A new coach might switch to a 3-4 defense - what then?

[BleedinBlue]

I am very comfortable with the 4-3 defense and was never a fan of the 3-4. But, with a new coach coming it that is completely up for grabs. It would change everything as far as player personnel and the draft. We would be shedding some players we thought we'd keep and we'd be looking for linebackers and hybrids as a top priority, probably both in free agency and the draft.

 

What are the chances of that happening?

 

Anyone here like the 3-4 over the 4-3?

 

Should we go to a 3-4, how does that shakeup who we keep?

 

These are just things running through my brain. I am not up to speed on the favored system of the coaches we are interviewing, but that seems to me to a big part of the equation when selecting a new head coach.

[Sephiroth]

I'm not sure it really matters since only 3 defensive starters are under contract for next year, and one of them is Hankins who could probably be an All-Pro nose tackle if they make the switch.

[Allstarjim]

As mentioned, Hank could play the nose. JPP can still play end in a 3-4. I think Bromley could be the other end. Owa would probably not be a fit. The linebackers we have might benefit. But I'd like to see them go to a foex defense. The Patriots play both. Would like it if we did that as well.

[BleedinBlue]

As mentioned, Hank could play the nose. JPP can still play end in a 3-4. I think Bromley could be the other end. Owa would probably not be a fit. The linebackers we have might benefit. But I'd like to see them go to a foex defense. The Patriots play both. Would like it if we did that as well.

Enlighten me Jim...a "Foex defense"?

[carl 1010]

I certainly wouldn't want to see any more of the "talent" we have at LB on the field! That, to me, has to be the number 1 priority in the draft. Hard to believe how far we have fallen at the position we were known for once upon a time!

[Allstarjim]

Enlighten me Jim...a "Foex defense"?

 

LOL... was typing on my phone. I meant a flex defense... would like to see them have packages with both base defenses to mix up what the QB sees and keep players fresh. Not easy to do but the Patriots do it and I like it.

 

I don't think we have enough good linebackers right now to run the 3-4. You could have Casillas, J.T. Thomas, Kennard, and Beason out there... just looked and Beason is signed through next season. I suppose he could be cut. But the Giants don't really have enough right now to run it, but that's something they could fix quickly. Cullen Jenkins could play end in a 3-4.

[Lughead]

As mentioned, Hank could play the nose. JPP can still play end in a 3-4. I think Bromley could be the other end. Owa would probably not be a fit. The linebackers we have might benefit. But I'd like to see them go to a foex defense. The Patriots play both. Would like it if we did that as well.

is Bromley more suited for DT than an DE? The way Ayres was coming on in the latter half of the season he may be the better option no?

[BleedinBlue]

LOL... was typing on my phone. I meant a flex defense... would like to see them have packages with both base defenses to mix up what the QB sees and keep players fresh. Not easy to do but the Patriots do it and I like it.

 

I don't think we have enough good linebackers right now to run the 3-4. You could have Casillas, J.T. Thomas, Kennard, and Beason out there... just looked and Beason is signed through next season. I suppose he could be cut. But the Giants don't really have enough right now to run it, but that's something they could fix quickly. Cullen Jenkins could play end in a 3-4.

LOL

 

I looked up the Patriots' defense and it's called the "Fairbanks-Bullough 3-4" system also known as a flexible two gap system.

 

"The defensive system generally places an emphasis on physicality and discipline over mobility and risk taking characterized as a 'bend but do not break defense'. A system largely used by Bill Parcells"

To work right requires having an excellent front seven. More priority is put on linemen and linebackers than the defensive secondary.

 

If we switch systems, we have a long way to go to put together a good linebacking crew. Apart from Kennard, I'm not sure we have anyone capable of using that system.

[Allstarjim]

LOL

 

I looked up the Patriots' defense and it's called the "Fairbanks-Bullough 3-4" system also known as a flexible two gap system.

 

"The defensive system generally places an emphasis on physicality and discipline over mobility and risk taking characterized as a 'bend but do not break defense'. A system largely used by Bill Parcells"

To work right requires having an excellent front seven. More priority is put on linemen and linebackers than the defensive secondary.

 

If we switch systems, we have a long way to go to put together a good linebacking crew. Apart from Kennard, I'm not sure we have anyone capable of using that system.

 

 

No, even the guys I mentioned was just a nod that you might have enough players to run the defense... but you still fall well short of having the personnel to field a GOOD defense. And if the Giants lose JPP to free agency, boy oh boy we will have an enormous hole to dig ourselves out of, regardless of system.

[Tempest]

It is possible and if they do then I'm sure they will bring in guys who fit. A year ago it was crazy to think of it but now JPP is expendable and we aren't committed to anyone long term that would make the switch impossible.

[Herc]

If it works it works.

[Allstarjim]

It is possible and if they do then I'm sure they will bring in guys who fit. A year ago it was crazy to think of it but now JPP is expendable and we aren't committed to anyone long term that would make the switch impossible.

 

 

I beg to differ. I guess you can believe that if you think he's never going to be the same player or get close to being the same player. I think he made a difference just coming back even with the club. But you take him away and you remove one of only two established stars on our defense, and the only legitimate pass rushing threat. I think JPP is critical to resigning, hopefully for reasonable money.

[Tempest]

 

 

I beg to differ. I guess you can believe that if you think he's never going to be the same player or get close to being the same player. I think he made a difference just coming back even with the club. But you take him away and you remove one of only two established stars on our defense, and the only legitimate pass rushing threat. I think JPP is critical to resigning, hopefully for reasonable money.

He did make a difference and there can be no doubt about it. I just don't think you can build your defense around him anymore.

[Virginia Giant]

I certainly wouldn't want to see any more of the "talent" we have at LB on the field! That, to me, has to be the number 1 priority in the draft. Hard to believe how far we have fallen at the position we were known for once upon a time!

 

 

Haha, thats what I was thinking. Increase the number of people of our worst position group on the field?

[Mr. P]

 

 

Haha, thats what I was thinking. Increase the number of people of our worst position group on the field?

 

The only one who I don't think is just another guy, is Kennard, who just can't stay on the field.

[Sephiroth]

The one thing we would have to consider is whether or not you'd want to re-sign Ayers if we move to a 3-4. He was pretty underwhelming as a 3-4 defensive end in Denver.

[Treehugger]

Bring Sintim back!

[Bigblue25]

As mentioned, Hank could play the nose. JPP can still play end in a 3-4. I think Bromley could be the other end. Owa would probably not be a fit. The linebackers we have might benefit. But I'd like to see them go to a foex defense. The Patriots play both. Would like it if we did that as well.

I remember Owa being pegged as a 5 tech by some analysts. The whole front seven minus Hankins needs to be revamped anyways. Kennard could be a 3-4 OLB. I wouldn't a Teryl Austin who can run both fronts

[Sephiroth]

I remember Owa being pegged as a 5 tech by some analysts. The whole front seven minus Hankins needs to be revamped anyways. Kennard could be a 3-4 OLB. I wouldn't a Teryl Austin who can run both fronts

 

Wasn't Owa a 3-4 DE in college?

 

Not that it matters... he's never going to see the field anyway. Why sign Clint Sintim when we already have one on the team!

[gmenroc]

If a new coach came in dictating a scheme that we didn't have the players for, then I wouldn't be bringing that new coach in.

 

As a GM, you have to have an idea of what your guys are capable of...and you have to realize that the best coaches are those that adapt their system to meet the players abilities and slowly train your players to become more adept with the system. So as a coach, you see a lot of your scheme implemented but you also take advantage of what your guys do best. It's a hybrid of both sides. A coach demanding his own way need not apply.

[JMFP]

The 3-4 defense, with good linebackers, would be more effective v mobile QBs, fast tight ends, and pass catching running backs.

 

But our GM sucks balls so I expect another few years of shitty defense until Reese is fired.

[BlueInCanada]

I feel like a switch to a 3-4 would basically gurantee a number of seasons of a rebuild.

 

No LB on this roster is currently capable of being a 3-4 LB. Kennard is to small to be in the middle to take on guards and to slow to be a rushing outside LB.

 

The D-line would be fine with Hankins at nose tackle, JPP would need to learn to play standing up since he wouldnt be able to play on a three man line. Ayers would make a decent outside 3-4 LB.

 

Collins would make an excellent box safety in a 3-4, but we would need to draft/sign a ball hawk free safety to play deep coverage effectively.

 

I feel we would need to draft/sign another 6-7 starters to make the 3-4 work effectively in the system, which I don't have faith in JR doing.

[Allstarjim]

I feel like a switch to a 3-4 would basically gurantee a number of seasons of a rebuild.

 

No LB on this roster is currently capable of being a 3-4 LB. Kennard is to small to be in the middle to take on guards and to slow to be a rushing outside LB.

 

The D-line would be fine with Hankins at nose tackle, JPP would need to learn to play standing up since he wouldnt be able to play on a three man line. Ayers would make a decent outside 3-4 LB.

 

Collins would make an excellent box safety in a 3-4, but we would need to draft/sign a ball hawk free safety to play deep coverage effectively.

 

I feel we would need to draft/sign another 6-7 starters to make the 3-4 work effectively in the system, which I don't have faith in JR doing.

 

 

Are you serious? We need to draft/sign at least another 6-7 starters to make our existing defense work. What good defensive players do we have right now to work with that are under contract? Collins, DRC, Hankins, and Kennard (if he can ever stay healthy)? I mean, we can be generous and say Casillas and J.T. Thomas who both were decent... but that's LITERALLY all the Giants have that they know are decent to good players under contract on this defense.

[BlueInCanada]

 

 

Are you serious? We need to draft/sign at least another 6-7 starters to make our existing defense work. What good defensive players do we have right now to work with that are under contract? Collins, DRC, Hankins, and Kennard (if he can ever stay healthy)? I mean, we can be generous and say Casillas and J.T. Thomas who both were decent... but that's LITERALLY all the Giants have that they know are decent to good players under contract on this defense.

 

Easy now Jim.

 

When did I say we should "keep this current defense?"

 

This team needs a rebuild from top to bottom, but a change to a 3-4 basically means we throw every single defensive player out the door besides the secondary and a few players. In a 4-3 we atleast have a lot of capable backups, the LB core is solid in a 4-3, along with the defensive line, granted like I said most of the current players are just backups/rotation players in a 4-3.

 

Either way it's gonna take a lot of work, which is why I want a defensive minded HC, enough is enough, bring back Gints football.

[Tempest]

Roster just needs a few more big time role players, not a roster rebuild. Changing the defense over to a 3-4 isn't as dramatic as everyone thinks.