speed_kills

In this thread?

No in the thread discussing the inherent weakness of Kant's principle of the Categorical Imperative.

Addai won't be there for our second round pick. His stock is pretty damned high.

2002 was an exception for Chad. He showed decent arm strenghth that year at least downfield. However the following years were a little bit different.

Umm, yea, he was injured in the following years. 2002 was good since he was completely healthy.

Next, I was being consistent. Using 2002-3, the year Pennington was most healthy. As for downfield passing, if you want to use 2004-2005 season, the other year he led them to the playoffs, he was even better passing downfield. 10/29 from 21-30 yards, 3/8 from 31-40 yards, and here's the kicker, 3-7 from 41+ yards. In total, he went 16/44 from 21+ yards coming out to a completion percentage of 36%.

And if you want to use Brady's career year, which was this past season, he was 11/43 from 21-30 yards, 3/13 from 31-40 yards, and 2/10 from 41+ yards. For those of you counting from home, that comes out to 16/66 from 21+ yards, or 24% completion percentage.

As for Bledsoe, during one of the best years in his career (his first year with the Bills, 2002-3), he went 12/42 from 21-30 yards, 3/16 from 31-40 yards, and 3/10 from 41+ yards. Cumulatively, he went 18/68 from 21+ yards, for a 26% completion percentage.

1st completion: 5 yard completion to Richie Anderson

2nd Completion: 6 yard pass to Santana Moss

3rd Completion: 8 yard pass to Richie Anderson

4th completion: 32 yard pass to Laveranues Coles for a TD

5th completion: 21 yard pass to Wayne Chrebet

6th completion: 8 yard pass to Richie Anderson

7th completion: 15 yard pass to Anthony Becht

8th completion: 47 yard completion to Santana Moss

9th completion: 14 yard pass to Wayne Chrebet

10th completion: 11 yard pass to Santana Moss for a TD.

11th completion: 6 yard pass to Anthony Becht.

11/11, 100% completions, 2 TD's, 15.7 yards/completion

I watch over 13 Jets games a year since 2000.... I know what I'm talking about here. When I hear guys like Salsibury and Hoge say that Pennington has a cannon for an arm, which you can admit he does not and he is with Peyton Manning in terms of rated QBs in the NFL when he is not, it means he is overrated. And I can assure you that those aren't the only two guys giving him a lot of credit or at least more then he deserves.

 

btw speed kills, for future reference, what website did you get that info from? I want to use that for future arguements.

Yes, 2002. My mistake.

Umm, give me actual examples of times when Salisbury or Hodge have said Pennington has had a cannon of an arm. For all I've heard, Pennington's arm strength has always been knocked, and his accuracy has been praised. And WHY should I listen to you, when the stats say otherwise? And as for putting him in the class of Manning, the only other Qb I've heard put in Manning's class is Tom Brady (and Culpepper during his career year in 04-05).

How many rookie wide receivers can you name that had an immediate impact?

 

Randy Moss and Micheal Clayton....... and?

Andre Johnson. But other than that, it'd be hard to name others off the top of my head wh've had major impacts.

I don't really think they rushed him. Because his second rotator cuff injury I believe occurred in his second shoulder. So rushing him back is really irrelevant although I do respect Chad's will to play.

 

Except Chad actually did take shots downfield more then we know. And he rarely put it right on the mark like he does on his quick passes.

Let's take Pennington's career year, 2003, and make a breakdown of his passing numbers.

During 2003, he threw 89 passes behind the line of scrimmage, and he completed 71 of them. (71/89, 80% completions)

From 1-10 yards, he threw 147 passes, and completed 115 of them. (78% completions)

From 11-20 yards, he threw 96 passes and completed 61 of them. (63% completions)

From 21-30 yards, he threw 31 passes and completed 9 of them. (29% completions)

From 31-40 yards, he threw 12 passes, completing 2 of them (17% completions)

He threw no passes beyond 41 yards.

Looking at Pennington's stats (he had a total of 399 passing attempts that year), he attempted 43 passes beyond 21 yards (or what most people would term a deep pass)(I am using the term loosely), so out of his total attempts about 10% were deep passes.

Now, comparing that to passers such as Tom Brady (generally known as a dink and dunk, west coast passer) and Drew Bledsoe (who is widely known to have an excellent deep ball), Pennington did not throw nearly as many deep passes. To back this up statistically, Brady attempted 62 passes beyond 21 yards, and this amounts to about 11% of his total attempts (527), while Bledsoe attempted 156 passes beyond 21 yards, and this accounted for a whopping 33% of his total attempts (471). Additionally, Bledsoe attempted 5 passes beyond 41 yards, while Pennington threw none. It is evident, that Pennington's passing profile clearly resembles Brady's (a west coast passer) as opposed to Bledsoe (a deep-passing game QB).

For kicks, I compared the completion percentages between Bledsoe and Pennington in passes from 21-40 yards. Bledsoe's completion percentage came out to 27% (11/41). Pennington's came out to 26% (11/43). Judging from the comparison to Bledsoe (to reiterate, he's widely considered an excellent deep passer), our boy Chad isn't that bad of a deep ball passer at all, and in truth, he really didn't attempt THAT many deep balls anyway.

*All stats are from 2003, to keep things consistent.

Gabe Watson is the most overrated player! Great size, no talent

 

Antonio Cromartie is the way to go

Watson's talent has been described as impeccable. It's his effort that's lacking.

That's why I'm thinking God carried that pass. I don't know where that came from.

 

Before Chad got hurt the lovefest for him was unbelievable. His stats looked better because his WRs and RBs made a 4 yard pass into an 11 yard pass play making his stats look better. The amount of money he got was obsurd with that deal.

 

Chad was a top 10 QB because he got wins and managed the game very well. I think he just got too much credit. Those 11 completions actually enforce my point. I bet most of those were quick passes in the flat or 5-10 yard passes over the middle. I'm not denying his great accuracy. I'm denying his arm strength past 15 yards. It's really nothing special.

 

Here's a reason Chad never made the Pro Bowl. 2002 he didn't play a full season. 2003 he missed the first month and a half or so with a broken wrist suffered in pre-season. And from there he didn't do so good. 2004 he had that rotator cuff and also had an okay season. And 2005 he missed the whole season. That explains his lack of Pro Bowls.

He got too much credit for completing short passes? Joe Montana played in a system where he rarely had to throw beyong 20 or so yards (West Coast Offense, similar to what Pennington played in under Hackett), and usually completed 10-15 yard passes to Jerry Rice, and he's widely considered the finest to ever play the position. You can't fault Pennington for what system he played in, most NFL offensive systems rely on short passing and the occasional deep pass. What you can do is marvel at the efficiency with which he ran the system, and his effectiveness as a QB. You also have to respect his toughness, and his ability to guide teams into the playoffs, when he was healthy. As for injuries, you can't fault a player for being too eager, since the team decides when to allow a player back onto the field, and in Chad's case, it's apparent they rushed him.