Tempest Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Honestly, JPP was one of the best, if not the best run-stuffing DE in the league last year... but those aren't guys you give 14 mil to per season. You give it to the guy who also gets sacks and JPP gets them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Ralph Vacchiano @RVacchianoNYDN 2m2 minutes ago Jason Pierre-Paul still currently counts for $14.813 million against the Giants cap even though he's unsigned. But ... Ralph Vacchiano @RVacchianoNYDN 40s40 seconds ago ... Giants will be refunded 1/17th of that number ($871,352-ish) in cap space each week JPP is unsigned Thanks. Was actually about to go look up how that works. Might then be beneficial to hold off on Eli's extension until either the end of the season or the point where JPP does return (if he does actually return). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 You give it to the guy who also gets sacks and JPP gets them. Look at whom he got his sacks against. That says something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gman329 Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 I don't see any way the Giants can get any value out of JPP. He won't be worth even the prorated franchise number if and when he does return this season and there's no way to sign and trade him. It's frustrating and painful but they should just cut him loose and move on. Close the book on this sad and sordid saga and use that cap space wisely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Look at whom he got his sacks against. That says something. Look at who we beat, that says something about the whole team and not just him too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMFP Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Honestly, JPP was one of the best, if not the best run-stuffing DE in the league last year... but those aren't guys you give 14 mil to per season. I agree. A team that might be counting on John Jerry and Marshall Newhouse could use that $14mm elsewhere. And right now, 2015 JPP is not remotely close to 2014 JPP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMFP Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Well said. I'm of the opinion that the Giants should rescind the tag at this point while offering up their medical rehab facilities for his use should he choose to use them. I mentioned it in past threads regarding JPP's accident...I literally am good friends with a guy who went through the exact same thing. My friend lost his left thumb, shattered bones in his hand and wrist from a fireworks accident. It took him well over a year to START rehabbing. The first few months included multiple surgeries to clean out the wound, set what bones they could, insert pins (that extrude through the skin all Wolverine-style, but that are also connected to bone so tapping on the extruding pins causes extreme pain, skin grafts, and nerve repair). In between and after the surgeries, he had to wear a compression glove to help force circulation to the damaged part of his hand. He had to go through gripping and flexibility exercises. Meanwhile, he has had to deal with the feeling that his thumb is still there. For whatever it's worth, my friend very much worked/works with his hands, as does JPP. And that is what really cast a lot of doubts in my head that JPP would ever return to his previous form, and certainly not for the Giants. If my friend is any sort of measuring stick, JPP won't play at all this year. And after a year off, some up and down seasons, previous back surgery...I just don't see how you can pay the guy 14 million this year. I'd very much like to see that 14 million get saved, rolled into next year's cap, and used towards resigning Eli. Between that 14 million and Eli's what, 17 million...you could theoretically give Eli a base salary next year of 31 million...and back it down from there towards the end of his contract...making signing free agents and transitioning to a new QB much easier. In other words, the availability of the 14 million makes frontloading Eli's final extension a distinct possibility. Great insight. When I was a kid, my dad suffered 3rd degree burns on nearly 20% of his body (mainly both arms and hands) as a result of an industrial accident on the job, and skin grafts were required. My old man was no JPP, but he was an very good athlete (varsity hoops in Brooklyn, lifeguard at Rockaway beach, etc). Even then, the physical toll and the rehab involved was brutal. He told me that there was no pain he ever felt that compared to the pain he suffered in the burn unit, and the shit they did for the skin graft process was something out of frankenstein's lab. He mentioned those gripping and flexibility exercises....nurses basically said that if he wanted his hands to function he'd need to deal with the pain. He would apologize in advance to the nurses, who replied he didn't say anything they didn't hear a thousand times before. That's why I think this dude is done in 2015, and maybe beyond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Thing with the fireworks deal is that there is BOTH burn AND structural damage to deal with. I mean, the hand will essentially be immobile for months to allow the structural damage to heal. Meanwhile, there are skin grafts and scar tissue to deal with. Try holding your leg in the same place for 8 hours while at work some day and then try to walk somewhere. Ever ride in a car for several hours and cramp up because you can't stretch out...imagine that car ride takes 6 months and then try to use your legs as if you never got in the car.... Reading reports of the examination done by the Giants...doesn't it appear as if it was quite quick...like JPP walked in, unwrapped the hand...and before the last bandage was off they had seen enough? I don't think his career is over...I really think that someone will pick him up next year...but I don't see it being with the Giants. Ultimately, it really doesn't matter if JPP signs. If he doesn't sign, the Giants reportedly recoup 1/17 of the 14.8 million figure for each week he's unsigned. So if he doesn't play for the year, the Giants get all that cap space next year. If he plays 8 games, he'll get roughly half that 14.8 million and the Giants will recoup the rest. If he does sign, the Giants would likely put him on some list that will essentially shelve him for the year and meanwhile, the Giants MAY elect to pay him a portion of that 14.8 million, but would ultimately recoup a large portion of it. Either way, I don't see him hitting the field anytime soon and I don't see the Giants being on the hook for any more of the 14.8 than they absolutely have to. Finally, JPP is only getting paid if he plays...and well, we've already discussed that, haven't we. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treehugger Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Thing with the fireworks deal is that there is BOTH burn AND structural damage to deal with. I mean, the hand will essentially be immobile for months to allow the structural damage to heal. Meanwhile, there are skin grafts and scar tissue to deal with. Try holding your leg in the same place for 8 hours while at work some day and then try to walk somewhere. Ever ride in a car for several hours and cramp up because you can't stretch out...imagine that car ride takes 6 months and then try to use your legs as if you never got in the car.... Reading reports of the examination done by the Giants...doesn't it appear as if it was quite quick...like JPP walked in, unwrapped the hand...and before the last bandage was off they had seen enough? I don't think his career is over...I really think that someone will pick him up next year...but I don't see it being with the Giants. Ultimately, it really doesn't matter if JPP signs. If he doesn't sign, the Giants reportedly recoup 1/17 of the 14.8 million figure for each week he's unsigned. So if he doesn't play for the year, the Giants get all that cap space next year. If he plays 8 games, he'll get roughly half that 14.8 million and the Giants will recoup the rest. If he does sign, the Giants would likely put him on some list that will essentially shelve him for the year and meanwhile, the Giants MAY elect to pay him a portion of that 14.8 million, but would ultimately recoup a large portion of it. Either way, I don't see him hitting the field anytime soon and I don't see the Giants being on the hook for any more of the 14.8 than they absolutely have to. Finally, JPP is only getting paid if he plays...and well, we've already discussed that, haven't we. Paid if he signs...he'd likely be on the roster for a while before he actually plays. Ralph Vacchiano @RVacchianoNYDN 40s40 seconds ago ... Giants will be refunded 1/17th of that number ($871,352-ish) in cap space each week JPP is unsigned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Paid if he signs...he'd likely be on the roster for a while before he actually plays. Ralph Vacchiano @RVacchianoNYDN 40s40 seconds ago ... Giants will be refunded 1/17th of that number ($871,352-ish) in cap space each week JPP is unsigned It's also been reported that the Giants won't sign him until he's ready to play... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treehugger Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 It's also been reported that the Giants won't sign him until he's ready to play... You think they'll sign him immediately before playing him, no practice, new scheme? He's not going to be working out with the team until the ink is dry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 You think they'll sign him immediately before playing him, no practice, new scheme? He's not going to be working out with the team until the ink is dry. I think he'll have to pass a physical before siging. I think too as far as assignments go, he can get up to speed. But at the end of the day, I think it's all moot because he won't be ready this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedinBlue Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 I read through TC's transcript today and he was asked if the reason JPP wasn't ready was due to his physical conditioning for football or for his hand. TC simply replied, "hand". TC said JPP was in great physical shape, in a great frame of mind and in very good spirits. So the problem right now is the fact that his hand is simply not ready to play in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 I read through TC's transcript today and he was asked if the reason JPP wasn't ready was due to his physical conditioning for football or for his hand. TC simply replied, "hand". TC said JPP was in great physical shape, in a great frame of mind and in very good spirits. So the problem right now is the fact that his hand is simply not ready to play in the NFL. I'm not so sure that was ever in question. I think that JPP should post as many pictures of his hand as possible. I'll admit that after my friend went through it, the first time I saw his 4-fingered hand, it was shocking. The more I saw it, the less shocking it became. I do think that the Giants medical staff likely had some of that initial reaction too. I mean, we all know what an amputation is...but there is something about seeing what is left, a stub, a empty space, whatever...that just makes it more real than reading the word 'amputated'. Once it's out there and there is documented progress...I think that could sway some opinions. That said, I still don't see him playing this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightFire Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 What's more damning for his return this year is that the union hasn't been involved. Clearly JPP and his agent know that he is not in playing shape and may not be for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeMesiS Posted September 11, 2015 Share Posted September 11, 2015 I agree. A team that might be counting on John Jerry and Marshall Newhouse could use that $14mm elsewhere. And right now, 2015 JPP is not remotely close to 2014 JPP. yes, that's because we don't play Jacksonville. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeMesiS Posted September 11, 2015 Share Posted September 11, 2015 I think the Giants should give JPP the finger and let him go else where. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allstarjim Posted September 11, 2015 Share Posted September 11, 2015 The scuttlebutt two years ago or so after JPP's monster season was that he was all about the money, and the Giants would have no more advantage to signing him than any other team, he was going to go for the most money he could get. Well, I think he lost about half and maybe more of the $100 million plus deal he would've received. Not only for the accident, but also for the way he thumbed his nose at the Giants when they came down to see him, and the entire way he has handled this process with the Giants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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