Barens

I know, and I watched most of the Senior Bowl, and from what I can gather, it doesn't exactly favor CB's or LB's, because the defenses are extremely vanella, and they are restricted to do only so much. I generally think that most scouts sold more on the practices during the week, rather than the actual game, unless their overall play is really lousy.

Even if we did happen to go in that direction, I just think the quality of players he selected were pretty poor.

I agree with most of your assessment. I've seen the same things regarding Jimmy Williams, and from what I can gather, teams aren't high on the mental aspects of his game. I've seen him play in about 4 or 5 games last year, and he didn't impress me to the point of being a top 10 or 15 pick. Youboty, pretty much like you said, is kind of a unique prospect. He's the type of player who probably would have benefited from 1 more year, but he certainly has all the tools. Youboty had a very good sophomore season, but suffered a hip pointer in the middle of the season last year, and I believe that affected his play. Tye Hill, it's funny, he was beaten in the Senior Bowl by Moss, but there's clip of when they played during the season of a similar play where Hill defended Moss extremely well. I don't think Hill will fall to the #25 spot, but if he does, I wouldn't complain if we selected him. http://clemsontigers.cstv.com/sports/m-foo.../071205aaa.html

http://giants.scout.com/2/520094.html Straight Talk with Jim Sabo: Draft Day 1 By: Jim Sabo Giants Insider Date: Apr 13, 2006 The Giants have almost their full complement of picks in this draft, one in each round except the sixth, which they surrendered for Jason Whittle in a 2004 trade. Take us through your thinking on what may happen on draft day. At a minimum it’s good to have as many of your picks as possible. The trade with San Diego for Eli Manning has now been paid in full. They did not receive any compensatory picks. They still may make a few moves in free agency before the draft, but except for one big decision they need to resolve, the draft needs are fairly well set. The one thing still hanging as we go to press is LaVar Arrington. Technically, they are still in the running for Arrington along with Miami, Jacksonville and Cincinnati. As much as we think he could help the Giants at weakside linebacker, our gut feeling is he will not sign with the Giants. His high asking price has kept him from signing anywhere thus far. We also heard that former Redskins coaches were trashing him to other teams when they would call to inquire about him. There is also a reported rift between the Giants coaches and the front office about the signing. Most believe the front office wants him and the coaches don’t. So, for the purposes of this exercise we will assume Arrington will not be a Giant. Critical team needs at present are: a weakside linebacker as well as LB depth, a wide receiver, a defensive tackle to replace Kendrick Clancy, a running back for the future and more help in the secondary. If we can fill these needs through the draft, that would be good. So let’s get into it. Round One – The Giants are picking in the 25th slot. At that time of the draft it appears that there are a good number of linebackers and corners who will be available to them. They might also get a crack at one of the top four running backs. Let’s look at the LBs who could be there. D’Quell Jackson from Maryland, Demeco Ryans from Alabama, Bobby Carpenter from Ohio State and Kamerion Wimbley and Ernie Sims from Florida State. They won’t all be there, but there is a chance two or three will be. Jackson and Wimbley are better suited to a 3-4 defense. Sims is the most logical weakside backer. Some think Carpenter’s best position would be strongside, but we believe he is athletic enough to play weak. If we were going to go with a linebacker our choice would be Carpenter, but our fallback pick would be Sims. We believe there are only two wide receivers with first round grades and they are Chad Jackson from Florida and Santonio Holmes from Ohio State. Both of them should be long gone by the Giants’ pick at 25. Teams needing WR help will grab them early because of the sharp drop-off in talent. At some point they will need to be concerned about a replacement for Tiki Barber. We believe they could have their choice of Laurence Maroney from Minnesota or DeAngelo Williams from Memphis. While RB is important to consider, we don’t see them pulling the trigger on a first round back. Good corners will be available. Players like Tye Hill from Clemson, Antonio Cromartie from Florida State, Johnathan Joseph from South Carolina and Ashton Youboty from Ohio State could be available to them. We don’t see the need to trade up with this pick. Value will be there and that means no need to give up picks to move up. We would consider a trade down here but only at an attractive price and we wouldn’t go too low. With the offseason work they have done in the secondary we think it would be wise for them to get a linebacker in round one. So, with the 25th pick in round one our selection would be Bobby Carpenter from Ohio State. He is the son of former Giants’ running back Rob Carpenter. You will recall that Rob Carpenter was a real tough back. He ran hard and played with intensity. Bobby is a lot like his old man. He has that same toughness and love of the game. He is very athletic. He runs well and he can cover, which is essential for a weakside backer. He’s smart and has shown explosion in blitz situations. Round Two – We made a need pick in round one, but it was also a good value pick. It’s always good when your need coincides with talent at the top of your value board. In round two we will still be concentrating on need, but we want to make sure we don’t force a need pick and overlook obvious talent. In this spot we will be looking for a wide receiver, a defensive tackle, a corner, safety or a running back. We think WR is a position they can still do something about in free agency. We would like to see them sign veteran receiver Ricky Proehl. He has always wanted to play for the Giants and he is the kind of receiver that would help Manning tremendously. He catches the ball and with Manning’s current lack of accuracy that means a lot. So, our point is if they get Proehl they can look to fill another need. If they don’t we would consider Maurice Stovall from Notre Dame here. They are also putting a lot of faith in Corey Webster being ready to assume a starting corner role. If they look at a corner with this pick, we would consider Demario Minter from Georgia as the pick. There are a couple of DTs that would also be of interest here. Orien Harris from Miami and John McCargo from North Carolina State are solid candidates. Of these two we would prefer McCargo. He is a no-nonsense guy who is not afraid to do the dirty work. He’s a tough blue-collar guy who doesn’t look good in shorts, but is a player. He knows how to play the game and we like guys like him. Running back is another consideration here. Joseph Addai from LSU is a complete back that blocks and catches well. Jerious Norwood from Mississippi State is one of our sleeper picks; we like his slashing running style. Of the two we would prefer Norwood. So the choice would come down to Stovall, McCargo and Norwood. Our choice for the Giants with their second round pick is Jerious Norwood, RB, Mississippi State. You may ask why take a running back when Tiki Barber gets better with age. Well, Tiki is 31 now and his budding media career is waiting for him. We are not comfortable that his replacement is not presently on the team. Norwood could be that guy. Much like Barber, Norwood is not a jumbo back. He is fast and quick. He shows a lot of flash when he runs and he can use power too if he needs to. We like his field vision, which is important for a running back. He has reliable hands and he is a willing blocker. Round Three – So now we have an LB and an RB in our pocket. We still have needs to fill, but we can’t ignore obvious talent to force a need pick. There are two TEs we like that could be available. We like Tony Schleffler from Western Michigan and Joe Klopfenstein from Colorado. Schleffler is an emerging player. Scheffler was the closest TE to Vernon Davis at the Combine in athletic ability. He has good size and his 4.59 at 254 pounds is very good speed. We like his hands and though he needs some work, he is a willing blocker. Klopfenstein is a lot like former Giants TE Dan Campbell. He’s a good blocker who can also catch. We would consider a TE because Visanthe Shiancoe still cannot be trusted. A corner like Will Blackmon from Boston College would also be an option. We are aware of the Boston College connection with the Giants. Blackmon was a CB/WR but his pro position is CB. Joseph Scott, an OT from Texas, could be there as well. We are not enamored with Luke Petitgout at LT. Someone to challenge him would be a good idea in our opinion. Again, assuming they don’t sign Proehl, the WRs we like in this spot are Greg Jennings from Western Michigan and Mike Hass from Oregon. Hass is one of our favorite players. He’s fairly slow on the stopwatch, around 4.6 in the 40, but we really like his hands. He is field fast. He knows how to get open and is a great technician when it comes to routes. This would be a very difficult choice, but of these two we would chose Jennings. All things considered our pick for the Giants in round three would be WR Greg Jennings from Western Michigan. Jennings is not a burner at 4.48 in the 40, but we like his production on the field. He plays faster than he runs on the clock. He has only average WR size, but he has very good hands and he has good route skills. The most important thing he would bring is the ability to catch the ball. Here’s how the Giants’ final day one draft board should look: Round One – LB Bobby Carpenter, Ohio State Round Two – RB Jerious Norwood, Mississippi State Round Three – WR Greg Jennings, Western Michigan

I agree, Wroten was a heck of a player at LSU, and I think with the right coach, he could really excel. Plus, call me crazy, but I don't think that getting caught with marijuana should impact a players draft status the way that it does. There are much worse drugs, and far worse crimes.

You mean you didn't know that Ken Palmer is the Fab Four?

http://giants.scout.com/2/519767.html Inconsequential Giants are Beasts of East? By: Ken Palmer Date: Apr 12, 2006 Does anyone even remember that the Giants won the NFC East last season? Yes, I know most of you have the hats and shirts to prove it. But surely all the ticket stubs from last January’s playoff debacle to the Panthers have already gone up in smoke. These Giants might be the lowest-regarded division champs in league history. They’ve done nothing but improve this offseason, yet no one seems to be giving them even a fighting chance at defending their throne. This isn’t to say they will or won’t – because before the Draft is even held, it’s way too early to tell – just that it’s a tad shocking how quickly the mighty can fall – without doing anything to warrant said decline… It said in this space after the season that Jeremy Shockey and Plaxico Burress needed to cut their selfish act and join the rest of their mates in New Jersey for the offseason program. This isn’t to insinuate that Shockey and Plax can’t read, because they can – although attending Miami and Michigan State hardly deters one from thinking that way – just that they obviously don’t agree with their coach, quarterback and anyone else around the team that they’re not bigger than the club and that they should be here with everyone else. What makes things worse, their selfish behavior has also swallowed up William Joseph, who is nowhere near as good or established as that receiving duo to be given a green light to be down in Miami. Since Eli’s complaints last offseason did nothing, perhaps it’s time for Tiki Barber, Michael Strahan or even John Mara to call those guys out once again… What gives with Greisen: One of the cardinal rules of journalism is not to allow emotions and personal preferences to enter into your reporting. When it comes to Nick Greisen and his unfortunate unemployed situation at press-time, that’s darn near impossible. Not only is Greisen one of the classiest players to ever enter the Giants locker room, but he sure as heck played much better last season than two ‘backers the Giants currently have installed as starters – Reggie Torbor and Carlos Emmons. Yet the Giants haven’t even made a bargain basement offer to Greisen, who has had only one visit – to Tennessee – to date. And Big Blue shelled out a million a year to Tim Carter, who has to be 50-1 to even make it through the offseason program healthy. “I’m just playing the waiting game,” Greisen told TGI. “This is a crazy business.” Yes it is. As more time passes it might seem like a Greisen/Giants reunion would become more appealing to both sides. Forget about it – if it hasn’t happened yet, it’s not going to… Will P or not Will P? One of the offseason’s biggest questions remains the status of CB Will Peterson, who stayed in Arizona to rehab instead of joining his mates in New Jersey for the start of the offseason program. It’s becoming more and more apparent that Will P has apparently already suited up for the final time in a Giants uniform. Back injuries are tricky, as are players that are understandably wary of testing potentially career-threatening injuries. Here’s hoping Will P has a miraculous recovery. Here’s saying – as have some in the organization – that it’s not in the cards… Just missed on Keyshawn: Not sure whether or not you were in favor of adding the enigmatic Keyshawn Johnson to the mix (for the record, TGI was), but the Giants, who were the first to host Johnson, simply were outbid by the Panthers for Keyshawn’s services. While the Giants were looking to give Johnson no more than $4 million in guaranteed money, the Panthers gave him $5 million to sign and a total package of $14 million. Can’t blame Johnson for choosing the Panthers, where he’s guaranteed to start. Can you blame the Giants for not opening the wallets a little more for a proven, dependable playmaking receiver? Of course you can… Not yet convinced: One Pro Bowl veteran isn’t exactly overly impressed by New York’s secondary additions just yet. “I felt we had good players back there last year,” Osi Umenyiora said. “No one knows if they’re going to be able to help us this year.”

java script:goMovie('http://images.nfl.com/video/homepage/2005/0412-7.ram');void(null); http://nfl.com/ I don't know how to bring it over, but they've got some good stuff if you look into their archives, you'll find some good vifeo features on Simms, Demeco Ryans, Thomas Howard and more.

That's all you had to say to make a good point.

http://giants.scout.com/2/518997.html Showtime: For Accorsi, Draft time’s the best By: Ken Palmer Date: Apr 10, 2006 Like a child on Christmas morning, this is Ernie Accorsi’s favorite time of year. The season? No fun at all. You see, he can’t control anything. Draft weekend, however, is when Accorsi makes his money, when he proves his worth. “You never have to waver or worry during the draft, the pressure’s on us,” said Accorsi of he and his scouting staff. “It’s definitely my favorite time of year. I hate the games. The fun part is the draft – that’s the best part.” So, having to wait countless hours until your turn to choose at number 25 this year comes up is fun? “Yeah, I’m glad we’re not a part of that flurry at the top,” Accorsi explained. “There are always tough decisions to be made no matter where you pick.” The reason for Accorsi’s calm demeanor regarding the Giants future number one pick is because he knows without a shadow of a doubt that he and his scouts will be prepared for whatever unfolds before they choose. “I have never passed or been part of a pass in 35 years,” Accorsi said proudly. That’s because the key, according to the Giants’ general manager, is to always have enough players that you’re enamored with, regardless of your draft slot. Picking 25th? Easy. Just make sure you have 25 players you like and you’re guaranteed to get one of them. In the later rounds, Accorsi said you have to start whittling your options down when you get within 10-12 spots of your selection. “It’s just as intriguing down there,” he said. “We spend so much time on all this stuff that the sixth round is intriguing to us.” The main prerequisite of draft success is to keep the emotions in check, something that is easier said than done. “You have to guard against emotion,” Accorsi said. “That can play such a huge part. You can get demoralized by someone being taken right before you if your allow yourself to.” Because of his preparedness, Accorsi is famous for his quick trigger finger, which he’s fortunate was a little slow two years back. You see, had the Giants selected immediately when on the clock at number four, it wouldn’t have given the Chargers the “seven or eight minutes” it took to allow Accorsi to make the trade for Eli Manning. “I almost always pick right away,” Accorsi said. “You’re usually so excited about the player you’re about to get. But I’m glad I waited then. It gave them a chance to call me.” As a result of the Manning deal, Accorsi was sans a first-round pick last year. Now he’s back picking at number 25, the exact spot from which he landed DT William Joseph out of Miami three years ago. While the Giants were in desperate need of DL help at the time and nine D-linemen had already been snatched, Accorsi vows the Giants took the best player on their 2003 Draft board. “We didn’t force him, we had him rated very highly,” Accorsi said. “We made the right pick.” While Accorsi wouldn’t confirm for public consumption, TGI knows that the other player the Giants strongly considered at that spot – Clemson DT Nick Eason – has been nothing short of a major disappointment thus far in his career. Eason, now with the Browns, only spent one full year with Denver, the club that drafted him, and has yet to make his first NFL start. Recollections of Joseph lead us to the fact that the Giants are in dire need of linebacking help this time around. Not surprisingly, Accorsi wouldn’t even admit that. “We have several positions we could go with there,” he said. “We’re going to take the best player.” What was surprising was that Accorsi even admitted that this year’s crop of linebackers is a deep one. “We are obviously very thin at linebacker and this draft is very deep there,” Accorsi stated. After the offseason free agent signing frenzy to restock the defensive backfield, Accorsi said he “feels pretty good about the team.” “I think we shored up the secondary,” he said. “With (Will) Peterson’s injury still a question mark and now there’s no pressure on a guy like Curtis Deloatch (who was thrust into emergency duty last year). He can just develop and learn.” So whom will the Giants end up with at 25? C’mon, Ernie, not even a little hint? “We feel we’re going to get a very good player there,” Accorsi said. “You can’t predict what’s going to happen.” Well, actually you can, but Accorsi plans to leave that to us. Ernie’s favorite draft memory – a true Yogi-ism Early in the 70s, while still working public relations for the Baltimore Colts, Accorsi made his first draft choice – a good two-and-a-half decades before he started choosing players for the Giants. That year the Colts set a record for having the most draft choices and Colts draft guru Joe Thomas was literally running out of names to choose from. When the Colts final pick came up, Thomas turned to Accorsi and told him to make the choice. “I was just the PR director at the time,” Accorsi laughed. “I just picked a name off the bottom of the floor.” Being the PR maven that he was, Accorsi selected a receiver from Massachusetts – Tim Berra. Yup, you guessed it, Yogi’s son. “Would you believe he made the team as a kick returner,” Accorsi beamed. “He only lasted a year, but he made it. What did you want? He was a UMass receiver with Yogi’s speed.”

That'sgottobe outdated. Whitner might be the first or second safety off the board. And 3 WR's? That's a bit nuts, especially since Stovall could very well be taken in the second round, and Orr between rounds 3 and 4, maybe 5 at worst. And Ingram won't fall to the 5th IMO...he's impressed a lot of scouts in the months. And Kiwi going 13th overall?

I'd suggest starting a new thread for each round.

It was a no-brainer, and a little shot at the Titans organization for not letting McNair into their training facilities to work out.

You better open the doors back up for Steve McNair, and give him a big raise.

***NEW SELECTION*** This one's gonna break some hearts, but the Oakland Raiders select... Brodrick Bunkley, DT Florida State Vince Young seems like an Al Davis kind of move, but the Raiders need help on defense in a big way, and Bunkley gives Oakland an interior presence after losing the aging Ted Washington and Warren Sapp.

http://play.rbn.com/?url=nfl/nfl/open/nflf...ontextwidth=417

Pittsburgh has got to be the easiest answer here with Jack Lambert and Jack Ham.

Not only you, but everyone. I'm sorry, but it's mind boggling the way the same people continue to respond to these guys. Is it really entertaining to continually respond to some of the mindless, recycled posts that's become a constant part of this message board? There's nothing wrong with talking a little smack, but most of the subject matter we're talking about here is just incomprehensible.

I think we only have 6 picks this year.

Whitner would be a heck of a pick if he fell that far. It's tough to tell what Cincy's going to do, and from what I've read, they could also be looking for an offensive tackle. I like Ryans, but, if we select a LB, D'quell Jackson is starting to grow on me, and I'm not sure why he's not considered a better prospect. He could play the weakside, in addition to being great insurance in case Pierce went down again in the middle. I wouldn't totally discount the other 2 Florida state defenders either, Kameron Wimbley or Antonio Cromartie. I can't see the Giants going after Jason Allen in the first round...he's stillconsidered a tweener, and he's not exactly the biggest hitter we'd find. His speed is more impressive than anticipated, but IMO, I just think a first round grade is too high for him.

Video: Mike Mayock evaluates defensive tackles | ends http://play.rbn.com/?url=nfl/nfl/open/nflf..._line_2_300k.rm Video: Draft analyst Mike Mayock breaks down the LBs http://play.rbn.com/?url=nfl/nfl/open/nflf...down_lb_300k.rm Video: Draft analyst Mike Mayock breaks down the DBs http://play.rbn.com/?url=nfl/nfl/open/nflf...raft_db_300k.rm

http://nfldraft.scout.com/2/514564.html Pro-day updates and player news By: TFY Draft Preview Date: Mar 29, 2006 As the scouting process moves into the final phase as teams travel to the final few pro-days and pare down draft boards. Here's the latest on Haloti Ngata, Charles Gordon, Jerious Norwood as well as what the Jets, Bears and Eagles are up to. Oregon defensive tackle Haloti Ngata has received some bad press recently. Some are now saying NFL scouts question the big man's motor. Others have Florida State's Brodrick Bunkley as the top rated defensive tackle heading towards the draft. Yet none are looking at the entire picture. To say Ngata's post-season performances have been uninspired is justified yet to leave it at that is not telling the whole story. Two years ago Ngata lost his father in a tragic car accident. Sadly, two months ago Ngata unexpectedly lost his mother to kidney failure. The loss of his mother was sudden, as she had not been terribly sick for a long period. As one would expect, the 21-year old has been in the dumps after losing both his parents over the course of two-years. His support team and workout partners have tried to keep Ngata's spirits high, though no one can blame the big-man for being down. Scouts understand the situation and the recent talk of Ngata falling down boards is just that, talk. Charles Gordon is garnering a wide range of opinions from franchises with teams grading him anywhere from an early second round choice all the way to a late second day. Besides the New England Patriots another team zeroing in on the Kansas All American has been the San Francisco 49ers. A team with a lot of need, the Niners are giving serious consideration to using their pick in round two on Gordon then using him at cornerback, wide receiver and as a return specialist. After an average pro-day last week sources have told us Vince Young's recent workouts have not been all that much better. Young has been experiencing many of the same problems throwing NFL-type passes during individual workouts. The hope is Young will quickly improve and be ready by the middle of April, when several more teams will work him out individually. Another Longhorn experiencing problems is Jon Scott. We documents how ill-prepared Scott was going into his pro-day workout last week. Now comes word of his uncooperativeness. Seems the tackle from Texas would not workout in a group setting prior to the combine and wants to go it alone. Also a problem is Scott seems more concerned about life after football then the immediate future, which has some wondering about his dedication to the sport. This does not bode well for Scott who could fall out of the first day. Jerious Norwood of Mississippi State has been a player moving up charts recently. At his pro-day last week several teams were showing plenty of interest with some franchises setting up dates to bring the speedy skill player into their venues. The Chicago Bears, Tampa Bay Buccaneers and Atlanta Falcons are all very high on Norwood with just about all planning to use the college running back at wide receiver. The Bears have been very active with another player, Miami-Ohio linebacker Terna Nande, who they feel would be a solid fit as a weak-side player in Lovie Smith's defense. Rice had their pro-day earlier this week and John Syptak worked out well for scouts. The college defensive end weighed 253-pounds and ran a 4.7 in the forty. Fifteen teams were on hand including the Cincinnati Bengals who sent most of their defensive staff and the Chicago Bears, who also worked out Syptak at fullback. That same day scouts made their way to Texas Southern University, working out linebacker Frederick Brock. Both New York teams were on hand with the Jets saying Brock would be a good fit on the inside for the 3-4 alignment they plan on installing next season.

I never said we had to sign a superstar, and while Joseph, Allen and Robbins are somewhat capable, they aren't exactly the most reliable. Plus, one of the reasons our defense was so successful defending the run last year, IMO, was because of the depth we had at DT, and how we utilized Clancy's strength's. I think Buckner might be the only viable option left at DT, and he's not in Giants blue just yet.

The thing is, there aren't many options left at DT through FA, and after spending a fair amount of money on FA linebackers the past 2 years, I was hoping they would take their chances in the draft, where it happens to be very deep linebacking class. Now, instead of going into the draft with pretty good depth at most positions besides LB, we're going in with a lack of quality depth at both LB and DT.

I'm a little up in the air with how we did this off-season. I do like that we were able to retain many of our own role players. I like Madison, though I don't think he'll be here for 4 years. I can understand why we're not being overly aggressive in the FA market with LB's for a variety of reasons, but what I can't understand is why we couldn't spend a little money on either bringing Clancey back, or finding another DT. I would have been more comfortable spending money on another DT rather than on McQuarters and Bell.