Shockey and Reese Exchange Words

[Virginia Giant]

Well said Tempest. You mention Phil Simms as an example. But I would like to bring up another Giants QB who till this day, is still bitter because the Giants wouldn't let him suit up for SB XXI. Jeff Hostetler....

What did he say that was so out of line from what half of us have been saying for months?

 

Not one person here imo believes the Giants are better off if we trade Shockey. Don't assume or put words in our mouth just because thats the medias claim. Most Giants fans here are pretty well versed in the team and football in general.

 

 

Those who said they believe Shockey wanted traded basically said exactly what tempest just said, that Shockey was pissed about all the "Giants are better off without him" shit and wanted a fresh start.

 

 

 

[fishgutmartyr]

Nice to see the thread still going strong with good arguments for both sides. I still haven't seen anything to convince me that Shockey is the villain here. I agree with Virginia Giant that the whole situation is a joke that needs to be resolved. Giants & Shockey need each other, that is a fact. They can't replace him and he will not be a better tight end elsewhere and win another super bowl.

 

The whole idea that the team was better without Shockey was drummed up by the media. They created the story and have run with it for the last 6 months. The Giants trying to trade Shockey sure didn't help it and Shockey not speaking up sooner sure didn't help. You read what Phil Simms had said about the situation and you get an idea of what Shockey is feeling. You see what the organization tried to do this spring and you can understand that as well. Now is the time for reconciliation.

 

Second round pick for Shockey would have been ridiculously cheap, ask Oakland. I do believe Shockey did ask to get moved simply because when you hear about how well your team has done without you, it definitely gets to you as a competitor. Which is why we sit here and talk about what they do and complain about how much they make; we can't do what they do and they get paid that money to perform at the highest level. If it was all about the chicks and money they'd be actors. Its a sport and it is all about the competition with each other to be the best there ever was. Only thing most of us understand is the perks and the paycheck.

 

Not much to really complain about here. I see a difference between listening to offers and actively seeking them, but then again, I'm not Shockey.

 

Of course, if the report that Shockey and Rosenhaus gave the Giants an ultimatum in December are true, then this doesn't work.

[NeMesiS]

What did he say that was so out of line from what half of us have been saying for months?

 

Not one person here imo believes the Giants are better off if we trade Shockey. Don't assume or put words in our mouth just because thats the medias claim. Most Giants fans here are pretty well versed in the team and football in general.

 

 

Those who said they believe Shockey wanted traded basically said exactly what tempest just said, that Shockey was pissed about all the "Giants are better off without him" shit and wanted a fresh start.

I'm not putting words in anyones mouth. I just thought Tempest gave great example on what happen to Simms, and I wanted to bring up another example. You're still my favorite poster.

[Virginia Giant]

I'm not putting words in anyones mouth. I just thought Tempest gave great example on what happen to Simms, and I wanted to bring up another example. You're still my favorite poster.

I wasn't necessarily saying you, just the whole "pro" Shockey vs "anti" shockey thing. The bottom line is we all want peace and harmony and number 80 playing on this team.

 

 

 

And your my favorite Columbian drug lord, er, Admin.

[TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt]

That is Colombian Drug Lord VG.....unless you are saying Tempest was the biggest drug lord on the Columbia University campus up on 113th Street.

[Tempest]

Sssh the cops aren't aware of me yet!

 

That is Colombian Drug Lord VG.....unless you are saying Tempest was the biggest drug lord on the Columbia University campus up on 113th Street.

[Nas]

I wasn't necessarily saying you, just the whole "pro" Shockey vs "anti" shockey thing. The bottom line is we all want peace and harmony and number 80 playing on this team.

 

 

 

And your my favorite Columbian drug lord, er, Admin.

 

VG you're right when you say Giants fan know the value of Shockey. I'm yet to see anyone on this board claim the team is better without him.

 

and lmao at the Columbian drug loard.. lol

[TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt]

Sssh the cops aren't aware of me yet!

 

LOL!!! Meant to write Nemesis....must have been delirious last night.

[JayD]

VG you're right when you say Giants fan know the value of Shockey. I'm yet to see anyone on this board claim the team is better without him.

 

and lmao at the Columbian drug loard.. lol

 

 

I wouldnt say the Giants are better off without him, yet. But if they dont find some harmony soon, I will be saying it, and I will be right.

[Taylorized56]

Michael Strahan was 30 minutes into his new career being paid to express opinions, and he wasted no time showing his willingness to do so.

 

What does he think the Giants should do with disillusioned tight end Jeremy Shockey?

 

"He doesn't want to play here; that's obvious with everything that's going on," Strahan told Newsday yesterday after being introduced as the newest cast member on "Fox NFL Sunday."

 

"I don't think you gain much by keeping a guy around. Regardless of how well he plays for you, there's always that tension, and that's one thing you can't have if you're expected to go back and repeat."

 

Strahan added Shockey might do his job well, but that doesn't mean he would be happy.

 

"You don't need that out of one of your leaders," the recently retired defensive end said. "So I think the best thing for them and for Shockey is if they have the opportunity, let him go."

 

http://www.newsday.com/sports/football/ny-...0,7605788.story

[Firstnten]

No one's denied any of it, no one's talked. That's my whole point.

and now strah has confirmed it.....

 

doh!

[eagleEye]

"He doesn't want to play here; that's obvious with everything that's going on,"

 

Sounds like speculation. Untill Shockey comes out and says, " I dont want to be a Giant.", Im still hopefull this will be resolved.

[NightFire]

Good article on NFL.com. Apparently Kiwi and Ward watched the SB from the stands while Shockey got to sit in the Giants' box. Seems like the Giants have been accommodating to him. Also there is a poll and 71% have voted to trade Shockey.

 

The Jeremy Shockey/New York Giants dispute is similar to the Chad Johnson/Cincinnati Bengals, Terry Glenn/Dallas Cowboys, Chris Simms/Tampa Bay Buccaneers and Jason Taylor/Miami Dolphins rumbles.

 

Player is upset with his team.

 

Team is not thrilled with the player.

 

Here is the huge difference: The Giants won Super Bowl XLII last February without Shockey, who was injured.

 

There is no question that having him onboard and in tune increases their chances to repeat. There is also no question that having won it all without him, there is no fear on the Giants' part of moving on without him.

Jeremy Shockey, TE

New York Giants

 

Career statistics

Years: 6

Rec: 371

Yards: 4,228

TDs: 27

 

Thus, the Shockey saga is most intriguing because it is a thorn in the middle of a championship club. Here is a prime player who feels betrayed by his team and one who is falling out of favor with his team. Believe it, the bum feelings here are mutual. He can stay if he falls in line. He can be heavily fined and suspended if he does not. He can still be traded.

 

And any of the above can still happen before the Giants report to camp on July 25.

 

Once camp kicks in and if the Giants simply wait and watch to see what unfolds, it is Shockey who will color most whether their union lasts. Even before then, the Giants will continue to entertain offers to move him.

 

The Giants will trade him in an instant if they get better than the second- and fifth-round pick package that the New Orleans Saints presented earlier this year. Moving that fifth to a fourth would likely do it. Getting a first-round pick and a solid player the Giants like would do it.

 

Over the next month, both sides have plenty to ponder.

 

And wonder how "Wow" went to "Uh-oh."

 

Shockey sure wowed 'em when he was the 14th pick in the 2002 draft. Then-Giants general manager Ernie Accorsi moved up to that spot to swipe what he believed was a game-breaker at the position.

 

Shockey would prove to be that and over the last six seasons show that he was a much better player than several selected before him. When considering that David Carr (first), Joey Harrington (third), Mike Williams (fourth), Ryan Sims (sixth), Roy Williams (eighth) and Wendell Bryant (12th) were all chosen before Shockey, the Giants gained tremendous value in that draft. Shockey would earn Pro Bowl berths in 2002, 2003, 2005 and 2006.

 

The Giants knew Shockey was good, but he surprised them early with just how good he was. He was a natural. He was the fastest and most effective tight end in the passing game that many among the Giants coaches and management had ever seen.

 

But along with the Pro Bowls and increased stature, foot, ankle and knee injuries slowed him. Along came fire from Shockey that indicated to them that he was a loose cannon. Loose cannon has amped into out of control and unacceptable, in the Giants’ views.

 

He showed up to their recent minicamp unwilling to join other injured Giants on the sidelines. This after complaining about not being allowed on the sidelines at the Super Bowl because he was injured, though he was given entry into a Giants suite while injured players Mathias Kiwanuka and Derrick Ward watched the game from the stands. Shockey had a verbal altercation with Giants general manager Jerry Reese. Shockey helped set an atmosphere that will not work with Giants coach Tom Coughlin -- one where an individual creates a firestorm and makes himself more visible and vocal than the team.

 

Coughlin has always preached against this. He has simply not allowed it, and it is one of the reasons the Giants figured he was perfectly suited to lead them four years ago. That, too, has long been the Giants' preferred way. Sure, Coughlin listened more to his players and last season completed a makeover in harnessing some of his military style. But Coughlin remains a firm believer in team over individual.

 

He and the Giants look no further than their historic season a year ago. As individuals, they were not as good as Dallas or New England. They emphasize that Dallas boasted 13 Pro Bowl players and the Giants only one. That New England was unbeaten and looking unbeatable.

 

But team won. Coughlin’s way won. The Giants' way won.

 

This makes Shockey’s stance -- complaints on how he is being used more as a blocker than receiver, his perceived disrespect in how he has been treated not only as a player but also as a person -- less endearing.

 

They will not tolerate Shockey making his quarterback look silly by showing him up when the ball does not come his way. Not tolerate him being an un-coachable player.

 

They will not allow Shockey to be the same Shockey.

 

Something has to give.

 

And in this instance, if he remains a Giant, it will be Shockey.

 

Winning the Super Bowl gives a team ultimate cache.

 

An NFL general manager offered this view: "Shockey is among the top five tight ends in the league. His blocking is downplayed. He is a very good blocker. Of all of the best tight ends -- (Antonio) Gates, (Tony) Gonzalez and (Jason) Witten -- he is easily a better blocking tight end than any of them. His receiving skills have diminished. He drops way too many balls. Some of that is likely just concentration and his situation. I would imagine before the season kicks off, there will be other suitors in a trade for him. Injuries and circumstances might call for it. But whether he is a Giant or somewhere else, the player should take inventory on what has worked and what has not worked for him in this league. And clean it up."