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Camp Thoughts


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i think we're just going to line up one of our 2 fb's at the TE spot

 

 

actually reading updates from training camp so far (i know, only a few days) the tight ends were moving into the fb spot often.

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Snee is done. Now it's his elbow. Great Giants career but his body has had it.

 

Anyone who thinks we're getting better than shit play out of Beatty can take a look at this bridge I'm selling. He was arguably the WORST LT in football before his injury, and breaking his leg is going to ensure he's in even worse shape this offseason. The team can compensate a bit by leaving backs in to chip or putting the TE on his side but we're in real trouble at that spot.

 

Early reports say Nassib still looks terrible. He's a wasted pick.

 

The good news is that the Giants pro player department is light years better than their scouting department, and we picked up a ton of free agents that we should get good play from.

 

 

Hard to argue with any of this.

 

Only good news about Beatty is that there are new additions to the line who can reshuffle to get his ass off the field if needed.

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actually reading updates from training camp so far (i know, only a few days) the tight ends were moving into the fb spot often.

 

that is interesting as hell. almost makes me want to go to training camp to watch

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I've never heard more conflicting reports on one player then with Nassib. One report says nobody has improved more from rookie to sophomore year then Nassib and another report says he is the worst QB to ever don a Giants uniform.

I noticed that as well.

 

Giants.com wrote the other day that "Nassib picked up where he left off in the spring where he had a strong mini camp."

 

Well, if you consider tossing 3 picks in a practice a "strong" camp, that's not very encouraging.

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I noticed that as well.

 

Giants.com wrote the other day that "Nassib picked up where he left off in the spring where he had a strong mini camp."

 

Well, if you consider tossing 3 picks in a practice a "strong" camp, that's not very encouraging.

That's the article I read. When I read the first part that he "picked up where he left off," I was like oh shit...because by all accounts I seen about him in the spring is that he looked awful and might not even make the team. You got remember Giants.com is very homerish too and so are most beat writers.
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I've never heard more conflicting reports on one player then with Nassib. One report says nobody has improved more from rookie to sophomore year then Nassib and another report says he is the worst QB to ever don a Giants uniform.

 

This is what I've seen, too. It's hard to tell even with seeing him, because he's stuck learning his second pro offense in two years. If Manning is still nervous, imagine what this kid is going through.

 

And if you're going to throw INTs, practice is the time to do it. Learn from the mistakes when the points don't count.

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that is interesting as hell. almost makes me want to go to training camp to watch

 

 

If we go into another season lining backup offensive lineman up at the tight end position I'm going throw a shit fit.

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That's the article I read. When I read the first part that he "picked up where he left off," I was like oh shit...because by all accounts I seen about him in the spring is that he looked awful and might not even make the team. You got remember Giants.com is very homerish too and so are most beat writers.

 

From the Star Ledger:

 

"• After a rough afternoon the previous day, backup quarterback Ryan Nassib's first pass in 11-on-11 drills was batted back in his face by defensive end Mathias Kiwanuka. Nassib again looked uninspiring, often holding onto the ball too long in the pocket.

 

On one play, Nassib rolled out left and had Mario Manningham open on a comeback route near the sideline. Nassib didn't pull the trigger and held onto the ball for a good five seconds before throwing an awkward jump-pass to tight end Kellen Davis. Nassib still has plenty of room for improvement. He has a tendency to throw an inordinate amount of wobblers, too."

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From the Star Ledger:

 

" After a rough afternoon the previous day, backup quarterback Ryan Nassib's first pass in 11-on-11 drills was batted back in his face by defensive end Mathias Kiwanuka. Nassib again looked uninspiring, often holding onto the ball too long in the pocket.

 

On one play, Nassib rolled out left and had Mario Manningham open on a comeback route near the sideline. Nassib didn't pull the trigger and held onto the ball for a good five seconds before throwing an awkward jump-pass to tight end Kellen Davis. Nassib still has plenty of room for improvement. He has a tendency to throw an inordinate amount of wobblers, too."

Honest reporting is great

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actually reading updates from training camp so far (i know, only a few days) the tight ends were moving into the fb spot often.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Giants looking into roster that won't contain a fullback

 

 

The Giants’ tight ends have lined up in the slot and tightly against the offensive line this summer. They have motioned into a standing position behind the guard and they have pushed out wide like a traditional wide receiver.

But they have also migrated into the backfield where a fullback traditionally plays. They have been learning how to block like a fullback and hit like one, too. It’s an adjustment that forces the tight end to line up their intended target from 5 yards away instead of having a defender draped over them as soon as the ball is snapped.

Both veteran free agents signed by the team this offseason — Kellen Davis (Seahawks) and Daniel Fells (New England) — have done it before. Larry Donnell, who experimented at the position during camp in 2013, and Adrien Robinson have been asked to learn the new wrinkle as well.

“It’s definitely different,” Fells said. “If you’ve never done it before, it’s kind of a little bit of an uncomfortable position. You’re coming from the backfield and you’re used to being in-line or flexed out. So just coming from a different angle and coming downhill, now you’re going against a linebacker that is 5 or 6 yards away from you.

“He’s got a head start, too. So you have to have a different mentality.”

The flex positioning allows the Giants plenty of different options on offense, but it also might save them a roster spot, too.

According to multiple people within the organization who requested anonymity in order to speak freely on the matter, the Giants have informed their tight ends that there is a good possibility that a fullback won’t make the final 53-man roster — leaving all of those duties up to the tight ends. Though injuries, personnel shifts and observances in the preseason could change the team’s plans, they entered the year hoping to keep their best four tight ends and give themselves some options on cut-down day.

The idea, which was relayed to players earlier this year during the Giants’ organized team activity, makes sense given that John Conner and Henry Hynoski left for the summer break with only a hazy idea of how they might fit into the offense. Though both have seen snaps during the first week of training camp — Conner even took a handoff Friday — there is a growing uncertainty around new offensive coordinator Ben McAdoo’s preference with the position.

“We mix,” McAdoo said last month just before the break. “We’re in and out of personnel groups and those types of things at this point. You like to use the fullback. The way I was raised, a fullback’s a big part of the things you do. Henry and John have both done a nice job so far.”

Imagining a Tom Coughlin team without a hard-nosed presence at fullback is difficult to do, though it’s more a reflection of the offensive evolution around the NFL. Some scouts around the league believe that the league will eventually retreat back into a run-heavy offenses that emphasize ball control, but for now, bolstering options in the passing game make the most sense.

Neither Conner nor Hynoski has the same hands and height as any of the team’s tight end options. Spending a crucial roster spot on a player that doesn’t have the ability to split out during an audible and be a credible receiving threat makes little sense.

Using the tight end as a fullback would also help explain why the Giants won’t be in any hurry to establish a pecking order at the position. The team’s first unofficial depth chart listed Larry Donnell as the starter in front of Fells, Xavier Grimble, Davis and Robinson in that order, but Fells and Davis have been the first two tight ends on the field each of the last two practices.

“We don’t have to rush into anything,” Coughlin said this week. “With five preseason games and then hopefully throughout the course of the five preseason games we will have all the information we need.”

That information will hinge on how the experiment fleshes out in the preseason. Davis and Fells said the most difficult adjustment to being a fullback is the height difference. Davis is every bit of 6-6, and no other tight end is shorter than 6-4. They are forced to bend lower at the point of contact while maintaining enough balance to handle a bevy of finesse moves from oncoming linebackers and ends.

“It’s mostly footwork and aiming points,” Davis said.

To help, offensive line coach Pat Flaherty said he’s been in constant discussions with tight ends coach Kevin M. Gilbride. The two talk about, and constantly drill the same fundamentals that his guards and tackles go through. Though this is routine procedure for tight ends, it could take on a new meaning if the Giants decide to cut bait with the fullback altogether.

From Jim Finn to Madison Hedgecock to Hynoski and Conner, Coughlin has never done without one.

 

http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2014/07/giants_experimenting_with_roster_that_wont_contain_a_fullback.html

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I still think they carry one.

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man that is weird as hell. they have the 3rd best value at fb last season, bring in another guy for a guaranteed 250k and 1 mil if he makes the roster, then talk about not carrying anybody

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I think it won't matter. Remember the 53 man roster is just who you go into week 1 with, and sometimes not even that. The roster turns over quickly throughout the season. So the Giants could cut both Conner and Hynoski and one or the other (though highly unlikely both) could be back on the roster in week 2, depending on injuries and performance.

 

Because of the lack of demand around the league for the fullback position, it's conceivable that if the Giants think that a couple of their tight ends can do the job, or even a player like Kendall Gaskins or Peyton Hillis... then they could cut the fullbacks and still have a very good chance of one of them being available a short time later to re-sign.

 

Personally, I like both Hynoski and Conner as football players, but we also haven't seen a lot of what our tight ends can do, and there are only so many spots. I'm really rooting for Robinson, Grimble, or Donnell to really break out into a big time threat. I think we know what Fells and Davis are at this point... pretty much fringe players, not guys you want to count on as key cogs in an offense.

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I was at camp today... As much I miss Albany you are so much closer to the action in the shadow of giants stadium.

 

They started early today going through some plays at about half speed against set defenses. Looked like a drill to have qb go through the reads. Sometimes there was not even a pass. Even on an ugly flea flicker with cruise all alone down field. My first impression of 44 Andre Williams is he is a thick strong looking back. Did not look tall but I imagine he must be quite a load to tackle.

 

A lot of time was spent on punts. 15 holiday seemed to be taking the most of them and he had at least one muff and a couple less then sure handed grabs. Cruz, Wilson and one other were taking turns including some one handed.

 

In the 11-11 drills the offense seemed to be having their way with the d. Probably because of limited contact on receivers or backs but Eli was looking pretty sharp.

 

They all headed into the building and we went to autograph area just to find that it was already full and I could not get my kids in there. Eli was signing today and I think people skipped practice to be in autograph pit. So we left. Not sure if the players came back out but I drank a beer in the lot and still beat the traffic out.

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3 players who had big practices when the pads came on yesterday:

 

 

QB Eli Manning

With the first preseason game one week away for the Giants, coach Tom Coughlin was asked about the progress of the new offense, saying it’s “two steps forward and one back.” Eli Manning took one of those steps forward today at training camp, opening up with a sharp drive at practice. Later on in 1-on-1 and 7-on-7 drills, Manning was also on point, completing strong passes to his wide receivers. “The more we can stay together, keep people healthy, and keep working; small gains, as I say,” Coughlin said. “It’ll come. There were parts of this drill today that were very good.”

WR Victor Cruz
Cruz made the top offensive play of the day and did so against top competition in safety Antrel Rolle and slot cornerback Walter Thurmond III. Against tight coverage, Cruz created enough of an opening for Manning to find him close to the sideline, where the wide receiver made a diving catch. Cruz also connected with Manning during 7-on-7 drills for a quality day offensively.

FB Henry Hynoski
No one is ever more eager to put full pads on than a fullback. That’s how players at that position make their living, and Hynoski played liked it. Competing with Jon Conner this summer, Hynoski paved the way for some long runs today at the Quest Diagnostics Training Center. And whenever you heard a good pop in a pile of players, Hynoski was in the middle of it more times than not. “They’re both physical and move you out of the hole,” coach Tom Coughlin said of Hynoski and Conner. “They both had some carries the other day and did well with it. I think we’ll be okay there.”

 

 

 

http://www.giants.com/news-and-blogs/article-1/Which-players-stood-out-at-practice-727/d9c81ccd-717b-42be-a71c-bcd0631fb794

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I'm hearing OBJ is already in Coughlin's doghouse. I'm guessing he'll get about 30 targets a year?

 

Not in his doghouse but I guess he's been in the injured doghouse with his hammy a few times since OTAs have started.

 

I seriously don't understand what it is about the Giants and newly drafted WRs getting their hamstrings hurt, do they fucking make them put on a weighted vest and run flights of stairs all day?

 

Someone give Nas's yoga card to the strength and conditioning team.

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I've never heard more conflicting reports on one player then with Nassib. One report says nobody has improved more from rookie to sophomore year then Nassib and another report says he is the worst QB to ever don a Giants uniform.

Wow, there's a pretty high bar of ineptitude that one would need to climb to lay that claim.
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Not in his doghouse but I guess he's been in the injured doghouse with his hammy a few times since OTAs have started.

 

I seriously don't understand what it is about the Giants and newly drafted WRs getting their hamstrings hurt, do they fucking make them put on a weighted vest and run flights of stairs all day?

 

Someone give Nas's yoga card to the strength and conditioning team.

I guess the problem is he's been working with his own doctor's and he didn't come to camp in the shape they thought he'd be in.

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