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The O line


UK-Giantsfan

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I'm still half expecting some kind of a trade for an OT .

Reese must know that he is out of a job if the Giants miss the playoffs and the right side of the line is proven to be awful. ( its all on him ! )

We have some CAP space left too.

I also think we will find something after the Sept 3rd cuts to 53 ( but this will only be for depth ) .

Just do it Jerry !

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Okung signed for 1 year, $5 mil, with team options. Zero dollars guaranteed. We could've gotten him, the money was there. And he only needed to better than Newhouse to justify the money.

But he's playing left tackle for them which is why he didn't want to come here

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But he's playing left tackle for them which is why he didn't want to come here

That's my point. The insistence that Flowers couldn't possibly be moved onto the right side hurt the chances dramatically that the Giants would improve the OL.

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This is the first I'm hearing about Pugh being drafted as our franchise left tackle of the future.

What's the point of drafting a LT in the 1st round if not to be your LT for the next 10 years? Unless we're completely admitting there was no plan for Pugh when we drafted him and we just picked him for the hell of it.

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What's the point of drafting a LT in the 1st round if not to be your LT for the next 10 years? Unless we're completely admitting there was no plan for Pugh when we drafted him and we just picked him for the hell of it.

The moment he was drafted there was talk of him moving to rt or inside to guard.

 

I think a guard or right tackle at pick 19 makes plenty of sense. Especially a guy with the versatility to play all over the line line Pugh.

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What's the point of drafting a LT in the 1st round if not to be your LT for the next 10 years? Unless we're completely admitting there was no plan for Pugh when we drafted him and we just picked him for the hell of it.

 

College players at LT do not necessarily project well to that position in the NFL.

 

You probably forgot this completely but there was another guy the Giants had penciled in at LT before and after they draft Pugh in 2013. Now the Giants when they drafted Pugh were looking for a RT. David Diehl was the starting RT back in 2012 and he wasn't getting any younger or better by this point.

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The moment he was drafted there was talk of him moving to rt or inside to guard.

 

I think a guard or right tackle at pick 19 makes plenty of sense. Especially a guy with the versatility to play all over the line line Pugh.

Right Tackle, maybe. Guard... not a chance in hell unless he's an all world guard which Pugh is not.

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College players at LT do not necessarily project well to that position in the NFL.

 

You probably forgot this completely but there was another guy the Giants had penciled in at LT before and after they draft Pugh in 2013. Now the Giants when they drafted Pugh were looking for a RT. David Diehl was the starting RT back in 2012 and he wasn't getting any younger or better by this point.

I recall the plan was to start him at right and move him to LT much like the Flowers plan that fell through. Regardless our OL problems could've and should've been handled by now and they weren't. There's no excuse for that.

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I recall the plan was to start him at right and move him to LT much like the Flowers plan that fell through. Regardless our OL problems could've and should've been handled by now and they weren't. There's no excuse for that.

 

Again though, if you want to make the argument that Reese is incompetent, that's fine. But he didn't ignore the OL, he just picked some bad guys.

 

Mitch Petrus. Eric Hermann. J.D. Walton. Geoff Schwartz. Grey Rugamer. Dallas Reynolds. Newhouse and Jerry. Not to mention the guys he may have hit on... Richburg, Flowers, and Pugh. These are all guys brought in to replace the Deihl-MacKenzie line. Personally, I wouldn't take a single guy on the line now over the guy Reese inherited, but he's trying. He's just not as good at assembling a line as Accorsi was... but it's not like he's taking a 6th round guard every season. That line got old overnight, but the late round gambles and low-priced free agents haven't worked out.

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I'm still half expecting some kind of a trade for an OT .

Reese must know that he is out of a job if the Giants miss the playoffs and the right side of the line is proven to be awful. ( its all on him ! )

We have some CAP space left too.

I also think we will find something after the Sept 3rd cuts to 53 ( but this will only be for depth ) .

Just do it Jerry !

 

Reese ain't going anywhere after this season. Yeah, he had terrible drafts from 2008-2012 but the last three have all been decent.

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Again though, if you want to make the argument that Reese is incompetent, that's fine. But he didn't ignore the OL, he just picked some bad guys.

 

Mitch Petrus. Eric Hermann. J.D. Walton. Geoff Schwartz. Grey Rugamer. Dallas Reynolds. Newhouse and Jerry. Not to mention the guys he may have hit on... Richburg, Flowers, and Pugh. These are all guys brought in to replace the Deihl-MacKenzie line. Personally, I wouldn't take a single guy on the line now over the guy Reese inherited, but he's trying. He's just not as good at assembling a line as Accorsi was... but it's not like he's taking a 6th round guard every season. That line got old overnight, but the late round gambles and low-priced free agents haven't worked out.

Reese is incompetent in most regards, yes. And yes... I also believe that penny pinching and relying on late round projects to solidify the 2nd most important position group to an offense counts as ignoring the problem. Same as his LB strategy.

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I'm sorry, but if Reese was simply "incompetent in most regards", he wouldn't be an NFL GM and certainly wouldn't have super bowls on his resume.

Reese should've been fired right alongside Coughlin and for the love of God do we need to again go over why and how Accorsi built the core of BOTH Reese's super bowl teams? Reese supplemented both teams beautifully. I've never denied that and never will, but HE is solely responsible for the current state of the Giants... a team that has had 3 consecutive sub .500 seasons and 4 consecutive seasons without a playoff appearance. That comes from failed projects (both in the draft and free agency), and entire draft classes flopping and it took his job being threatened for him to change his mindset and actually try to build a solid team. That is pathetic.

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That's my point. The insistence that Flowers couldn't possibly be moved onto the right side hurt the chances dramatically that the Giants would improve the OL.

Right and id prefer to do the line shuffling too but in their minds they're thinking why should they change their plans after such a big investment for another who isn't that great to begin with? If they think he's the left tackle for the next decade then they should keep him there

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Where Pugh was drafted you hope he's a left tackle and settle if he can play an effective right tackle. That he seems to be ok at OG is better than busting but the intent was for him to play the tackle position when he was drafted. Terron Armstead went in the third round of that draft, btw, and is one of the better LT's in football. Could've been had in the 2nd, and was a prototype LT... only knock was he was a small school guy. Not a criticism, but more of a "what could've been."

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Right and id prefer to do the line shuffling too but in their minds they're thinking why should they change their plans after such a big investment for another who isn't that great to begin with? If they think he's the left tackle for the next decade then they should keep him there

 

I understand the point but if the team is better off not having a glaring hole at RT in Newhouse (and it would be even if Flowers had to temporarily switch to that side), then you do that. Flowers can go back to LT in a couple of seasons or even earlier. I may be in the minority on this but I think Okung is a very good player and will be a great investment for the Broncos. And don't forget the Jets got Clady AND a 7th rounder for a 5th round pick. Come on. Get one of the better tackles in all of football for a 5th round pick? I would've easily parted with a 4th rounder for Clady. You bring Clady in and you say, to Flowers, do what you do on the right side, this makes our team better. You will get your time. You think the Broncos would've rather traded Clady out of the AFC all things being equal?

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Reese ain't going anywhere after this season. Yeah, he had terrible drafts from 2008-2012 but the last three have all been decent.

Agreed. If he feared losing his job he's not taking Apple, who by all accounts is a pick for the future. McAdoo will go before Reese and honestly may be one and done
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Reese should've been fired right alongside Coughlin and for the love of God do we need to again go over why and how Accorsi built the core of BOTH Reese's super bowl teams? Reese supplemented both teams beautifully. I've never denied that and never will, but HE is solely responsible for the current state of the Giants... a team that has had 3 consecutive sub .500 seasons and 4 consecutive seasons without a playoff appearance. That comes from failed projects (both in the draft and free agency), and entire draft classes flopping and it took his job being threatened for him to change his mindset and actually try to build a solid team. That is pathetic.

 

How many Accorsi drafted players were even on that 2011 team? Eli, DeOssie, and....?

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Where Pugh was drafted you hope he's a left tackle and settle if he can play an effective right tackle. That he seems to be ok at OG is better than busting but the intent was for him to play the tackle position when he was drafted. Terron Armstead went in the third round of that draft, btw, and is one of the better LT's in football. Could've been had in the 2nd, and was a prototype LT... only knock was he was a small school guy. Not a criticism, but more of a "what could've been."

 

That's true, but if I'm not mistaken the first round of that draft has been one of the worst in recent memory. Most of those guys didn't have their optional fifth-year clause offered to them.

 

 

 

i disagree Seph ......if we go 5-11 or 6-10 again Mara will replace him in my opinion

 

Maybe, but if I'm Reese I'm telling the Maras to give my drafts a chance now that we have a 2016 conditioning program, not a 1957 one. Yeah, those drafts from 2008-2012 were all pretty bad, but how many of those guys never saw the light of day because they were in the trainers room every week or on IR? It's too early to say if Wellman's program will keep the team healthier but we're at a way better place this season then we were last season in regards to injuries.

 

Honestly though, I think Gettleman made Reese more than the other way around. The Pro Player Personnel department has never been the same. When Gettleman was here you'd find a few diamonds in the rough every year in free agency... an R.W. Mc Quarters, a Shaun Andrews, a Trumaine Mc Bride. Guys that weren't stars, but were going to contribute to the team and weren't going to hurt you. Since then, we've hit on the guys that it's tough to miss on (DRC, etc) but there's been a lot more Brandon Myers' than Martellus Bennets.

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I understand the point but if the team is better off not having a glaring hole at RT in Newhouse (and it would be even if Flowers had to temporarily switch to that side), then you do that. Flowers can go back to LT in a couple of seasons or even earlier. I may be in the minority on this but I think Okung is a very good player and will be a great investment for the Broncos. And don't forget the Jets got Clady AND a 7th rounder for a 5th round pick. Come on. Get one of the better tackles in all of football for a 5th round pick? I would've easily parted with a 4th rounder for Clady. You bring Clady in and you say, to Flowers, do what you do on the right side, this makes our team better. You will get your time. You think the Broncos would've rather traded Clady out of the AFC all things being equal?

I think they traded him for that price because he's hurt all the time
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That's true, but if I'm not mistaken the first round of that draft has been one of the worst in recent memory. Most of those guys didn't have their optional fifth-year clause offered to them.

 

 

 

Maybe, but if I'm Reese I'm telling the Maras to give my drafts a chance now that we have a 2016 conditioning program, not a 1957 one. Yeah, those drafts from 2008-2012 were all pretty bad, but how many of those guys never saw the light of day because they were in the trainers room every week or on IR? It's too early to say if Wellman's program will keep the team healthier but we're at a way better place this season then we were last season in regards to injuries.

 

Honestly though, I think Gettleman made Reese more than the other way around. The Pro Player Personnel department has never been the same. When Gettleman was here you'd find a few diamonds in the rough every year in free agency... an R.W. Mc Quarters, a Shaun Andrews, a Trumaine Mc Bride. Guys that weren't stars, but were going to contribute to the team and weren't going to hurt you. Since then, we've hit on the guys that it's tough to miss on (DRC, etc) but there's been a lot more Brandon Myers' than Martellus Bennets.

This too. I think it's more Ross than Reese

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I recall the plan was to start him at right and move him to LT much like the Flowers plan that fell through. Regardless our OL problems could've and should've been handled by now and they weren't. There's no excuse for that.

 

Nope it was never the plan. Giants had just signed Will Beatty to a 5 year contract the same year Pugh was drafted.

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Where Pugh was drafted you hope he's a left tackle and settle if he can play an effective right tackle. That he seems to be ok at OG is better than busting but the intent was for him to play the tackle position when he was drafted. Terron Armstead went in the third round of that draft, btw, and is one of the better LT's in football. Could've been had in the 2nd, and was a prototype LT... only knock was he was a small school guy. Not a criticism, but more of a "what could've been."

 

Once again, he was not drafted to play Left Tackle.

 

You should lend him that 20/20 hindsight you've been using so we can have the "what if" team.

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