mastershake Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 The modern game still needs to run the ball in the redzone, something we were pitiful at last season. If it's that obvious of a running situation we have Tye and Adams as well. How about a TE that can jump and catch in the red zone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 If it's that obvious of a running situation we have Tye and Adams as well. How about a TE that can jump and catch in the red zone? Well Larry Donnell is a free agent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K3VIN Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 I hope I am wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted May 2, 2017 Author Share Posted May 2, 2017 The point about LBs is partially true... only partially because I believe Keenan Robinson was a solid and consistent starter for us at LB. Casillas and Kennard are meh, to your point. I still don't get the point about the 2nd blocking TE being a need. In the modern game, power sets like that are a rarity, and we already have one blocking TE. The bigger threat and factor is having a great receiving TE who's adaqeute at blocking, and can stay on the field all three downs to create mismatches and keep defenses off balance. I'm not saying we need a second blocking TE, I'm saying we need a complete two-way TE. Power sets like that might be a rarity, but the Patriots have employed it to great effect this year and in years past. Adams may develop into that guy, but I'd personally like another guy like that over a "blocking TE" or a "receiving TE." There were two-way players to be had all over the draft but it seems like we took specialists. They might still be nice players but I'll take a well rounded, 3-down player over a guy that's great at one thing any day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 I'm not saying we need a second blocking TE, I'm saying we need a complete two-way TE. Power sets like that might be a rarity, but the Patriots have employed it to great effect this year and in years past. Adams may develop into that guy, but I'd personally like another guy like that over a "blocking TE" or a "receiving TE." There were two-way players to be had all over the draft but it seems like we took specialists. They might still be nice players but I'll take a well rounded, 3-down player over a guy that's great at one thing any day. I believe they are still operating under that idea they can teach blocking yet a natural pass catcher is something you must draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted May 2, 2017 Author Share Posted May 2, 2017 I believe they are still operating under that idea they can teach blocking yet a natural pass catcher is something you must draft. Maybe... but honestly? The ass block is something innate within you. It can't be taught. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 Antonio Garcia was taken two picks before Webb and the next tackle after that was Julie'n Davenport both those guys were not going to be an instant upgrade to the Oline and would have just added another project for Solari. I didn't think Bolles was an upgrade over Flowers, one positive with Flowers is he's only 23 that's two younger than Bolles and Bolles has one year of D1 experience. Ramcyzk has the hip and same thing he's older with one year D1 starting experience. Johnson you could of made a case for who went in round 4, but they seem set at guard and he has some thing with his liver that caused him to drop. So I agree there wasn't a lineman worth taking My mock: 2. Dion Dawkins, G/OT, Temple I'm happy with the DT we got though... either way would've been fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigblue25 Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 My mock: 2. Dion Dawkins, G/OT, Temple I'm happy with the DT we got though... either way would've been fine. Yep would of taken Dawkins over Tomlinson and found the DT later because I thought gap between offensive line was bigger than defensive tackle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 Yep would of taken Dawkins over Tomlinson and found the DT later because I thought gap between offensive line was bigger than defensive tackle Yea but I can see why the Giants wanted to keep the D top notch... and my guess is Tomlinson was the more talented player... not harm in either direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K3VIN Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 My only real problem with BAMA players is they are so well coached, they tend to be what they are. Tomlinson will contribute early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 My only real problem with BAMA players is they are so well coached, they tend to be what they are. Tomlinson will contribute early. That sounds awful. Do you think we can give the pick back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 That sounds awful. Do you think we can give the pick back? JR doesnt draft good players anyways so whats the point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 My only real problem with BAMA players is they are so well coached, they tend to be what they are. Tomlinson will contribute early. I'm not so sure you can paint such a broad brush...Landon Collins was clearly a better player in his second year compared with his first. Other players who noticeably improved include: Ha-Ha Clinton Dix, Donte Hightower, and Marcell Dareus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigblue25 Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 1st - in a draft deep at TE, I wouldn't have taken a one-dimensional TE in the 1st. I'd have taken Forrest Lamp, Kevin King, or Ruben Foster if I was feeling lucky... Taylor and Lewis both had issues too and that turned out pretty well... hell, Burfict has issues and is light years ahead of our best LB. All three of those guys shore up a weakness and are good players. 2nd - passing Cunningham here is just absolutely fucking inexcusable. I can't wrap my head around it. I'd have also been ok with Dawkins or Moton. But if you can get a three down MLB that's going to be the QB of your defense at this pick, you fucking take him. BJ Goodson can be your backup and we finally get rid of Mark Herzlich. 3rd Samanje Perine. You want more physical? You got more physical. I'd also be ok with Dorian Johnson if there had been no OL to this point. 4th - George Kittle. Probably the best all around TE in this draft, and definitely the best blocker. Does three things good instead of one thing great. 5th Caleb Brantley. Go fucking crazy and take a chance. We rehabilitated Kerry Collins, Christian Peter, etc. Take a shot with an actual 3-technique. So my perfect draft would have been: Lamp (need... could shore up RT or RG) Cunningham (holy fucking need and an actual three down player) Perine (physical) Kittle (physical AND need) Brantley (physical and need) I think that would have given us a well rounded team that can do more than run 11 personnel every snap. I know BiC and others have said that's not the MacAdoo way and he's right, but getting a yard on third-and-one is never going to go out of style. Running out the clock with a four point lead will always be important. I think Engram will be a nice player but I don't think we needed more finesse on the team,and again, I'm not really sure what these guys bring that we either really needed or didn't already have. But is OT or LB really positions that put a team over the top especially sincd the Giants don't value either this Gilbride's 12 step drop offense where guys have to hold blocks for 30 seconds. I mean ask Cleveland what having the best left tackle in the NFL does for them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted May 4, 2017 Author Share Posted May 4, 2017 But is OT or LB really positions that put a team over the top especially sincd the Giants don't value either this Gilbride's 12 step drop offense where guys have to hold blocks for 30 seconds. I mean ask Cleveland what having the best left tackle in the NFL does for them Yes. The O-line is a collosal gamble this season. Pugh and Richburg are good but not great players,and everyone else is below average. If something happens to 37-year-old Eli,this season is over. Ask Dallas what having the best O-line did for them last season. They started two rookies at arguably the two most important positions on offense and still won 13 games. Our LB unit is adequate at best, and I'm probably being generous. No real playmakers in the entire unit. A three down MLB shores up your entire defense for the next four years. The Ray Lewises and Mike Singletarys of the league controlled offenses more than the Warren Sapps and Cortez Kennedys did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 Guess it shows how they viewed the o linemen in this draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandolphScott Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 My only real problem with BAMA players is they are so well coached, they tend to be what they are. Tomlinson will contribute early. Yes. Julio Jones, Amari Cooper, Landon Collins are all mediocre players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K3VIN Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Yes. Julio Jones, Amari Cooper, Landon Collins are all mediocre players. did I say mediocre? Did I say it was absolutely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Yes. The O-line is a collosal gamble this season. Pugh and Richburg are good but not great players,and everyone else is below average. If something happens to 37-year-old Eli,this season is over. Ask Dallas what having the best O-line did for them last season. They started two rookies at arguably the two most important positions on offense and still won 13 games. Our LB unit is adequate at best, and I'm probably being generous. No real playmakers in the entire unit. A three down MLB shores up your entire defense for the next four years. The Ray Lewises and Mike Singletarys of the league controlled offenses more than the Warren Sapps and Cortez Kennedys did. Every team has weaknesses... it's really a pick-your-poison kindda deal. The OL is a unit that works well when everyone is adequate.... not necessarily pro bowlers... Remember the O'Hara, Richie, and McKenzie OL? None of those guys were superstars but they played well together. Erick Flowers might've regressed last year but it didn't help that our OL coaching sucks... and he wasn't given any help which I'm pretty sure fucked with his psyche quite a bit. I think Flowers will come on strong this upcoming season and it's not like the FO didn't get more bodies in there... Look at what ODB did for our O... he not Eli is the reason we had a good season... now we added Brandon Marshall and now Engram... We just need our OL to be a little bit better than last year which we have every indication it will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Every team has weaknesses... it's really a pick-your-poison kindda deal. The OL is a unit that works well when everyone is adequate.... not necessarily pro bowlers... Remember the O'Hara, Richie, and McKenzie OL? None of those guys were superstars but they played well together. Erick Flowers might've regressed last year but it didn't help that our OL coaching sucks... and he wasn't given any help which I'm pretty sure fucked with his psyche quite a bit. I think Flowers will come on strong this upcoming season and it's not like the FO didn't get more bodies in there... Look at what ODB did for our O... he not Eli is the reason we had a good season... now we added Brandon Marshall and now Engram... We just need our OL to be a little bit better than last year which we have every indication it will. Really looking forward to reading the posts on QB play when Eli isn't calling plays, protections and throwing the ball in five years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Really looking forward to reading the posts on QB play when Eli isn't calling plays, protections and throwing the ball in five years. I'll be around... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted May 5, 2017 Author Share Posted May 5, 2017 Every team has weaknesses... it's really a pick-your-poison kindda deal. The OL is a unit that works well when everyone is adequate.... not necessarily pro bowlers... Remember the O'Hara, Richie, and McKenzie OL? None of those guys were superstars but they played well together. Erick Flowers might've regressed last year but it didn't help that our OL coaching sucks... and he wasn't given any help which I'm pretty sure fucked with his psyche quite a bit. I think Flowers will come on strong this upcoming season and it's not like the FO didn't get more bodies in there... Look at what ODB did for our O... he not Eli is the reason we had a good season... now we added Brandon Marshall and now Engram... We just need our OL to be a little bit better than last year which we have every indication it will. Not for nothing Nas, but this line can't hold the O'hara line's jock straps. That had five solid-to-Pro-Bowl-caliber players. This line has maybe one. Diehl, O'hara, and Snee all made multiple Pro Bowls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GA4M Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Plus we had a running game back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Not for nothing Nas, but this line can't hold the O'hara line's jock straps. That had five solid-to-Pro-Bowl-caliber players. This line has maybe one. Diehl, O'hara, and Snee all made multiple Pro Bowls. Funny thing about offensive lines is they can get better with small changes. Then all of a sudden it looks like an offensive line with pro bowlers from end to end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Funny thing about offensive lines is they can get better with small changes. Then all of a sudden it looks like an offensive line with pro bowlers from end to end. All it took was McKenzie to swing the line from "It's getting Collins/Warned killed" to "Holy fuck Tiki just had another 200 yard game" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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