Zelmo

The Giants need to think long-term with this position....hopefully T2 makes a full recovery, but they really should be prepared for the worst.

We just used a first round pick on a CB...

-Z

4. Kicker and Punter (Lawrence Tynes, Rhys Lloyd, Steve Weatherford, Matt Dodge

 

My picks: Rhys Lloyd (please God), Matt Dodge (I'm a believer)

 

Jim, I'm very with you on this one. I think Dodge is gonna be fantastic. The only thing is at the end of the day he's yet to play well in the regular season and you have to know if it's worth taking special teams risks for the chance to have a great young punter when you have an excellent veteran like Weatherford there.

But I'm firmly on the Dodge bandwagon.

-Z

When you go to giants.com it says "NBC 4 NEWYORK/NFL NETWORK"

-Z

Refresh my memory--why should Calvin Pace be targeted? I honestly don't remember.

He's the one who hit Eli when he gashed open his forehead. The hit was completely clean so I'm not sure if there's any reason for retaliation.

The two culprits in that situation were Brandon Jacobs for being in the way and the facemask of that other Jets player...not Calvin Pace.

-Z

I expect a series or two this game against the jets and same with the pats game.

Lol dude...our starters will play the whole first half...and Rex Ryan said he'll play his starters through the first series of the second half. (All this assuming there won't be cows and trees swirling in the stadium.)

This is standard procedure throughout the NFL.

-Z

This kinda reads like a Jack thread.

-Z

Are you drinking? I don't care if every damn coach in the NFL does it (they don't)... it doesn't mean I have to agree with it. Sorry if I'm tired of losing critical players for the season in meaningless games.

 

And the horsepoo about them needing to get into game shape at this point is exactly that, horsepoo. We're talking vets here. As I said, there is no good rationalization for it.

Lol not drinking....just thought it was funny to see the Skins and Ravens battling out the first half of a preseason game, literally to the last second, with their starters, considering everything that people were saying here.

-Z

It get's better!!! The Ravens just got the ball back with 51 seconds and NO timeouts and they have Flacco out there trying to score...And guess what? The Redskins have their starters out there.

Idiots all of them.

-Z

The Ravens just brought the house on a blitz. They're so stupid. Don't they realize people might get injured? Are they trying to win??? Don't they see the risk???

-Z

Under two minutes to go in the first half. So according to many people on this board this would by now make Tom Coughlin, Lovie Smith, Mike Shanahan, and John Harbaugh all complete idiots.

And don't try to tell me seriously that since it's the third game of the preseason for these teams, suddenly it's okay. I know teams keep players in for longer as the pre-season moves along, but seriously, everyone here should be ripping every head coach. Don't tell me last week it's a crime to play TT the last two minutes of the first half but a week later it'll be okay to play veterans in the third quarter.

Seriously, lay off Tom Coughlin. Ed Reed is out there for God's sake. And they're blitzing as well!

-Z

It's becoming more and more difficult the more I look into it...

-Z

We lost a game against the Texans that year too cause the snap went over Matt Allen's head for a safety.

 

16 to 14.

 

If long snapping was easy, every one would do it...but it's a skill.

I also think part of the skill is the blocking part. The long snapper has two hands on the ball and is bent all the way over and has to bring himself up very quickly to block, much different than a regular snap.

Though I'm not gonna lie I don't understand why you can't train linemen with existing roster spots to do it.

-Z

There's no "Brian Williams" in the NFL.com Player database.

Brian Williams at ProFootballReference

-Z

Actually, Z, I just went to the tape... lol, popped in the Road to XLII DVD... the starters for the Super Bowl at CB was Webster and Ross. I'm thinking Madison was the nickel in that game.

Lol there ya go....thanks for checking.

-Z

You're pretty wrong. But I agree with you on Madison... he played out of his mind that year and basically gave it everything he had left in the tank. I think a past his prime Madison being better than an in his prime Ross is a highly questionable statement, though. Not that I think Ross is a superstar, but he's not as bad as you're claiming.

 

Ross was the starter opposite Madison, though.

You're right I stand corrected Ross did start much of the season...I was thinking about the SB....Did Webster start in the SB?

-Z

And the fact that starters had the whole first half to get them up to game speed doesn't have anything to do with whether or not they had faced an opposing teams starters playing a two minute offense yet...And they could use reps at that...

Your question about why he chose certain starters and not others is a valid one, and I'm pretty sure if you asked Tom he'd have a rationale for it.

For God's sake football and planning the Giants team is Tom's life, he's not just tossing things up in the air at random. He's not attempting to make his starters vulnerable. He's an experienced NFL coach trying to get his roster ready for week 1, who knows a heck of a lot more about where each player and unit is holding and which players and which units need more time/work in what situations etc... than we ever will.

-Z

How can you come to that conclusion, Z? They already had most of the entire first half for that. In fact, prior to the game, as I said, TC said the starters would only get about 25 snaps, and if he stuck to just 25, as the previous Bears' possession ended on snap 27, T2 wouldn't have been on the field. Plus TC already felt that Boley, Goff, Tuck, and Canty had already had enough action to "keep themselves fresh and on the ball." I mean, that kind of statement is a really piss poor defense. I simply refer you to Tom Coughlin's OWN pre-game statements of what he felt the starters needed.

Are you joking me? You're holding Tom Coughlin to the fact that he said 25 snaps and this was snap 27?? I'm sorry but that's completely unreasonable...

And even running with that logic, Coughlin didn't say 25, he said 25-30:

"Giants coach Tom Coughlin said his offensive starters would get between 25 and 30 snaps in Monday’s game against the Bears, according to the Newark Star-Ledger."

Link

It really doesn't make a difference whether he said 25 or 25-30, but if you're making a big deal out of his exact pre-game estimate then there ya go...

-Z

Sam Madison was the starter along with Aaron Ross, but Webster and Kevin Dockery also played crucial roles at corner that year. And Moss was pretty much taking advantage of Madison in that game.

I'm pretty sure Webster was the other starter...

And Moss can take advantage of basically any CB in the league so that isn't really a knock.

Plus it's true, Madison wasn't the best, but he was solid, and he was old and way past his prime. Old Sam Madison>Any Ross...

-Z

The Bears had a long field... it was the first play of their possession that started on their own 23 yard line. There was exactly 30 seconds left in the game when the play began... not sure how much of a two minute offense or defense you're getting ready for there.

 

Cutler was back out on the field at the time. The decision making there is still, IMO, foolhardy given that it is still just a preseason game, and these are veterans in the secondary that are well versed in how to defend a two minute offense.

This logic would defeat the purpose of playing starters at all. The starters are well versed in everything but you still need action to keep yourself fresh and on the ball.

-Z

this is true

 

in 2007 a NY team won the Super Bowl with those two fellows at CB.....how bad could they be.....

 

well neither will make 100 tackles, but if the RBs are getting that far we are going to have to overhaul the front 7 again

Not really. Sam Madison was our other CB.

-Z

Yeah he's prone to errors too but I'm hoping his form of last game is the "real " Ross. Don't shatter my illusion just yet, thanks.

 

Actually my main worry with coverage is the hole that Culter kept exploiting, after Webster passes the receiver off to Phillips in zone coverage. Culter got most of his yardage there in two throws.

Just think how much more fun that hole is gonna get when we're gonna need to be focusing the safety help on Ross's side...

-Z

Btw I was reading an interview with Coughlin and he said the main reason he still had starters in the game at that point was to give them reps against the Bears first team playing a two minute offense. Which btw, is probably the same reason the Bears had their first team offense on the field, to try a two minute drill. It's not really about winning and losing these games it's about getting your guys ready for week 1. Hence both teams out there getting their guys game reps in a two-minute offense and defense.

-Z

Let's revisit this topic when he forgets to touch a receiver down in a make it or break it game in week 15...or mistakes of that kind...

-Z

I'm really pinning my hopes on Ross stepping up and staying healthy. He looked really good last game with some great pass defense.

Am I the only one who can't stand Ross? Stupid punk is always doing something wrong. It's been since his rookie year that we're waiting for him to cut down on rookie mistakes...or am I being too harsh?

I really don't like Ross at starting CB, other teams are gonna exploit him and eat him alive.

-Z