TheShocker Posted August 15, 2007 Author Share Posted August 15, 2007 Truthfully, and I hate to say this because I'm afraid I'll jinx him, but I think I'd rather have Papelbon in a big spot right now than Mo. That's not a knock on Mo, I just think Papelbon is a little more dominant right now (even though he hasn't really pitched in a big spot yet). i can understand that...both are great i dont think anyone will argue that.. mo has proven himself in the big spots through and through it will be interesting to see is papelbon can do the same i think he is capable of it.. and as for joba hes amazing and just a really likeable guy...a legit native american, very humble family i dont remember the specific story but he was raised only by his dad who was paralyzed?? something like that... but he's got good roots and who cant like a guy named joba. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheShocker Posted August 15, 2007 Author Share Posted August 15, 2007 and imagine in a few years when we have hughes, joba and ian kennedy taking the mound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feefifoefum Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 comparing Joba to Joe Smith is like comparing Pedro Martinez circa 1999 to Casey Fossum When Joe Smith first appeared, he was striking out 2 batters an inning. He was "lights out" for a little longer than 3 appearances. I'm not comparing the players, just giving an example of a rookie performing well until the league catches up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feefifoefum Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 Have you seen the guy pitch, seriously? And don't say you have if you haven't. This is not Joe Smith throwing guys off for a few months until they figure him out. This is a guy with grade A stuff. Okajima has been great for the Red Sox this year, but I fully expect him to come back to Earth sometime within the next year. Papelbon, on the other hand, you knew was going to be a dominant pitcher from the first time he took the mound as a closer. You could just see the way he blew guys away. I'm telling you, this guy is better than Papelbon because he controls his breaking ball so well. I could name you 25 GMs and 25 managers at least (and that's only because I haven't taken the time to think about each team) who would take this guy as their 8th inning guy the rest of the way right now. This is guy is going to have to be "lights out" for the rest of the way for the Yankees to accomplish what they are trying to do. Anything less, and it's probably an early offseason for the first time in over a decade. That's alot of pressure to put on a rookie's shoulders, no matter what kind of stuff he has. Sorry, but no one is a sure thing after 3 appearances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBlueArrington Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 Not true. Saw a stat during yesterday's game that said the Yankees' team ERA is higher post All Star break than it was prior to the break. The difference is, the Yankees are scoring 7+ runs a game. And Joba may have been lights out for one night, but putting a rookie in an important role at this time of the season is a risky propostion. I still think Phillips is a moron though. One night? Try everytime he's been out there. I say about 3 appearances so far. Sheesh, you guys just throw crqap out there just to see what sticks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBlueArrington Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 Because he struck out a few Orioles? WTF? That MUST be the only game you watched. And correct me if I'm wrong, it was the heart of the order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakeMeSomeFoodHo Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 When Joe Smith first appeared, he was striking out 2 batters an inning. He was "lights out" for a little longer than 3 appearances. I'm not comparing the players, just giving an example of a rookie performing well until the league catches up. I hear you, but still, its not really a good example when these guys are night and day. Joba is a much better pitcher than Joe Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakeMeSomeFoodHo Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 and imagine in a few years when we have hughes, joba and ian kennedy taking the mound 2009 rotation should be Chamberlain, Hughes, Wang, Free Agent, Kennedy. With a pretty nasty bullpen of home grown/minor league guys like Mark Cougar Melancon, JB Cox and Humberto Sanchez, who will be the heir to Mo's throne. Possilby even Alan Horne can be in the mix as well. The you have Dellin Betances who should be not too far off by then, though I dont project seeing him before 2010...if he's up before then, that wont be good for many reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 i wouldn't be shocked if chamberlain is the future closer. his stuff seems more suited for a closer anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakeMeSomeFoodHo Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 i wouldn't be shocked if chamberlain is the future closer. his stuff seems more suited for a closer anyway If the Yankeed didnt have Humberto Sanchez, then Id agree. Sanchez will most likely be the next closer for the Yankees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 sanchez had tommy john this year right? i haven't heard anything about him in the minors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feefifoefum Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 One night? Try everytime he's been out there. I say about 3 appearances so far. Sheesh, you guys just throw crqap out there just to see what sticks. Of course , you intentionally miss the point, which was it might not be wise to throw a rookie into such an important role at such an important time of the season. That is, if that is even what the Yankees are intending to do. Joe Torre was quoted in today's DAILY NEWS as saying he doesn't want to pitch Chamberlain on consecutive days. Rookies are usually eased into things, not thrown into the fire in August. Even ones as heralded as this guy. He's not going to be unhittable forever, and eventually will have to adjust to big leaguers adjusting to him. Do you really want this to happen at the end of September? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakeMeSomeFoodHo Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 sanchez had tommy john this year right? i haven't heard anything about him in the minors yeah, the yankees knew that he would most likely need tj when they traded for him, but given his age and his power arm they still pulled the trigger. And many teams asked for him during the trade deadline so I guess cashman isnt the only one who thinks he's going to still be really good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feefifoefum Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 I hear you, but still, its not really a good example when these guys are night and day. Joba is a much better pitcher than Joe Smith. Like I said, I wasn't comparing them as players, just throwing that out there because he was dominant early on. No one is unhittable, and eventually, major leaguers will adjust to Chamberlain. Maybe that never happens, but it's not really the time to find out, is it? You guys are acting like this is not a common thing in baseball, and that this guy is a lock to be this good for the rest of the season based on 5 innings of major league experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakeMeSomeFoodHo Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 Like I said, I wasn't comparing them as players, just throwing that out there because he was dominant early on. No one is unhittable, and eventually, major leaguers will adjust to Chamberlain. Maybe that never happens, but it's not really the time to find out, is it? You guys are acting like this is not a common thing in baseball, and that this guy is a lock to be this good for the rest of the season based on 5 innings of major league experience. I understand what youre saying, nothing can be predetermined and its not the norm for teams to go with a rookie at this time in the scenario the Yankees are in. I can just take data from his minor league numbers and small major league stats and add that in with what Ive seen with my own eyes and project from that. This kid projects to be an ace. Coming from the 6 AL scouts, they said he has the best stuff in the American League. Now does that mean he wont get hit? Of course not, but it does mean something. All Im saying is that all things point to him being dominant for a long time rather than the opposite. If I were a betting man, which I am, id bet the house on Chamberlain being successful for the rest of the way. Does that mean he will post a 0.00 ERA the rest of the way? absolutely not, but he will dominate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feefifoefum Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 I understand what youre saying, nothing can be predetermined and its not the norm for teams to go with a rookie at this time in the scenario the Yankees are in. I can just take data from his minor league numbers and small major league stats and add that in with what Ive seen with my own eyes and project from that. This kid projects to be an ace. Coming from the 6 AL scouts, they said he has the best stuff in the American League. Now does that mean he wont get hit? Of course not, but it does mean something. All Im saying is that all things point to him being dominant for a long time rather than the opposite. If I were a betting man, which I am, id bet the house on Chamberlain being successful for the rest of the way. Does that mean he will post a 0.00 ERA the rest of the way? absolutely not, but he will dominate Even the greats usually struggle very early on, and that is the last thing the Yanks need right now, although I guess it's better than throwing Farnsworth out there when you need a big inning from your bullpen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 yeah, the yankees knew that he would most likely need tj when they traded for him, but given his age and his power arm they still pulled the trigger. And many teams asked for him during the trade deadline so I guess cashman isnt the only one who thinks he's going to still be really good. yeah i wasn't implying he wasn't goign to be good,i remember the hype about him when they made the sheffield trade. i just didn't remember ifhe got hurt ornot. i thought he was a starter too though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakeMeSomeFoodHo Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 yeah i wasn't implying he wasn't goign to be good,i remember the hype about him when they made the sheffield trade. i just didn't remember ifhe got hurt ornot. i thought he was a starter too though? he was a starter, but many felt he'd be better off as a closer and that was that, he is now a closer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K3VIN Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 I would take Mariano Rivera over any closer in baseball at any age, time or place. Man may not be what he was in 98 99, but he is so huge in the big game its not even close. sorry i think the game has cought up to rivera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxi-xxv Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 sorry i think the game has cought up to rivera good I am Omar Minaya, I love latin players, you are Brian Cashman, you think the "game has caught up to him" I trade you Billy Wagner, pay his contract and throw in a minor leaguer and you give me a the guy you think the "game has cught up to". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaginCaucasian Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 Steve Phillips is nothing more than another ESPN talking head, as a GM he wasn't terrible but if one of your highlights as a GM is getting Mo Vaughn it's safe to say that there is a reason why he and Dan Duquette are usually mentioned in the same sentance. As far as Chaimberlain goes it's blasphemous that any Mets fans are comparing him to Joe Smith, Smith was never as highly touted as Chaimberlain has been and while he might have been as effective early I fail to see how anyone that has seen Joba's stuff can't immediately see the difference between the two. Even if Joba stays in the bullpen he will be dominant, could you imagine the sort of dominance that you witnessed over the O's for 7 innings? I realize that he has only pitched 8 innings in the bigs but anyone that has that kind of dominance will only get better with more experience..... especially when he has worlds of talent around him to help tutor him like Rivera & Clemens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feefifoefum Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 Steve Phillips is nothing more than another ESPN talking head, as a GM he wasn't terrible but if one of your highlights as a GM is getting Mo Vaughn it's safe to say that there is a reason why he and Dan Duquette are usually mentioned in the same sentance. As far as Chaimberlain goes it's blasphemous that any Mets fans are comparing him to Joe Smith, Smith was never as highly touted as Chaimberlain has been and while he might have been as effective early I fail to see how anyone that has seen Joba's stuff can't immediately see the difference between the two. Even if Joba stays in the bullpen he will be dominant, could you imagine the sort of dominance that you witnessed over the O's for 7 innings? I realize that he has only pitched 8 innings in the bigs but anyone that has that kind of dominance will only get better with more experience..... especially when he has worlds of talent around him to help tutor him like Rivera & Clemens. He wasn't compared to Joe Smith!!! The Joe Smith comment was made to give Met fans in attendance a point of reference. Joe Smith was dominant in April and May. The numbers do not lie. Like many rookies, the league had caught up to him. Are you telling me this guy Chamberlain is so good, that major league batters will never adjust to him and start knocking him around at any point? Are you saying that he's better than almost every single pitcher in major league history, since it has happened to virtually all of them at some point early in their careers? It's a risky move to give this guy too much too soon in the thick of a pennant race. That's logical thinking, not blasphemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakeMeSomeFoodHo Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 He wasn't compared to Joe Smith!!! The Joe Smith comment was made to give Met fans in attendance a point of reference. Joe Smith was dominant in April and May. The numbers do not lie. Like many rookies, the league had caught up to him. Are you telling me this guy Chamberlain is so good, that major league batters will never adjust to him and start knocking him around at any point? Are you saying that he's better than almost every single pitcher in major league history, since it has happened to virtually all of them at some point early in their careers? It's a risky move to give this guy too much too soon in the thick of a pennant race. That's logical thinking, not blasphemy. no, but what we're saying is that more often than not, barring injury, he will dominate. He will have the occaisonal hiccup here and there but he will dominate. His slider makes Brad Lidge's slider look like Kyle Farnsworth's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandolphScott Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 no, but what we're saying is that more often than not, barring injury, he will dominate. He will have the occaisonal hiccup here and there but he will dominate. His slider makes Brad Lidge's slider look like Kyle Farnsworth's. Which makes sense because Lidge's slider for the better part of this year has been exactly like Farnsworth's. Flat and hittable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakeMeSomeFoodHo Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 Which makes sense because Lidge's slider for the better part of this year has been exactly like Farnsworth's. Flat and hittable. I honestly havent seen brad lidge throw one pitch this year, I was going by what Ive seen from him in the past...he had one of the nastiest sliders Ive ever seen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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