HOUND

Anybody who thinks I'm gonna count these up and give a percentage is kidding themselves. Although we can refer back to this in December for chest thumping and ridicule purposes

The only people around here who seemed to be hating on him were the Dufus quadruplets, although I'll admit I think he's underachieved too. However the media still think he's a Pro Bowler. Skins fans wouldn't say a bad word about him, until of course he bought his way out of his deal. Suddenly we got honest critiques of the guy from that fanbase. Arrington's gotten far more favorable press than his performance should have alloted him.

Dammit, this was supposed to be a poll.

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Imagine the blitz possibilities with that combo. I've been a defender of Tim Lewis in the past when people have bashed him on this board but I'll say this, he has no excuse this season. We have personnel that afford us many different looks and blitzes this season that we previously didn't have. If we go into week 1 and sit in our base defense and don't mix things up on Peyton, we'll get picked apart. If that's the case I'll be furious with Lewis. Peyton's specialty is audibling into a different call based on what he thinks the D is throwing at him. Lewis has had plenty of time to get creative. This is a perfect opportunity to use all the talents at our disposal in the front 7. Also, if ever there was an opponent where it may not hurt us as much to be weak at DT it's the Colts. I don't see them committing to a run game aimed at exploiting a soft middle. I want to see this game play out similar to our week 1 demoltion of the Rams a few years ago. Pass rush, pass rush, pass rush, that generates havoc and forces turnovers. We've got the pieces in place.

Considering Joseph is currently the best Defensive Tackle on the roster I'm not sure why you wouldn't want him on the field.

Look at last season. Arrington wins this in a landslide.

No. I agree that he's more of a developmental project. I should've been more clear. It was my hope, going into the draft that a first day Tackle prospect could get some playing time this season which would then potentially free us of Petitgout and his hefty cap hit next season when we cut him. I agree that Whimper won't be far enough along to enable us to do that.

Lavar Arrington. Arrington has always been one of the more overrated players in the league in my view. We have yet to see how he'll perform as a Giant but to date he's come up way short on living up to his press clippings.

I only recall one guy on one board who defended everything Collins did. Besides that I'd say he got harshly criticized by Giants Nation. Collins was never a worldbeater but he did bring stability to the position for us. A position that had been in flux for almost a decade. Think of Jake Plummer in Denver. Broncos fans have hated every guy that's lined up under center since Elway. Plummer finally brought elevated play to the position. However he still isn't world class so while he's been an upgrade, he's still criticized as he makes the same mistakes repeatedly, similar to the way Collins did. Kerry Collins .... good, not great. Needed protection to succeed but if given time to throw ... watch out. Very similar to Drew Bledsoe.

Seawright plays the same position as Robbins. He'll line up next to Joseph.

Draft Report Giants draft drew praise from the folks at Great Blue North Draftniks. Despite the blue reference, these guys are not a Giants site. They host a good draft blog that I visit ever year. They did a real nice writeup on the Kiwanuka pick and offered additional justification for it. For those chirping that Kiwi wasn't first round material, pay attention to his ranking going into last years draft. They had him as high a 3rd overall! Surprisingly the only pick they didn't seem high on was Peprah, who I thought was one of our better second day selections. I really wanted the Giants to address OT on the first day and am not convinced that Whimper will be ready to take the reins next season. The good news is that the Tackle class in next years draft appears loaded. Although a lot can change between now and then.

Where did I define my theory? All I said was you and the mental midgets bungled the mock draft yet you're bashing established sources like Scouts.com. Somewhat hypocritical, no? Have you ever seen Leonard Pope block? Me neither. Thinks about that for a minute before responding.

Canes 1 Devils 0 YEAHHHHH BOYYYYYY

Devils had maybe 2 good scoring opportunities the entire game. Carolina's D played incredible. Cam Ward didn't have to do much to earn his first playoff shutout. Tonight's game won't be a blowout. Brodeur typically responds to a bad game with an excellent one. Devils can't allow Carolina to get so much traffic in front of the net. Devils looked like they missed Scott Stevens.

That one on the right .... not hot.

I'll be surprised if Jacobs gets significantly more action than he did a year ago. I don't think the coaching staff is comfortable enough to throw 10 carries a game his way just to work him in. While resting Tiki will be considered, we're not going to pull him unless Jacobs proves he's up to the task. Considering the relative strength of our schedule I don't see a lot of games where we'll have the W wrapped up at the end of the 3rd quarter, allowing Jacobs to gain valuable experience. Unfortunately I think we're going to rely on Tiki to once again serve as the coffin nail to put games away late. I just don't see where Jacobs will be trusted in this capacity based on what we've seen so far. I wholeheartedly agree that ideally the coaching staff would love to lighten Tiki's load and work the kid into more action but I don't see a realistic scenario where it can/will occur on a consistent basis.

That's sorta what I'm saying. In just about every draft, our first rounder was a no brainer. We had a need, the player in that position was among the highest rated. It simply made sense. This is the first year in a long time where that hasn't been the case. I really think that's the bulk of the reasoning behind the negative reaction but I'mt trying to point out, that it's not a reason to be upset. In this draft, I think we'd have more reason for anger is we had actually chased a position. Would several of you have preferred Kelly Jennings, CB, Miami instead? Not only would we have been falling victim to a run at the position (that would've been the 5th corner taken in the top 25), I don't think it's a stretch to say that Kiwanuka is the far more talented player and has a much higher upside. I don't even think Jennings should've been selected in round 1. Instead we got the guy who many had as the 2nd rated Defensive End. I really can't be upset about that.

Agreed, I'm quite certain I could do every bit as good a job as Mel Kiper if all I had to do was handicap the draft all season.

Tell you what, publish your own draft guide and let me know next year how the first year sales of FloydtheBarberpessimistdraftguide.com turned out. The good news is that you've got nowhere to go but up in your draft analysis. For example, maybe next year you can handicap the first round better than this year. I noticed the collective brainpower of the Fab 4 "shrewdly" drafted TE Leonard Pope at the end of the first round in the messageboard mock. Form didn't hold too well on draft day though. Pope was not the 2nd, not the 3rd, not even the 4th or 5th, but the 6th tight end drafted, all the way back in round 3. You guys really nailed it there. Excellent work. Now I'm sorry, what were you saying about Scouts.com again?

Very true ... I always laugh when I hear people criticize the selection of William Joseph. That was just about the easiest, no brainer pick, EA ever had to make. I think Hank the Angry Dwarf could've come out of the '03 draft with Willaim Joseph at the Giants slot.

I think I know that chick. The one on the left.

There's been a lot of griping about our first round draft choice this year. Most critics point to our already deep well of talent at the Defensive End position as argument against drafting Kiwanuka. Others who have warmed to the pick defend it as simply a case of taking the best player available. Prior to the draft several messageboard draftniks defended the concept of taking best player available, which is why I was so surprised at the negative reaction to the Kiwanuka pick. The Giants shrewdly traded down a few picks but remained in position to draft a quality player. By picking up extra selections it allowed them to later trade up and aggressively select WR Sinorice Moss. Now the one thing most everybody seems to agree with was that trading back was a solid move on our part. There didn't appear to be a player that appealed to us (unless you wanted RB/WR in the first) so moving back a few slots and collecting 2 picks has been well recieved. However once Kiwi was chosen, the concensus reaction was negative. I think posters need to put this draft in perspective before deciding to bash the pick. Dating back to 1996, the player the Giants have spent their first pick on has addressed a need. 96 - DE Cedric Jones 97 - WR Ike Hilliard 98 - SS Shaun Williams 99 - LT Luke Petitgout 00 - RB Ron Dayne 01 - CB Will Allen 02 - TE Jeremy Shockey 03 - DT William Joseph 04 - QB Philip Rivers (traded for Manning) 05 - CB Corey Webster In every year the Giants were fortunate in that a player they were high on, who also carried a 1st round grade, just happened to be available, at that selection. In multiple years we even traded up to address a need. Philip Rivers could be viewed as an exception but I think you could still make an argument that there was a need at QB. We'd seen the best of Collins, he wasn't cheap, and we were in position to draft a franchise QB. I'd still say that draft fit in line with addressing need as opposed to taking Best Player Available. But pretty much every year, it wasn't much of a surprise who the Giants were targeting. The pick was predictable. So this year, we went way off course and took a talented guy at a position that wasn't a priority. Mistake? Maybe. Or could it also be a result of the overall team being far better than recent years and thus the need to plug holes wasn't nearly as urgent. In that scenario the front office has the luxury of picking talent not position. However it's also worth noting that this is the first time in MANY years that the highest rated players at our areas of biggest need didn't match up with our draft positioning. There simply wasn't a Defensive Tackle or a cornerback that was worth the position we were drafting from. Or the prospect that was available came with character or off-field concerns, something the Giants have taken much more seriously of late. So you can look at this a couple of ways. First, we've gotten much better as a team. In previous years we had so many holes to fill it was easy to find a highly rated player at a need position simply because we had a lot of needs. That's no longer the case. Second, we simply found ourselves in a position where there was a player who was far too talented to pass up. His selection was likely made easier by the fact that there wasn't a "need guy" appropriate at the spot. Lastly, maybe we were unable to find another trade partner that would've allowed us to drop even further back so we took the best guy on our list. In every scenario, I think the good outweighs the bad. For those that want to simply bash the decision based on our postional depth, I'd ask, did the Saints make a mistake drafting Reggie Bush? They already had a franchise running back, who had signed a contract extension a year ago and isn't close to retirement. Let's say the Texans drafted Bush (you could make the same argument there with Domanick Davis) and the Saints followed it up by drafting Mario Williams. Would that have been a mistake by New Orleans? They've got gaping holes throughout their roster. However the one position they appear set at is Defensive End with Charles Grant and Will Smith. In both cases, both teams would've been effectively taking Best Player Available and few would've criticized them for it. Yet around here, where the starter at the position has maybe 2 effective years remaining, people react as if the sky is falling. I simply think people need to step back and take a much broader view of the selection as well as our recent draft history. *edited to fix '03 draft

Since when do arms dictate success? Michael Pittman has some of the biggest arms in the league and he can't even hang on to a starting gig.

I thought this thread was about black men with character issues.