mets.....its disgusting.

 

This is on Omar.....

Agreed. The only farmhand we got lucky with was Omir and that probably won't even last the rest of the year.

Awful. At least you had '86

Clearly, neither is F-Mart. Same for Evans.

 

We need to get guys healthy. We need Beltran, Reyes, an effective Putz, an effective Ollie, and Maine. And we need Delgado.

 

But what is really terrible is all the mistakes. Castillo and Cora letting that ball drop (which was Cora's ball). We've seen a lot of mental mistakes, which are the worst kind. We have a whole lineup that has been taught to try and take the ball the opposite way every AB. Our best hitter is just trying to "shoot the gaps." At least pick some spots to try and drive the ball, David. Sheffield is the team's most feared hitter right now, and he still does the same things that he's been doing his entire career. Hit the ball hard... and if they make a mistake, make 'em pay dearly.

 

This team is over-coached and tight. You look at a team like the Rays... they are loose. Joe Maddon lets guys try and steal a base whenever they want. They play the game hard but they have fun. They also lead the majors in homeruns and stolen bases, and are in the hunt for the division. This team needs a manager like Joe Maddon. Guys that MANAGE the team, not try and dictate the course of every game, and I think there is a difference. This team stinks right now. Part of it is the injuries, but part of it is Manuel and Howard Johnson (and HoJo was my favorite player of that era). I hesitate to pin the hitting struggles on HoJo, because I wouldn't be surprised if Jerry wasn't just dictating to HoJo how things are going to be.

That's a bad comparison Jim. Maddon is living in manager heaven right now. A small market, some vets, LOTS of young talent that can develop without being in the glare of a harsh media. If Joe was in this situation he'd look a lot worse right now.

BTW if it wasn't for a recent winning streak the Mets and Rays would be around the same record, so with a lot more talent and less pressure Maddon really isn't doing that good a job as you think.

I'm just tired of talking about the manager. It's up to the players.

Seattle? They're quietly at .500

Guys I hate to say it, we need to just sit back and let whatever happens happen. This team is a)not very good with or without their big players and b)has ZERo in terms of tradeable chips. Imo the best trade option might be Beltran. Its not even being pessimistic, because at this point what has happened to this team is ridiculous in terms of injuries its just how it is. I think the Mets have to concentrate on having the best arms and as athletic a team as they can have. Trading older guys for prospects, although not ideal for a 140 mil payroll team in a new ballpark is the longterm goal this franchise has to take.

The only deal I'd shed an eye to is the one the A's are allegedly looking for in Holliday. A proven OF and a prospect like the Teixera deal last year. Beane is supposedly a fan of Church and maybe would like a Dillon Gee type.

That's really the only headline deal I'd consider at this point. Otherwise I'm with you, I don't want to mortgage the future either.

The second he feels he can pitch again he should be thrown in the pen. His frame is too light to be a 180+ innings guy a year. He does have swing and miss stuff and does know what he's doing. I think he could be valuable in the pen. At least more so than 4 months of SP during the regular season.

Chris Perez was the Cards top pitching prospect and that's what it took to get him.

Would you have traded Parnell and another prospect for him?

We're gonna have to start aquiring some fresh arms in the pen. Especially a lefty.

You know not for nothing, but if I told you the Mets would lose Reyes AND Delgado for extended time begining in May, would lose JJ Puts for 2-3 months, would get nothing from Ollie Perez, would lose John Maine to the DL, would lose Church for a few weeks, Daniel Murphy would be hitting 238 on June 17th and they would have no one on the roster with over 10 homers. How many games would you say they were out? 10? 12?

 

Its time we start giving Manuel some credit. I am not crazy about the man and think he is too forgiving of many of the mental errors this team makes, 3 of which come to mind that actually cost them wins. With all that said they are 3 out. If I am a Phillies fan when you consider what they have gotten from some of key guys besides the big 3 and the Mets are in the state they are in I would be very frustrated(not with my team)but with the fact the Mets are hanging in.

 

3 out with what has occured is a minor miracle at this point.

 

As for guys to get, go get Huff, hes versatile and does not create controversy when and if Delgado comes back as he can play the OF and add a nice little rotation with Sheff, Church and can spell Delgado late in games for defense.

 

Its gonna be interesting how this team uses this time as a confidence booster as to what they could really do when at full strength.

I'm worried that we're not gonna get Reyes back. For some reason I have a bad feeling he'll keep getting setbacks until he has to be shut down completely. Like wagner last year.

Here's a list... Holliday's there, also Aubrey Huff. Slim pickings. Jason Bay is there, who I think is the absolute perfect fit on this team (wondering why we didn't make a bid for him last year when he was being shopped), obviously he's not going to be available.

Link

I love Victor Martinez.

Yeah, gateb, going off of the Chipper quote it seems as though he's just frustrated that it's so hard to hit one out. XXI said something interesting about him, that he's never considered him a true homerun guy, that he should be a high average guy, with 18-20 or so homers, a lot of stolen bases, etc. I think that would be great as long as he's hitting .330 plus. We just need guys to drive in runs. Honestly I'm good with Wright being that type of player, but we still need the power bats in the lineup. Beltran maybe has a bit more power than Wright, but he's almost in the same boat, you know... kind of a tweener as far as being a power bat or a line drive hitter. I think we need two legit homerun bats in the lineup... Delgado and Sheffield circa 2003 would do it, lol. Really, even though I still believe Church has potential, we need more from our corner outfield spots than potential.

Yeah. If we had a bopper in the middle of the lineup no one would care that Wright's power numbers were down. They'd probably be complimenting about how he's improved as an overall ball player and adjusted his game to the park he'll be playing in for the rest of his career.

I'm going to be a broken record on this. Matt Holliday is the perfect antidote. We desperately need a right handed hitter that can put the ball over the fence any given at bat. I know his numbers aren't exactly staggering, but he's more of a threat than any other guy we have.

Any thumpers out there that will be FAs in 2009-10?

Yes. Despite my recent outburst of frustration, I really hope we see some happier times soon. I'll settle for some good ball being played. I would like to see some of the young players start to show signs of becoming excellent players, guys like Murphy or F-Mart. I'm not giving up on the season... but as xxi said in the other thread, this team really misses Reyes, and to a lesser degree, Delgado. I do like the fact that we seem to have found a good one in Parnell.

I disagree. I don't think it's about playing good baseball anymore because a third of our daily starters right now will not be starting in October if we are to get that far. We have to muster up as many wins as possible, however they may come, and hope we're within 4-5 games of the WC and/or division by August.

Yet he's leading the league in hitting, has solid RBI numbers with nothing batting in front of him, and has 17 SBs.

He's fine. God forbid we get some adequate support from him then his numbers would be better.

Putz was the one they should have made stay home.

This whole thing pisses me off more and more.

You know this friggin team does show some heart. Albeit last night was brutal, but thats a brutal loss no matter who you are playing. To come out today and win that game behind a AAA pitcher showed me something. Say what you will but this team plays for Jerry and despite missing 2 of their best 4 players they continue to stay in it.

 

Some points I think need to be made.

 

Although I will not annoint him as anything more than a backup, Santos should be the I will not say EVERYDAY catcher but the MAJORITY catcher. He plays hard. Reminds me a bit of what the Phils found in Chris Coste a few years back.

 

I am not a big Church fan, but hes healthy, let him play RF the MAJORITY of the time.

 

Correctly spot Sheff, bastard can hit when healthy, but needs his rest play him 5 of 7 games or 4 of 7 depending on matchups.

 

Let Murphy play 1b. SOB has a good infield glove and I believe if you can get Church going some and maybe Reed spelling Sheff to keep him healthy you can let Murphy just work his way through his ups and downs.

 

Say whatever you want about Wright, motherfer can hit. I have never felt he was a home run hitter and maybe Citi has made him change his approach some. I prefer 360 18-20 and 100 with all the steals over 290 30 and 100. He has been clutch too.

 

Sean Green seems to have found his way, the ground ball ability is key.

 

I am starting to like what I see, even from this undermanned bunch. They play hard and lets face it are dealing with losses to personnel that would cripple most teams in the majors.

 

I would like to see less mental errors and maybe some sort of accountabilty on the players part for them, but all in all they have shown me something, especially today. No matter what happens tomorrow they are staying afloat.

I just think there is too much negativity surrounding this team right now. The next big losing streak could be a damning one and eventually break the squad down. I think this negativity gets alleviated by one thing: a big trade.

Beane was supposed to be a big Church fan. Maybe he looks at Dillon Gee highly. And a young, raw prospect that's a couple years away but could be special. Could that get a Holliday deal done? Not sure, but I really hope Omar looks into making that happen. A power right handed hitting bat is what the Mets need.

I think today proves this game is all about starting pitching. If Nieve got off to a slow start and gave up a few runs, do the Mets put together all these solid rallies today? Or do they press knowing they are trailing with a minor league pitcher against a team with a tough lineup in a little league park? Nieve was a godsend today in a game that was as big as any for an interleague battle in June.

The guy is having a career year so far. But he's 37 and got a 3 year deal at over $10 million a year. Maybe he would've been worth it, but I have to believe that a guy his age is going to lose some bat speed sooner or later, and that's a lot of money and years to spend on a 37 year old.

 

But you're right, the Mets figured that Murphy and/or F-Mart would be the answer at some point. It's a long season.

After two years of failure even if the Mets knew the benefits would last one year they still had to give it a shot. With a relatively thin system and the third oldest team in the league I just can't believe we weren't really interested in him.

We can't score runs late it doesn't matter.

Forget manny why didn't we sign this guy?

Daniel Murphy that's why. We thought we were set with this guy in left.

This game is pissing me off tonight