Eli, Rivers, or Big Ben?

[xxi-xxv]

that's a great line

 

It really is, I have always likes Weis, but if you are Coughlin and you hear that shit and think what you did to get BC going back in the early 90's, what you did in Jax and now in NY you would have to be pissed. Not to overrate Coughlin, but Weis should just shut the fuck up at this point.

[Herc]

i agree 100%. you can't talk about how you'd do a better job with another coach's player while that coach is on the hot seat, especially if you haven't even coached in the NFL.

[Ditto]

I would have been well satisfied with Rivers if we could have kept all of our picks and drafted wisely. You don't need a great qb to win, just a great team.

[Sephiroth]

I'd take Big Ben.

[randoff]

I'd take Big Ben.

None of the above!

 

Well let's say the Giants would have taken Ben. This Offense would have him throwing it 35-40 times a game and is Ben built for that? I say no...Ben is built to manage a game and complete 13-15 passes. Handing off to a RB doesn't make you better.

 

So I wouldn't take Ben for the Giants system. O coordinator would 'force' Ben to do shit that wasn't in Ben's comfort zone. Ben looks better handing the ball off and throwing 20 passes max.

[Sephiroth]

None of the above!

 

Well let's say the Giants would have taken Ben. This Offense would have him throwing it 35-40 times a game and is Ben built for that? I say no...Ben is built to manage a game and complete 13-15 passes. Handing off to a RB doesn't make you better.

 

So I wouldn't take Ben for the Giants system. O coordinator would 'force' Ben to do shit that wasn't in Ben's comfort zone. Ben looks better handing the ball off and throwing 20 passes max.

 

 

...size, arm strength, scrambling ability, and decision making are better than Eli or Rivers to this point.

 

I know fantasy football is largely bullshit... but every week Ben is putting up 25-40 points and Eli is hitting single digits (aside from week one, where Eli really lit it up).

[fringe]

In the games I watch, Ben looks pretty good with either game. Not that it matters, Eli is the guy we're going with.

Main thing he has to work on is accuracy. Also, when you let the play clock wind down under 2 seconds, defense is going to have a pretty good idea when the snap is coming. He's got to make his reads quicker or just go with the first play.

[Nesta]

...size, arm strength, scrambling ability, and decision making are better than Eli or Rivers to this point.

 

I know fantasy football is largely bullshit... but every week Ben is putting up 25-40 points and Eli is hitting single digits (aside from week one, where Eli really lit it up).

Whoo fantasy points. Jesus.

Ben would do no better in this offense. The few times he has to carry his team (throw more than 30 passes) he usually loses.

But hey, fantasy points are what matters in the end.

[Sephiroth]

Whoo fantasy points. Jesus.

Ben would do no better in this offense. The few times he has to carry his team (throw more than 30 passes) he usually loses.

But hey, fantasy points are what matters in the end.

 

No actually, you're right nesta. Eli is a WAY better quarterback then Ben... in every category... wins, super bowl victories, QB rating, and record as a starter.

[randoff]

...size, arm strength, scrambling ability, and decision making are better than Eli or Rivers to this point. .....but every week Ben is putting up 25-40 points and Eli is hitting single digits (aside from week one, where Eli really lit it up).

True!

 

And if we had a team like Pittsburgh we'd be consistent too. But like I said before QB is so important esp for us. Accuracy is an issue with Eli. Wobbly throws, overthrowing and underthrowing is a huge problem. I'm a D coordinator and all I have to do is disquise my blitzes, hurry Eli into a wobbly, off the wrong foot throw and I beat the Giants. Take away Toomer, blitz more than the Giants have to protect (to force Shockey to block) and we all know that Plax is the fly pattern guy(only) due to his ankle being hurt. Limits us in what we can do huh?

[Nesta]

No actually, you're right nesta. Eli is a WAY better quarterback then Ben... in every category... wins, super bowl victories, QB rating, and record as a starter.

 

Here you go being a little bitch again. Where did I just say that?

 

I said Ben would do no better in THIS OFFENSE. Ben averages about 15-20 pass attempts per game, and there's a reason for that. Ofcourse you wouldn't know that when you look at nothing but fantasy stats.

 

[Virginia Giant]

No actually, you're right nesta. Eli is a WAY better quarterback then Ben... in every category... wins, super bowl victories, QB rating, and record as a starter.

No offense, and i know this argument is tired. But esta has a point. Eli has been chucking the ball 40 times since he was a rookie. Ben has had a great defense to overcome his learning curve and to keep ben from having to put up 30 points per week.

 

 

 

I'm not taking anything away from Ben, but I whole heartedly believe if the roles were reversed, Eli would be thriving in Pit and Ben would be struggling here. Our play calling has never been a benefit to Eli.

[Clarence the Blue Puppet]

I personally think all 3 are highly overrated.

 

 

[randoff]

Eli has been chucking the ball 40 times since he was a rookie. Ben has had a great defense to overcome his learning curve and to keep ben from having to put up 30 points per week.

.....Eli would be thriving in Pit and Ben would be struggling here. Our play calling has never been a benefit to Eli.

So let's just say you had a chance to be an O coordinator to work with Eli. Would you have confidence in Eli making 15-20 accurate throws (instead of chucking it 40 times) knowing that Eli is a mechanical mess? Which types of plays would you have Eli making in the pass dept? I guess the question is, can u even trust Eli to throw an accurate pass to Shockey for 10 yds, or a pass to Smith for 11 yds 10 times a game???

[Clarence the Blue Puppet]

So let's just say you had a chance to be an O coordinator to work with Eli. Would you have confidence in Eli making 15-20 accurate throws (instead of chucking it 40 times) knowing that Eli is a mechanical mess? Which types of plays would you have Eli making in the pass dept? I guess the question is, can u even trust Eli to throw an accurate pass to Shockey for 10 yds, or a pass to Smith for 11 yds 10 times a game???

 

Was it me or did a lot of Eli's long passes seem to be under thrown? On more than one occasion it appeared that the receivers were waiting for the ball, only to drop it when it was thrown to them.

[Sephiroth]

I'm not taking anything away from Ben, but I whole heartedly believe if the roles were reversed, Eli would be thriving in Pit and Ben would be struggling here. Our play calling has never been a benefit to Eli.

 

See, that's what I disagree with. Watch Ben throw. His spiral is tight; his mechanics are good. His arm is a goddamned cannon, and he's accurate, especially on the deep ball. And his scrambling ability is totally underrated. He still makes the occasional dumb throw... but not four in a game.

 

We'll never know, but I don't think Eli would be putting up huge numbers in Pittsburgh, either.

[Sephiroth]

Here you go being a little bitch again. Where did I just say that?

 

I said Ben would do no better in THIS OFFENSE. Ben averages about 15-20 pass attempts per game, and there's a reason for that. Ofcourse you wouldn't know that when you look at nothing but fantasy stats.

 

I don't understand. By "being a little bitch," do you mean doing things, like... spending two hours digging up someone's posts to put in your sig?

 

And I know fantasy stats are meaningless; that's why I prefaced my comments with, "I know fantasy points are largely bullshit." It's obvious that the only stats that mean anything are the ones that compare Eli's career to John Elway's.

[randoff]

Was it me or did a lot of Eli's long passes seem to be under thrown? On more than one occasion it appeared that the receivers were waiting for the ball, only to drop it when it was thrown to them.

I saw that too. Hence do you think Burress, Toomer, and Shock trust Eli in getting it to them accurately? I don't.

 

...Eli scares me. Makes me so nervous watching him. Will we get this Eli next week or the same Eli who looked good vs the Falcons?

[Clarence the Blue Puppet]

I saw that too. Hence do you think Burress, Toomer, and Shock trust Eli in getting it to them accurately? I don't.

 

...Eli scares me. Makes me so nervous watching him. Will we get this Eli next week or the same Eli who looked good vs the Falcons?

 

So we got rid of one Kerry Collins for another.

[randoff]

So we got rid of one Kerry Collins for another.

Dunno yet? Who knows. But when do you start to say enough is enough IF Eli's mechanics, accuracy and desicion making doesn't improve? Do we give it 100 starts? Do we draft anothe rQB and put fire to Eli's ass? What to do.

[Sephiroth]

Do we draft anothe rQB and put fire to Eli's ass? What to do.

 

I said it last year and I'll say it again: we had better get Plan B ready just in case... cuz I don't think Jared Lorenzen and Anthony Wright exactly qualify as a "Plan B."

[gateb]

I said it last year and I'll say it again: we had better get Plan B ready just in case... cuz I don't think Jared Lorenzen and Anthony Wright exactly qualify as a "Plan B."

Wright and Lorenzen suck, I agree.

 

We should sign an under the radar UFA and work with him if we really feel that badly about Eli. I doubt that happens though.

[TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt]

In the games I watch, Ben looks pretty good with either game. Not that it matters, Eli is the guy we're going with.

Main thing he has to work on is accuracy. Also, when you let the play clock wind down under 2 seconds, defense is going to have a pretty good idea when the snap is coming. He's got to make his reads quicker or just go with the first play.

That is what I said last week....too much of these audibles in this complex system. Listening to it reminds me of Reeves outdated system with multiple calls and shifts. An experienced veteran QB who has seen everything (and overcome it) could pull it off.....but not someone of Eli's experience level at this point.

[Nesta]

I don't understand. By "being a little bitch," do you mean doing things, like... spending two hours digging up someone's posts to put in your sig?

 

And I know fantasy stats are meaningless; that's why I prefaced my comments with, "I know fantasy points are largely bullshit." It's obvious that the only stats that mean anything are the ones that compare Eli's career to John Elway's.

 

No no no. By 'being a little bitch' I mean putting words in my mouth to make your point. Where did I say that Eli is better than Ben?

 

If you know fantasy stats are meaningless, why even bring it up? Let's talk about Madden stats while we're at it.

 

Maybe for someone who's computer challenged like yourself, my sig would take hours, but it took me 10 minutes. It took you two or three weeks to force it down everyone's throat.

[Sephiroth]

Where did I say that Eli is better than Ben?

 

Ben would do no better in this offense

 

I think it was there... good thing I wasn't to "computer illiterate" to find it. Whew!