What accorsi will actually do

[parlintm]

I drank way too much coffee while studing for an exam and at this point can't sleep so I've just been thinking about the Giants and two things kept ringing in my head:

1. Accorsi saying that this is his last year as GM

2. That his priority for the offseaon is to upgrade the back 7.

So I've thought back to my offseason plans, as well as many other board members and most of them include:

1. Resigning W. Allen or a comparable FA

2. Acquiring depth, especially at LB through the draft.

 

 

And I've realized that we're wrong. Accorsi says he is going to make the back 7 better this year. The more I think about it, he almost definitely doesn't plan on improving the back 7 by resigning w. allen and getting some unproven rookies. I mean think about it. The last thing he wants in his final year is to resign W. Allen and draft some rookies only to have Allen get beat and drop interceptions while the rookies fail to materialize. Is it any better if he signs someone like Allen only to have them get beat?? He will be chased out of town and his great career as GM will be marred by a bad last season. I guarantee he won't let that happen. So then I kept thinking and realized that the Giants have not signed 1 player yet and only have continued to cut people. They have proven to be extremely tight during any negotiations... I'm looking at Clancy. So what is EA saving his money for? And how exactly does EA plan to improve the back 7?

 

It's a possibility that he goes out and signs a LB like Peterson but I doubt he goes that route. I think he wants to make sure that the secondary is vastly improved. He doesnt want the Giants to have the weak link be our passing defense again.

 

I've heard that the Giants might end up having quite a bit of cap space and it seems as if this new deal will only increase the cap to 100 mill, maybe even higher. It seems as if the Giants are making room for 1 big Free Agent signing. The question is, who?

 

I think the answer is.... Ty Law. Before you shoot this down, here me out. This is, of course, assuming we have enough cap room to do it, which I think we will. Ty had an OK year and won't be demanding as much as he did last year. The only teams that will be willing to pay him are teams contending for the SB. Despite rumors, a rebuilding team like detroit would rather add young players. He has also made it very clear that he will only play for a contender.

1. EA wants to improve the secondary. He will say, "fuck will allen, if giant fans want a good corner, ill get them the best in the game." he wants to go out on top, what better way to do that than land a stud like law.

2. Draft cromartie or stud CB in round 1. BAM!! Just like that we have Ty Law, Webster and Cromartie as our CB's. Will P. steps into the mix if he gets healthy. That right there, has the potential to be a GREAT secondary. Just think how many sacks Osi, Strah and Tuck will have once they start getting coveage sacks too.

3. After round 1 the Giants can then proceed as planned w/ the draft -- LB in round 2 (although could swap w/ CB in round 1 if the right player is available), S in round 3 etc...

 

Adding Law would limit our ability to sign some veterans but I think it would be a price EA is willing to pay. Rather than resign Clancy, we might be stuck w/ Robbins and a rookie. The FS spot would be a battle between Butler and a 4th round pick. We would have to go cheap w/ our #3 WR or not sign one at all. But one thing is a definite... we wouldnt have the 27th passing defense in the league and that is something that EA could walk away feeling good about.

 

Ok, now you can shoot me down.

[GiantDon]

I don't agree that we should draft a CB in the 1st round because no matter what talent a certain player has he will always struggle in the beginning because it's one of the most difficult positions to adjust to. Drafting Cromartie will have no immediate impact whatsoever. LB's have more chances to have an quick impact.

 

Ty Law is also doubtful to come here IMO. It would make matters so much easier if Ronde Barber came to us.

[HOUND]

I really struggle to see a scenario where Law is a Giant but I do agree that we will let Will Allen walk and we will bring in some secondary help in the offseason. If we were to go after a big ticket CB I think it would be Charles Woodson before Law but in both cases I think the chances are slim.

 

I'm nervous that we're considering Julian Peterson. I'm not that high on him.

[Frank_Grimes]

I really struggle to see a scenario where Law is a Giant but I do agree that we will let Will Allen walk and we will bring in some secondary help in the offseason. If we were to go after a big ticket CB I think it would be Charles Woodson before Law but in both cases I think the chances are slim.

 

I'm nervous that we're considering Julian Peterson. I'm not that high on him.

 

I'd be more nervous about Chuck Woodson

[parlintm]

OK, so i might be going over the top w/ Law but I think the general idea is correct. EA will make a big effort to improve the secondary this year. I think this means NOT resigning Will Allen and going after the best corner that the Giants can afford. I think he would be willing to overpay for someone like Law since there is a HUGE dropoff in talent after him. Here's a mock that I came up with. It assumses that we sign the best corner that we can get in FA as well as eventually signing Clancy. Since I think we will spend most of our cap space on those 2 positions I will proceed as if we make no other signings.

 

Round 1: Best LB available. My preferance is in this order - Thomas Howard, Ernie Sims, Demarco Ryans, Bobby Carpenter, Dqwell Jackson. -- I could be talked into any of these guys though.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingr...omashoward.html

 

Round 2: Jonathan Joseph CB

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingr...thanjoseph.html

 

Round 3: Greg Blue S

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingr...s/gregblue.html

 

Round 4: Dusty Dvoacek DT

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingr...tydvoracek.html

 

Round 5: Brandon Williams WR

 

Round 6: Greg Jennings WR

 

Round 7: Johnny Jolly DT

 

Offense:

QB- Eli, hasslebeck

Rb - Tiki, jacobs

Fb - Finn

Te - Shockey, Shiancoe

OL - Same as last year

WR - Plax, Amani, Williams/Jennings/Taylor

 

Defense:

DE - Strah, Willie Joe, Clancy, Osi --- Tuck, Dvoacek/Robbins, Jolly

LB - Torbor, Pierce, Emmons/Howard -- Blackburn, Moore

CB - Law, Webster -- Joseph, Will P., Deloach

S - Gibril, Butler/Blue

 

-- means reseverse

/ means competing for spot

Edited February 28, 2006 by Armstead98

[HOUND]

I'd be happy with a blue collar guy like Dvoracek in the 4th.

 

I'm not high on Carpenter in the first. I also still need convincing on Howard. I think there are better options out there. Ernie Sims brings a smile to my face.

[Guest Nutty Sack]

Let us pray that he has bought Eli a set of weights.

[parlintm]

I'd be happy with a blue collar guy like Dvoracek in the 4th.

 

I'm not high on Carpenter in the first. I also still need convincing on Howard. I think there are better options out there. Ernie Sims brings a smile to my face.

 

For whatever reason, I'm not a Carpenter fan either. I'm a huge sims fan though... actually was going to list him first but changed it. Sims and his concussions are the only thing that scares me. If this guy is going to be a backup, Id like them not to be injury prone. As we all know, there is nothing worse than having the backup go down w/ an injury (except maybe seeing pierce go down grabbing his ankle....)

[parlintm]

Here are interviews with Howard and Sims:

 

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/interview...omashoward.html

-- I like that hes got great hands. Definitely seems more versatile and fluid than emmons.

 

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/interview.../erniesims.html

 

Since I didn't include Sims' scouting report earlier, here it is:

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingr.../erniesims.html

 

I think the combination of size, speed and coverage skills that Howard has makes me lean towards him over Sims. He can rush the passer, hit like a train and drop back and pick of a pass (used to be a safety). Also, he doesnt have the injury history.

[HOUND]

Sims plays with such reckless abandon the FSU coaches had to hold him back in practice out of fear he'd hurt his teammates!

 

I don't think Howard is even close to the player Ernie is.

Edited February 28, 2006 by HOUND

[parlintm]

Sims plays with such reckless abandon the FSU coaches had to hold him back in practice out of fear he'd hurt his teammates!

 

I don't think Howard is even close to the player Ernie is.

 

I started this thread w/ the intention of discussing how Ernie plans on "upgrading the back 7." So I'm going to start a LB thread since this is clearly of interest.

 

Going back to Ty Law:

1. Im shocked that nobody's shot me down yet... I'm waiting.

2. Is signing him possible? By that I'm assuming he will get in the 8.5-10 per year range. How much room are we expected to have if we don't sign Allen, Walker or anybody else. And then how much does that change if we sign Clancy?

3. How much will it cost to sign our draft picks?

[gateb]

You had me agreeing with you up until the Ty Law part. All those scenarious appear to be very true but while there is a slim chance that we do have Law, it is very doubtful. However, if we are saving up lots of cash for that big play making CB, who else could it be? Maybe Ronde in anticipation that he does get cut? Perhaps Madison, but that is a stretch possibly. Definitely not Woodson.

 

I think that money EA will be trying to save up will be on a big player at OLB and then he'll use the rest on a solid CB and a decent third WR.

[parlintm]

You had me agreeing with you up until the Ty Law part. All those scenarious appear to be very true but while there is a slim chance that we do have Law, it is very doubtful. However, if we are saving up lots of cash for that big play making CB, who else could it be? Maybe Ronde in anticipation that he does get cut? Perhaps Madison, but that is a stretch possibly. Definitely not Woodson.

 

I think that money EA will be trying to save up will be on a big player at OLB and then he'll use the rest on a solid CB and a decent third WR.

 

Why save up for a big play at OLB when the draft is absolutely STACKED at this position and we are pretty much guaranteed our choice of 3-4 very good lb's at #25.

 

Here's another way to put it, does:

Allen + Julian Peterson + Decent 3rd WR = Ty Law

I'm referring to salaries.

I think Law would be cheaper than those 3.

[gateb]

Why save up for a big play at OLB when the draft is absolutely STACKED at this position and we are pretty much guaranteed our choice of 3-4 very good lb's at #25.

 

Here's another way to put it, does:

Allen + Julian Peterson + Decent 3rd WR = Ty Law

I'm referring to salaries.

I think Law would be cheaper than those 3.

Not just salary, but ask exit, who was a fan who saw firsthand on what Law is.

 

He's a player who is solid, obviously past his prime and his 10 INTs may be misleading. He committed so many penalties that would drive TC up a wall and for the price that what he was asking for, he just isn't worth it.

 

We don't need guys like Peterson either. We can settle on guys like Leber and have some extra money to see what we can do and if that doesn't work, fix the rest of your needs in the draft and you'll have some money for the next off-season.

[parlintm]

If the aforementioned salary equation is pretty comparable... which team would you rather have?

 

A.

Offense:

QB- Eli -- Hasslebeck

Rb - Tiki, Jacobs

Fb - Finn

Te - Shockey, Shiancoe

OL - Same as last year

WR - Plax, Amani, Williams/Jennings/Taylor

 

Defense:

DE - Strah, Willie Joe, Clancy, Osi --- Tuck, Dvoacek/Robbins, Jolly

LB - Torbor, Pierce, Emmons/Howard -- Blackburn, Moore

CB - Law, Webster -- Joseph, Will P., Deloach

S - Gibril, Butler/Blue

 

OR

 

B.

QB- Eli -- Hasslebeck

Rb - Tiki, Jacobs

Fb - Finn

Te - Shockey, Shiancoe

OL - Same as last year

WR - Plax, Amani, decent #3 via FA -- Taylor, Late round Picks

 

Defense:

DE - Strah, Willie Joe, Clancy, Osi --- Tuck, Dvoacek/Robbins, Jolly

LB - Torbor, Pierce, Peterson -- Emmons, Round 2 pick?, Blackburn, Moore

CB - Allen, Webster -- Round 1 Pick, Will P., Deloach

S - Gibril, Butler/Blue

 

Personally, I'd much rather have the team that has Ty Law instead of Will Allen... but then again Will Allen has scarred be beyond repair.

Edited February 28, 2006 by Armstead98

[gateb]

We need to find guys that we shouldn't have to overpay for that drastically. I think there are better players out there then Law that can come cheaper. All I believe Law has right now is that name, which is bound to get him millions.

 

Even if we do have the money, that doesn't neccessarily mean that we have to use it and force it on someone that would be overpaid.

[parlintm]

We need to find guys that we shouldn't have to overpay for that drastically. I think there are better players out there then Law that can come cheaper. All I believe Law has right now is that name, which is bound to get him millions.

 

Even if we do have the money, that doesn't neccessarily mean that we have to use it and force it on someone that would be overpaid.

 

1. I think Law's going to come at somewhat of a discount this year (at least compared to last year) b/c his season was not great. Also, I dont think there are not too many teams will be bidding on him. He's limiting himself to contenders and the only real contender I've heard that was interested in him was the Dolphins. We're closer than they are so I bet he would rather come here. It is New York after all.

 

2. While Law is obviously not what he once was, he is still a phenomenal corner. Yes, he had a few too many penalties but he did have 10 Int's. I saw quite a few of those and he just knows where the ball is going to go and he makes plays on it like nobody else in the NFL. He would be an unbelievable upgrade over Allen.

 

3. Who is better or even close to Law that will be cheaper? If I remember correctly, there was a HUGE dropoff in talent after him. By the way, I would rather have Will Peterson in a wheel chair than overpay for Woodsen.

 

4. I'm going off of what EA said. He told us that he was going to make the secondary better. IMO bringing in new names doesn't necessarily = better. So dumping Allen for Townsend doesn't cut it in my book. Dumping Allen for Law works for me though.

[uconngiants]

I have talked to a very reliable source who you all know listen too he happens to be very good friends with EA and says it is his last year

 

 

 

my source.... Dick Stockton

[Money]

I'd be more interesting in finding out what Jerry Reese would do.

[parlintm]

This site,

http://www.askthecommish.com/salarycap/numbers.asp

has the Giants operating at w/ $3 Mill of cap space. That is also using the cap figure of 92. From the latest reports it should be more like 100 this year. Add in the cap space that the Giants have cleared with the latest cuts and I project to be opearating with about $13 million. Please let me know if I'm off on this figure.

 

Ty Law is asking for $10 Mill, which he wont get. I think it will be in the $8 Mill range, although it could drop, remember Clement's price to tag him dropped and I also expect minimal interest in an expensive corner. The only teams that will be interested will be those that think they are only a corner away.

 

I would guess that we need about $2.5 Mill to sign our rookies. This should leave us with enough to sign Clancy and fill in the deep roster spots. I think it's fiscally plausible.

 

This whole plan has yet to be attacked by you guys, I'm still waiting. Let me know if you have issues with these figures or the idea of it all.

 

Since the more I think about it, the more sense it makes... Ive gone ahead and tried to examine the teams that could potentially go after Law. Remember, he will only go to a legit contender so this knocks out teams like Cleveland and Arizona. The contenders:

1. Dolphins - I think Saban is building his team and really expects to compete in a few years. Paying top dollar for a corner doesn't seem to fit with his plan. Also, law said that he thought miami would be a contender if steve mcnair gets trade there. I dont see that happening.

2. Pats - They need a corner and he's played there recently. That said, they have a VERY old team with limited cap flexibility. They also have mutliple needs (s, cb, wr) so I think they will try to get younger and paying top dollar for law doesnt work.

3. SD Chargers - I think this team has the best shot of landing him. Jammer hasn't proven to be a lockdown corner. Their offense is set. They had lots of cap room before signing Brees and/or Rivers, not sure how they are looking right now. They seem to be a safety away from being a real contender, but maybe Law fits into the picture.

4. NY Giants - Great offense. A bit of cap flexibility. Really just a top corner and linebacker depth away from being a superbowl contender. It's EA's last year and he will want to go out big. We will have to wait and see which direction they choose to go....

[Pizan]

I'd be more interesting in finding out what Jerry Reese would do.

 

 

Yea me too, maybe we should make a thread stating what Jerry Reese would actually do...

[gateb]

1. I think Law's going to come at somewhat of a discount this year (at least compared to last year) b/c his season was not great. Also, I dont think there are not too many teams will be bidding on him. He's limiting himself to contenders and the only real contender I've heard that was interested in him was the Dolphins. We're closer than they are so I bet he would rather come here. It is New York after all.

 

2. While Law is obviously not what he once was, he is still a phenomenal corner. Yes, he had a few too many penalties but he did have 10 Int's. I saw quite a few of those and he just knows where the ball is going to go and he makes plays on it like nobody else in the NFL. He would be an unbelievable upgrade over Allen.

 

3. Who is better or even close to Law that will be cheaper? If I remember correctly, there was a HUGE dropoff in talent after him. By the way, I would rather have Will Peterson in a wheel chair than overpay for Woodsen.

 

4. I'm going off of what EA said. He told us that he was going to make the secondary better. IMO bringing in new names doesn't necessarily = better. So dumping Allen for Townsend doesn't cut it in my book. Dumping Allen for Law works for me though.

Thing is, we have multiple issues to fix up. We don't need to spend all of our money every off-season. There are plenty of guys that would be decent signings that would come cheaper then Law would. We don't need the big playmaker in the secondary to make our team a super bowl winner. The Steelers had pretty much okay corners.

 

Another thing you should take into effect is pass rush. We get an immense amount of pressure on the QB which could really help out okay guys that would produce much better here then in their original place and would maybe produce less then Law, but would come much cheaper.

 

We don't need the playmakers that much.

[parlintm]

Thing is, we have multiple issues to fix up. We don't need to spend all of our money every off-season. There are plenty of guys that would be decent signings that would come cheaper then Law would. We don't need the big playmaker in the secondary to make our team a super bowl winner. The Steelers had pretty much okay corners.

 

Another thing you should take into effect is pass rush. We get an immense amount of pressure on the QB which could really help out okay guys that would produce much better here then in their original place and would maybe produce less then Law, but would come much cheaper.

 

We don't need the playmakers that much.

 

I'm just trying to look at it from EA's point of view. He MUST address the secondary this offseason. He won't be content putting the same or potentially a worse secondary (if W.P cant play) out on the field. Drafting rookies to fix holes in the secondary is not the answer. So he's got to upgrade through free agency. Here's a list of FA CB's:

 

http://scout.scout.com/a.z?s=211&p=9&c=12&...83&rc=16&pid=30

 

You will notice that this list is pretty thin. There are very few names above Will Allen's, which limits our options big time. Personally, I'm not a fan of Plummer and I think Azumah will be more expensive than he is worth.

 

I don't think we have too many issues that need to be dealt with:

LB - Round 1

FS - Midround pick

DT depth - Midrounder

#3 WR - Cheap FA or late round picks

What else am I missing?

 

The Steelers had arguably the biggest playmaker in all of football in their secondary, if you remember correctly.

 

Its time for EA to go big or go home.... or go big then go home.

[gateb]

I'm just trying to look at it from EA's point of view. He MUST address the secondary this offseason. He won't be content putting the same or potentially a worse secondary (if W.P cant play) out on the field. Drafting rookies to fix holes in the secondary is not the answer. So he's got to upgrade through free agency. Here's a list of FA CB's:

 

http://scout.scout.com/a.z?s=211&p=9&c=12&...83&rc=16&pid=30

 

You will notice that this list is pretty thin. There are very few names above Will Allen's, which limits our options big time. Personally, I'm not a fan of Plummer and I think Azumah will be more expensive than he is worth.

 

I don't think we have too many issues that need to be dealt with:

LB - Round 1

FS - Midround pick

DT depth - Midrounder

#3 WR - Cheap FA or late round picks

What else am I missing?

 

The Steelers had arguably the biggest playmaker in all of football in their secondary, if you remember correctly.

 

Its time for EA to go big or go home.... or go big then go home.

Not at CB they didn't, at safety. If Gibril can step up some more this year, it could make up for lack of great playmaking skills out of the CBs. EA's smarter then that just to make some signings only to benefit him for this year and maybe a year or two after that. I'm sure he desperately wants to go out winning the Lombardi but EA appears to be the guy not to put the future at risk for this season.

[parlintm]

Not at CB they didn't, at safety. If Gibril can step up some more this year, it could make up for lack of great playmaking skills out of the CBs. EA's smarter then that just to make some signings only to benefit him for this year and maybe a year or two after that. I'm sure he desperately wants to go out winning the Lombardi but EA appears to be the guy not to put the future at risk for this season.

 

I think anytime that you have the chance to win the superbowl... the future becomes the present. You do whatever it takes to win it. If you're one piece away, and you have the chance to get that, you do it. Ty Law, just might be it.

 

Also I don't think he's necessarily risking the future by signing Law instead of Allen. Allen is NOT the long term solution. He might fit in this season, but I guarantee you we would get his replacement very soon.

 

If we had Gibril and Law in the secondary, that would be 2 playmakers. Webster has shown that he has a nose for the ball as well. Butler is a question mark, but he's definitely shown that he can at least catch the interception when it comes his way, unlike Allen. That could potentially be a sick secondary, full of playmakers.