I've stood by him for a long time...but Eli

[Sephiroth]

Where is the QB coach in all of this Eli mess? Isn't the QB coach there to also correct Eli on his shoddy mechanics? Aren't the coaches working on Eli? I realize that practice speed and real game speed is different....but sometimes it seems like Shockey and Plax aren't practicing with Eli and are 'strange' recievers to Eli.

 

When Tiki was a fumbler, the COACHING staff fixed it! Eli's a mechanical mess and I don't see a fix. They seem to be letting him continue to chuck no look passes, allow him to get too many passes batted and this 'off the back foot' throwing is so habitual for Eli. We notice it as fans BUT are the coaches noticing it? unsure.gif

 

Maybe they are but he's either not listening or doesn't get it. Or maybe he just doesn't have it.

[xxi-xxv]

How does that defeat my argument?

 

When you cite games late in the year when he has played well and then say he has a tired arm its a contradiction. Is his arm tired late in the year or has he played well at times? discounting my theory that he is not a cold(er) weather QB. I think the drop off in play(although like you say at times ok) has been very apparent in the cold(er) weather. I have yet to see hm have a game like Dallas, the one against the Rams a fw years back, one last week in DET, one against the Chargers etc in cold(er) weather conditions. I have seen plenty when it is warm.

[Storm]

This is Kurt 'Hold...Hold...Hold...SACK!' Warner we're talking about, right? I was at his last game (vs Chicago), a game we could have won but didn't largely due to Warner's ineffectiveness.

 

Eli is becoming Eli "Hold...Hold...Hold...SACK!" too though...or else Eli "Scramble like a fish out of water and fall down and get sacked" Manning, too...

[Treehugger]

Eli is becoming Eli "Hold...Hold...Hold...SACK!" too though...or else Eli "Scramble like a fish out of water and fall down and get sacked" Manning, too...

Oh, Eli has much better instincts as to when to run then Warner did, but when he does run it's like a headless chicken. That's probably the one thing that makes him look like a rookie above all else. He's gotta stop back-peddling and watch a few tapes on Romo escaping sideways.

[fishgutmartyr]

Eli is becoming Eli "Hold...Hold...Hold...SACK!" too though...or else Eli "Scramble like a fish out of water and fall down and get sacked" Manning, too...

Warner had that whole "Damn ball-security! I'm running with the ball in my hand so my kid can knock it out!" thing down to a science, though. Eli just has the ball knocked out of his hand while he starts to throw.

 

 

(Why do I suddenly want to cry?)

[TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt]

Accorsi says in his book that when Eli was drafted, Collins barged into his office and demanded to be released. It wouldn't have mattered which QB was drafted. And this was with Collins slated to be the starter that year. When Warner was brought in, it was to be the QB for at least that year, possibly more.

 

I do disagree with Fish on the way Warner was pulled, but we've had this argument before.

Hmmmmm.....someone who had the verified reputation for making stupid racial remarks.....and is a recovering alcoholic.....has his career resurrected despite his "Happy Feet" antics in the SuperBowl gift wrapping it to the Ravens....has the nerve, gall, balls, cojones, shizza in his nizza to walk into anyone's office demanding jack shit just simply amazes me. I would have told him to get the fuck out and traded him for a third or fourth rounder (if I could get it) the first chance I got.

[TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt]

Warner had that whole "Damn ball-security! I'm running with the ball in my hand so my kid can knock it out!" thing down to a science, though. Eli just has the ball knocked out of his hand while he starts to throw.

(Why do I suddenly want to cry?)

Don't forget Kerry "Oh SHIT ITS RAY LEWIS" Collins and his habit of fumbling when sacked or flushed. He made Tiki look like vice grip commercial in comparison.

[fishgutmartyr]

Don't forget Kerry "Oh SHIT ITS RAY LEWIS" Collins and his habit of fumbling when sacked or flushed. He made Tiki look like vice grip commercial in comparison.

How could I forget? *twitch*

 

I would do an outside speed-rush on Pettitgout all day, every day--if you managed to turn the corner, all you had to do was breathe on Collins and that ball was hitting the floor.

 

When you say "flushed": do you mean those times he took a step before getting creamed?

[TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt]

How could I forget? *twitch*

 

I would do an outside speed-rush on Pettitgout all day, every day--if you managed to turn the corner, all you had to do was breathe on Collins and that ball was hitting the floor.

 

When you say "flushed": do you mean those times he took a step before getting creamed?

LOL!!! Half-stepping as they used to say back in the day.

[JMFP]

Eli is becoming Eli "Hold...Hold...Hold...SACK!" too though...or else Eli "Scramble like a fish out of water and fall down and get sacked" Manning, too...

 

I have to say that scrambling is an area that Eli could use some work on. There's nothing wrong with picking up even 3 yards....turning a 2nd and 10 into a 2nd and 7 is a pretty big deal.

[Treehugger]

I have to say that scrambling is an area that Eli could use some work on. There's nothing wrong with picking up even 3 yards....turning a 2nd and 10 into a 2nd and 7 is a pretty big deal.

Especially when compared to a 2nd & 17.

[Sephiroth]

Hmmmmm.....someone who had the verified reputation for making stupid racial remarks.....and is a recovering alcoholic.....has his career resurrected despite his "Happy Feet" antics in the SuperBowl gift wrapping it to the Ravens....has the nerve, gall, balls, cojones, shizza in his nizza to walk into anyone's office demanding jack shit just simply amazes me. I would have told him to get the fuck out and traded him for a third or fourth rounder (if I could get it) the first chance I got. dry.gif

 

Ahh, c'mon, admit it... you loved the Sean Payton playcall three times a game that saw Collins roll out to his right and throw the ball away.

 

Collins didn't look good in the Superbowl... but I at least give him credit on a few of those picks for tossing it up and letting his receivers try to make a play... which none of them did. :/

[feefifoefum]

You are all just having an overly emotional, immature response to a lost. You are idiots to even consider cutting or benching a starting player because of a bad game, you would have had joe montana benched because of a bad game? All players have bad games, even the greatest of the greats. So no you aren't just simply "criticizing" your team, you are being children and throwing tantrums.

 

Eli is a mediocre QB, and that is judging him on 4 years of work, not last Sunday's game. If I were to judge him bu that game, I'd say he was terrible. He is not a terrible QB, but he sure isn't what he was cracked up to be in 2004, is he? I think it's time everyone stops making excuses for the guy and deal with the fact that he is what he is, a middle of the pack NFL QB. I mean come, we can only hold on to "San Diego 2005" for so long.

[feefifoefum]

The kid has a good game, and you guys make one "eli played good' post in the game thread.

He has a bad game, and there are 1500 eli sucks threads around here.

I hope they trade him and it haunts this franchise for years. Fuck ny fans.

 

My problem with Eli is that he doesn't seem to be improving year to year. In fact, this season, he's taken a step back. This isn't about one bad game. Yes, it is a team game, but everyone knows that your QB is your leader, your "ace", the "go to guy". He just isn't that, and that is what we thought we were getting.

[boohyah]

Hmmmmm.....someone who had the verified reputation for making stupid racial remarks.....and is a recovering alcoholic.....has his career resurrected despite his "Happy Feet" antics in the SuperBowl gift wrapping it to the Ravens....has the nerve, gall, balls, cojones, shizza in his nizza to walk into anyone's office demanding jack shit just simply amazes me. I would have told him to get the fuck out and traded him for a third or fourth rounder (if I could get it) the first chance I got.

 

The Giants laid out a list of guidelines Collins had to follow and not only did he do them, he was stand up about them. Now, I understand we gave him a chance, but for all his happy feet, he was easily the best QB we've had since Hoss/ Simms and based on all the shit we're hearing about Eli, he may still be. For all the shit he gets for the Superbowl, at least he qb'd the team there, and anybody who says he didn't play well against the Vikes is simply blind. And TBC, no offense, but if you think that it was Collins that gave the superbowl to the Ravens you're misled, because fact of the matter is that on that day, in those playoffs, no-one, absolutely no-one was beating the Ravens in that game, that D was that good.

 

There were hints that the Giants were going with a QB but nothing definite and Collins found out like everyone else, and considering the guy was coming off an injury and in his last year, that had to be a slap in the face to him. So if he was angry, regardless of his past, he was entitled to be.

[feefifoefum]

What about last years playoff game against the Eagles? He and Burress

were the reason we were in that game for so long.

 

Not true. I recall the Giants having quite a few golden opportunities in the first half to get way out in front, with excellent field position and coming away with almost nothing.

 

Eli played good at the end of that game, and if he had played that way throughout the entire game, it might have had a different ending.

[fringe]

I understand we gave him a chance, but for all his happy feet, he was easily the best QB we've had since Hoss/ Simms

not exactly a high bar to surpass. you're talking brown graham kannell maddox. sounds much better as a law firm than a QB legacy. with his faults, i feel better with eli in there than kerri.

[Treehugger]

Kerry did throw one of the sweetest long balls I've seen though. Much less terrifying than Eli's head-down chuck.

[boohyah]

not exactly a high bar to surpass. you're talking brown graham kannell maddox. sounds much better as a law firm than a QB legacy. with his faults, i feel better with eli in there than kerri.

 

 

I understand it wasn't a high bar, not his fault though.

[TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt]

Ahh, c'mon, admit it... you loved the Sean Payton playcall three times a game that saw Collins roll out to his right and throw the ball away.

 

Collins didn't look good in the Superbowl... but I at least give him credit on a few of those picks for tossing it up and letting his receivers try to make a play... which none of them did. :/

One of 'em was an "Oh shit pass"....as in let heave the fucking ball up in the air and not actually pass it to a wide open and streaking down the sidelines WR because I am literally seeing Ray Lewis' face super imposed on anything in a Raven's uniform. :brooding:

[TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt]

The Giants laid out a list of guidelines Collins had to follow and not only did he do them, he was stand up about them. Now, I understand we gave him a chance, but for all his happy feet, he was easily the best QB we've had since Hoss/ Simms and based on all the shit we're hearing about Eli, he may still be. For all the shit he gets for the Superbowl, at least he qb'd the team there, and anybody who says he didn't play well against the Vikes is simply blind. And TBC, no offense, but if you think that it was Collins that gave the superbowl to the Ravens you're misled, because fact of the matter is that on that day, in those playoffs, no-one, absolutely no-one was beating the Ravens in that game, that D was that good.

 

There were hints that the Giants were going with a QB but nothing definite and Collins found out like everyone else, and considering the guy was coming off an injury and in his last year, that had to be a slap in the face to him. So if he was angry, regardless of his past, he was entitled to be.

Don't get me wrong...I don't hate on Kerri...just that a couple of years of reform do not a saint make. And I always stood up for him on the racial stuff as it was blown out of proportion. But I do think that Kerri scared himself out of the Super Bowl more so than the Ravens Super D. And without the phantom hold...perhaps Dilfer goes down the road to self immolation as everyone expected him to. He did have a tight spiral but poor ball security. I also agree with Tree that his spiral was a lot tighter than Eli's chuck a duck.

 

My main beef with the storming into the office deal is that his career was resurrected; and he was not slighted in my opinion. Now should they have held his hand and whispered into his ear that Eli was the future and not the present....sure. That they didn't is a knock against the Giants management of that time (Acorsi). But you remember how Phil Simms was literally shit canned by the organization using Reeves as the fall guy; so they could anoint the Name Less One as the QB. Now that was the biggest case of disrespect seen in Giants land since the day Sam Huff was traded.