Welcome to the Giants

[Sephiroth]

Lawson, Hargraves, Lee, Coleman, Rankins, etc, etc, etc.

 

We got;

 

Eli "Dont call him sauce" Apple.

 

Mute the sound...holy fuck people call that music.....

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5jCD0O71x8

 

 

Honestly.....I dont see anything we didnt already have on the team.

 

Gonna take three or four years before he's a starter.

 

Webster 2.0 hopefully.

 

I love how his one pick of the season was a ball that was literally thrown right to his gut.

 

This is really encouraging.

[BlueInCanada]

SO after being in a glass case of emtion last night

 

 

 

I've had time to think about the pick.

 

He's obviously a first round talent, but he wont be a day one starter which is what kind of disapoints me about the pick. He will be used in Spags system as the nickle corner but he isnt known for his tackling so they will still have to bring Collins down into the box.

 

I think this is a Webster 2.0 situation, the kid has a LOT of disappointing plays on tape, but it's because he's only 20 and needs more reps. After a few seasons in the NFL this guy is going to be a starting #1 corner or a bust.

 

Like I said I'm just more disappointed in the fact the Giants could of gotten an IMMEDIATE starter elsewhere.

 

But happy we got insurance for when DRC,Jenkins,whoever goes down on IR or leaves in a few years.

[Mr. P]

SO after being in a glass case of emtion last night

 

 

 

I've had time to think about the pick.

 

He's obviously a first round talent, but he wont be a day one starter which is what kind of disapoints me about the pick. He will be used in Spags system as the nickle corner but he isnt known for his tackling so they will still have to bring Collins down into the box.

 

I think this is a Webster 2.0 situation, the kid has a LOT of disappointing plays on tape, but it's because he's only 20 and needs more reps. After a few seasons in the NFL this guy is going to be a starting #1 corner or a bust.

 

Like I said I'm just more disappointed in the fact the Giants could of gotten an IMMEDIATE starter elsewhere.

 

But happy we got insurance for when DRC,Jenkins,whoever goes down on IR or leaves in a few years.

I read this morning, 2 stats, 65% or 60%, that's the amount of time teams play in the nickel. 3rd cornerback is a starter nowadays and plays more than most linebackers do.

[BlueInCanada]

I read this morning, 2 stats, 65% or 60%, that's the amount of time teams play in the nickel. 3rd cornerback is a starter nowadays and plays more than most linebackers do.

 

And even then I think Collins or a FA pickup will be playing there more THIS season then Apple will.

[Mr. P]

 

THE NFL DRAFT REPORT PRESENTS COMPARING THE 2015 STATISTICAL PERFORMANCES OF THE TOP CORNERBACKS ELIGIBLE FOR THE 2016 NFL DRAFT

While most fans relate the success of a cornerback to the amount of interceptions he is able to record, there is a lot more that goes into developing the complete cornerback. Operating out on an island, they must be able to handle man coverage assignments, along with showing the ability to switch off assignments when utilized in zone coverage. Most NFL teams require big, fast defensive backs, as the league continues to develop tight end-sized receivers to stretch the field.

One other critical factor teams look for in an elite cornerback is his ability to come into the box and support vs. the run. At The NFL Draft Report, we feel that potential is a “nice” word, but we prefer our athletes to perform. Most teams recognize five defensive backs in the draft class that are worthy of first round consideration. One – Jalen Ramsey, is also receiving serious consideration for the top overall pick currently held by the Tennessee Titans.

Since the inception of the NFL Draft in 1936, only one defensive back has ever been selected first overall. Gary Galen Glick played seven seasons in the National Football League as a safety after he was taken with the first overall selection in the 1956 NFL Draft by the Pittsburgh Steelers out of Colorado State University, where he starred as a quarterback. In 71 NFL games, he recorded fourteen interceptions. After he retired, he served as head coach for the Norfolk Neptunes and then the Montreal Alouettes before becoming an NFL scout.

Nicknamed "E-Rock" by his teammates during his days at UCLA, Eric Turner drew comparisons to former Bruins great Don Rogers. He was the second overall pick in the 1991 NFL Draft—the highest choice for a defensive back in football's modern era (technically the highest since Jerry Stovall in 1963). The safety played for the Cleveland Browns, the Baltimore Ravens and the Oakland Raiders. He died of intestinal cancer at the age of 31, two weeks after claiming he was not gravely ill.

Two defensive backs were selected with the second choice in their respective drafts, but both Jerry Stovall (1963 by the St. Louis Cardinals) and Eric Turner (1991 by Cleveland), but they spent the bulk of their time playing safety. Stovall collected eighteen interceptions in nine seasons and Turner was a Pro Bowl performer who snatched thirty balls through 105 starting assignments.

In 1959, Billy Stacy was the third selection in that draft by the Chicago Cardinals and four other defensive backs would hear their names called with the third choice during their draft sessions. Stacy only played four seasons, but his resume shows that he had twenty interceptions to his credit.

Louisiana State’s Johnny Robinson was taken by Detroit in 1960, but he was one of the biggest signings by the young American Football League when he joined the Dallas Texans. The safety had led LSU to the national championship in 1958. Playing for the AFL’s Dallas Texans–Kansas City Chiefs, he led the league in interceptions with 10 in 1966 and 1970, and 58 for his career, a team record.

Philadelphia used the third pick in 1969 to take Purdue’s Leroy Keyes. He competed as a running back and safety during his five seasons in the National Football League, playing for the Eagles and the Kansas City Chiefs. He was an All-American as a halfback on offense and played cornerback on defense, in addition to returning kicks and punts. He also played both ways for Philadelphia before settling in as a solid strong safety.

Miami Hurricanes safety Bennie Blades joined the Detroit Lions via the third selection in the 1988 draft. He went on to earn NFL All-Rookie honors for the 1988 season and was selected to the Pro Bowl in 1991 - in addition to receiving first-team All-NFL and First-team All-NFC honors. He was the Lions’ Defensive MVP in 1992 and led the team with 132 tackles in 1996, which was one of three 100-tackle seasons he had in Detroit.

An underrated professional player, Blades was a key component to the Lions’ defense that helped the team claim two NFC Central titles, and a berth in the 1991 NFC Championship game. He was a defensive captain for five years in Detroit and his 815 career tackles place him second on the Lions’ all-time list.

The earliest a pure cornerback was drafted came when Atlanta used the third pick in 1991 to lure Nebraska’s Bruce Pickens to the pro ranks. He played cornerback for four seasons for Atlanta, Green Bay, Kansas City and Oakland Raiders. Deemed a bust, he started just nine of the games that he appeared in and registered just two interceptions. When he was selected, the New York Times draft assessment of the cornerback noted, "A junior-college transfer who hasn't been exposed to top passing offenses and is somewhat raw in overall development.”

Springs was drafted third overall by the Seattle Seahawks in the 1997 NFL Draft. He started 10 games in his rookie season, recording one interception. Springs was selected to the 1999 Pro Bowl in his second season in the NFL, after starting all sixteen games, and recorded 76 tackles, seven interceptions, and two defensive touchdowns. He started every game of his next two seasons in Seattle, recording five interceptions in 1999 and two in 2000. He later signed with Washington before concluding his career with the New England Patriots

In 1997, the Seattle Seahawks selected Ohio State’s Shawn Springs with the third overall choice. The son of former NFL running back Ron Springs, Shawn played thirteen years as a cornerback in the NFL. The Buckeyes All-American played professionally for the Seahawks, Washington and New England Patriots. A Pro Bowl selection in 1998, he appeared in a total of 169 games, recording 682 tackles (592 solos) with 8.5 sacks, five forced fumbles, 138 pass deflections and 33 interceptions that he returned 429 yards with two touchdowns.

The current 2016 NFL Draft Cornerback Class includes Florida State’s Jalen Ramsey, rated the best player in the draft at any position by The NFL Draft Report. Ramsey hopes to be the first cornerback taken with the top pick in the draft, but several teams desiring his services also feel that he might be a better performer at safety in the NFL.

For this statistical study, The NFL Draft Report took the 2015 season performances by Ramsey, matching it to the four cornerbacks that are regarded as first round prospects. Using their 2015 statistics, this report also features Clemson’s Mackensie Alexander, Ohio State’s Eli Apple, Florida’s Vernon Hargreaves III and Houston’s William Jackson III.

Ohio State's Eli Apple is being targeted by several cornerback-needy teams in the first round. With their recent success in taking Buckeyes in the opening round (Cameron Heyward and Ryan Shazier), could Pittsburgh reach out to Columbus, Ohio in 2016?

Do not be enamored with a defender’s interception totals, as that category is just the “glamour” part of a cornerback’s game. Pass deflections fall right behind interceptions, as they are the two most noticeable positive aspects teams look for in a playmaking performer in the secondary.

However, there are cautionary flags that do not appear in the usual statistics charts that this report will feature, particularly the amount of receptions yielded by a defender vs. the amount of passes targeted into his area. One other key area to look at is the IC category, as this shows the player’s success in jamming or rerouting receivers away from the ball.

Florida's Vernon Hargreaves III might have deflected 28 passes and intercepted ten others during his career, but teams not only need to look into his lack of ability in run support, but closely examine his poor performances vs. Mississippi, LSU and Michigan last season

As you will also notice, just two of these five defensive backs have any sort of “pedigree” in run support. With more teams requiring their corners to be efficient playing in the box, unless a team has a physical boundary cornerback already in place, Alexander, Hargreaves III and Jackson III have big deficiencies playing vs. the run – some due to lack of reps, others due to defensive scheme and in a case or two, perhaps a lack of courage.

Houston's William Jackson III might have led the nation with 28 passes defended in 2013 (23 break-ups, 5 thefts), but he was targeted often (93 times) by opponents and was tagged for 41 receptions in 2015

To compile this “report card,” I examine each athlete’s performance in categories listed below. The statistics are based on average for games played only;

NOTE...While Hargreaves III and Jackson III had success as pass thieves, their penchant for attacking the ball, rather than staying close on man coverage assignments resulted in a high amount of passes being completed vs. them. While Ramsey and Apple were not ball thieves, they were highly effective in containing the assignments to minimal gains, evident by their low average yields per pass completion/attempt.

NOTE...Ramsey's ability as a run stuffer is why teams are strongly considering him for safety chores. Apple was also highly effective in shutting down the outside running game. For Jackson III, he was sort of the "Where's Waldo" when it came to run support. He did not make his first tackle in run support until the seventh game on the 2016 schedule and three of his five tackles vs. ball carriers did not come until the final two appearances on Houston's 14-game schedule. For Hargreaves III, he had two tackles vs. the run in the season opener that included a 30-yard gain on one carry by New Mexico State, but made just two more stops vs. the run in his final ten contests.

NOTE...Eli Apple and Jalen Ramsey kept the opponent to a minimum when it came to first down success, but the gambling coverage style by both Hargreaves III and Jackson III led to a high amount of big plays vs. them. Hargreaves III allowed seven receptions vs. Mississippi, 106 yards and a touchdown vs. LSU and then was torched for another big score vs. Michigan. Jackson III allowed at least four receptions in seven of his thirteen appearances that included just a cameo show vs. Navy. In his last four starting assignments, he was charged with 22 receptions for 252 yards. He did set a school record by deflecting seven passes vs. Temple, but it was obvious that opposing quarterbacks felt that they could target his area often (93 targets).

Using our scoring statements for each category, Ohio State's Eli Apple has shown why this "flying under the radar" cornerback is starting to get so much attention from NFL teams as draft day approaches.

 

 

http://nfldraftreport.sportsblog.com/posts/14394009/the-nfl-draft-report-s--by-the-numbers--series---before-an-nfl-general-manager-drafts-a-cornerback-in-the-first-round--they-might-want-to-check-out-these-numbers.html

[Nas]

 

I love how his one pick of the season was a ball that was literally thrown right to his gut.

 

This is really encouraging.

 

Don't you think our scouts have looked at a whole lot more than one highlight reel?

[Gman329]

I wanted Tunsil but can't argue the need or wisdom of taking a DB...and the kid WILL play a lot this year, as the nickel corner, who has to cover the slot receiver....and as Pdub says, that's 60-65% of defensive snaps (and Blue, Collins can't play that spot. He's more of a SS than a cover corner). He's got size, plays physically, runs a 4.4 and he's only 20 years old. Leave a little room for the possibility that the Giant coaches can take it from there and he actually might be good before we condemn this pick out of hand.

 

We'll never know, of course but I think they were set to take Floyd before the Bears leapfrogged them and then they couldn't find a trade down deal that they liked, so took the highest ranked played left on the Board. Yes, they had Apple above Hargreaves.

[Nas]

I wanted Tunsil but can't argue the need or wisdom of taking a DB...and the kid WILL play a lot this year, as the nickel corner, who has to cover the slot receiver....and as Pdub says, that's 60-65% of defensive snaps (and Blue, Collins can't play that spot. He's more of a SS than a cover corner). He's got size, plays physically, runs a 4.4 and he's only 20 years old. Leave a little room for the possibility that the Giant coaches can take it from there and he actually might be good before we condemn this pick out of hand.

 

We'll never know, of course but I think they were set to take Floyd before the Bears leapfrogged them and then they couldn't find a trade down deal that they liked, so took the highest ranked played left on the Board. Yes, they had Apple above Hargreaves.

 

I think that's exactly how it went down... The bears leaping over us pretty much took out the possibility of drafting Floyd (although I personally wasn't too high on him from a prototype LB standpoint... I don't want a hybrid... not big enough to play DE too tall to be an effective LB)... and Lee didn't really do it for me due to his size. Most of us thought it would be Hargreaves but Apple seems like a better fit...

[CrazedDogs]

ya'll read what pdub just posted, right? Apple has top measurables, top production too, and he can't even buy his own drinks at the bar yet. Not looking like a bad pick at all.

[Mr. P]

Art Stapleton ‏@art_stapleton 2m2 minutes ago

Just listened on @SiriusXMNFL to Rutgers HC Chris Ash, who was DC at Ohio State for Eli Apple. Believes Apple is "game ready" for #Giants.

[Bigblue25]

Third corner is basically a starter.

Apple is not a great fit in the slot

[CrazedDogs]

Apple is not a great fit in the slot

 

Doesn't matter.... Jenkins is.

[Bigblue25]

 

Doesn't matter.... Jenkins is.

That's true and Jenkins is only 27. Now we have someone nine years younger than DRC

[CrazedDogs]

I didn't see this pick coming, but the more I think about it, the more I like it.

[gmenroc]

ya'll read what pdub just posted, right? Apple has top measurables, top production too, and he can't even buy his own drinks at the bar yet. Not looking like a bad pick at all.

That write-up does make me feel significantly better about the pick. In my mock, I had Apple going at 11 to the Bears, so it's not as much of a stretch as I originally thought based on projections that had him going in the late first round.

 

I do think we needed to add a CB at some point in this draft. So I can't hate the pick. I originally agreed with the C or C- it was getting, but the above has me thinking it's more of a B- or B. I still have a hard time thinking that Lawson, Lee, Tunsil weren't better choices.

 

If we're able to grab Spriggs or Whitehair in the 2nd and Nassib in the 3rd...or Ogbah/Spence in the 2nd with LeRaven Clark or Christian Westerman in the 3rd...I'll be stoked.

[Treehugger]

Y'all missing the biggest plus here: No more Hosley!

[gmenroc]

Y'all missing the biggest plus here: No more Hosley!

Had we drafted Tunsil, I'd have started him at CB before Hosley...so there's that.

[Bigblue25]

I didn't see this pick coming, but the more I think about it, the more I like it.

I personally would of wanted Doctson

[Treehugger]

Had we drafted Tunsil, I'd have started him at CB before Hosley...so there's that.

 

Yeah I'm feeling a lot better about the pick this morning. I didn't realise he ran a 4.34 at his pro day, and you can't argue with his coverage skills. If Jenkins is the answer for slot coverage then Reese has addressed the biggest issue from the last few years and maybe we'll see an end to the embarassing fourth quarter collapses.

[gmenroc]

Yeah I'm feeling a lot better about the pick this morning. I didn't realise he ran a 4.34 at his pro day, and you can't argue with his coverage skills. If Jenkins is the answer for slot coverage then Reese has addressed the biggest issue from the last few years and maybe we'll see an end to the embarassing fourth quarter collapses.

 

I think there's more work that needs done before I can rest easy on those 4th quarter collapses. There are still significant needs at edge rusher, RT, and WR (though I'm somewhat comforted with the recent Cruz news).

 

For Apple, I heard someone last night refer to him as a penalty machine if he doesn't clean up the use of his hands in coverage. THAT needs to be fixed here and now if it's that much of an issue.

 

I guess I just wanted to see the next LB or DE in Lee or Lawson more than a 3rd CB in Apple.

[Herc]

Yeah he can't play inside but like others have said Jenkins can and that's probably a good thing bc Jenkins is a gambler and you have more help behind you in the middle of the field than you do on the outside

[Bigblue25]

They do have big receivers in the division with Dez, JMatt and Skins just took Doctson.

[Bigblue25]

Yeah he can't play inside but like others have said Jenkins can and that's probably a good thing bc Jenkins is a gambler and you have more help behind you in the middle of the field than you do on the outside

 

JJ was signed to be their #1 corner though

[Treehugger]

 

I think there's more work that needs done before I can rest easy on those 4th quarter collapses. There are still significant needs at edge rusher, RT, and WR (though I'm somewhat comforted with the recent Cruz news).

 

For Apple, I heard someone last night refer to him as a penalty machine if he doesn't clean up the use of his hands in coverage. THAT needs to be fixed here and now if it's that much of an issue.

 

I guess I just wanted to see the next LB or DE in Lee or Lawson more than a 3rd CB in Apple.

 

I would have been happier with Lee too but I'm comfortable with Apple over Hargreaves now. I think a DE in the 1st would have been luxury over need though.

[Treehugger]

JJ was signed to be their #1 corner though

 

Lots of #1 WRs play significant snaps out of the slot these days. A corner who can shadow a #1 across the field is highly valuable. In this scenario they'd have Apple playing outside when Jenkins moves in but it would still be DRC and Jenkins for 2 WR sets.