Herc Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Wait til they find out most of the people who think he's a pro-bowler being colluded against don't read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Hes not a pro bowler, but he is better than Jay Cutler. Hes better than Kizer. Hell, hes better than a lot of guys that got the call before him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Hes not a pro bowler, but he is better than Jay Cutler. Hes better than Kizer. Hell, hes better than a lot of guys that got the call before him. That's not really the point. Personally, I think he sucks and he's not worth all the baggage- like Tebow- (he's better than Tebow) But the question is were there discussions between owners or GM's to keep him out of the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Cutler sucks but the move was defendable considering the season was starting in a month and cutler not only knew the playbook but had his best season two years earlier with gase as OC. Kizer was a red chip prospect. You don't sign kaepernick to a rebuilding team over taking a shot on a guy like that. Terrell Owens had 900 yards his last season and nobody wanted to sign him despite him being better than a far bigger percentage of wrs than the percentage of scrubby backup qbs kaepernick is better than. These owners don't have to sign anyone they don't want the sign. It's their team and their money. Collusion is a whole other issue and if he proves it then I hope he takes all those fuckers down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Hes not a pro bowler, but he is better than Jay Cutler. Hes better than Kizer. Hell, hes better than a lot of guys that got the call before him. And I completely disagree that he's better than Jay Cutler. Cutler can run NFL offenses. Kaepernick was never more than a one read passer, option QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blindgreed1 Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 And I completely disagree that he's better than Jay Cutler. Cutler can run NFL offenses. Kaepernick was never more than a one read passer, option QB. Kaep was great up until the playoffs in 2013 when he went up against Wilson and everyone was comparing the two. After that loss, he just didn't seem to have the will to win anymore. It's almost as if he found out he wasn't "all that" and accepted it. Prior to the loss in 2013, he could extend the play with his legs if his receivers were covered. After the 2013 loss, he took the sack. It was like night and day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Jay had been in the league since 2006 and has been to the playoffs once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Kaep was great up until the playoffs in 2013 when he went up against Wilson and everyone was comparing the two. After that loss, he just didn't seem to have the will to win anymore. It's almost as if he found out he wasn't "all that" and accepted it. Prior to the loss in 2013, he could extend the play with his legs if his receivers were covered. After the 2013 loss, he took the sack. It was like night and day. He pretty much got worse each season after that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Kaep was great up until the playoffs in 2013 when he went up against Wilson and everyone was comparing the two. After that loss, he just didn't seem to have the will to win anymore. It's almost as if he found out he wasn't "all that" and accepted it. Prior to the loss in 2013, he could extend the play with his legs if his receivers were covered. After the 2013 loss, he took the sack. It was like night and day. 49ers were stacked those years, pretty much everywhere but QB. Even when his numbers were good, he wasn't passing my eye test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Griffin was good for a year too. Qbs need to learn how to be pro style qbs in college, not get to the NFL with their legs and then learn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 49ers were stacked those years, pretty much everywhere but QB. Even when his numbers were good, he wasn't passing my eye test.Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Hes got a career passer rating thats higher than Eli. Same completion percentage. He was throwing to whom? Old Boldin and Mario Manningham? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Yeah cuz he threw the ball like 25 times per game. His best season was when he threw the ball 17 times per game. It's the same situation was griffins rookie year, run dominant team that ran read options and limited the qb to very few throws and no tough throws. Boldin/Crabtree/Davis aren't Cruz/nicks but they weren't awful either. Nobody who watched him play last few years were saying he's a good qb. He was headed to backupville if he never kneeled and maybe worse after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Even when the 9ers lost all those games, he posted a 90.7 passer rating. He wasnt the reason that team was losing and to me, its revisionist to say otherwise. At the very least, he was a capable backup worthy of being signed somewhere as such. He wasnt, and it wasnt because of poor play or bad numbers. And it might not have been collusion but to me, its still a serious problem. Theres players like Fitzpatrick who have stuck on teams for years to provide the exact kind of services Kaepernick could provide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigblue25 Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Hes got a career passer rating thats higher than Eli. Same completion percentage. He was throwing to whom? Old Boldin and Mario Manningham? When he was successful he was thrown to Vernon Davis, Michael Crabtree and Ted Ginn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 It's not revisionist. The general consensus before he didn't stand for the flag was that he was a below average quarterback. What's revisionist is this movement to look at some peripheral stats on a relatively lesser amount of attempts than his peers and say he's better than we thought he was simply for political reasons. The niners were going to cut him if he didn't opt out. Good qbs don't get cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 I disagree. He is a top 32 qb, still. Low turnover rate, approaching a .500 record as a starter for a currently pretty shitty franchise seemingly constantly in coaching flux, averaging more ypa than many current starters (Manning being one of themhes nearly a half yard more than Manning), I could go on, but apparently these are peripheral stats. He would be a significant improvement for teams like the 9ers, Colts, Dolphins (currently, Cutler is debateable), Jets...the Packers, Cards, and Vikings he would have been a serviceable backup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Yes the most commonly referred to stat for people trying to retcon kaepernick' performance the past few years is passer rating. Griffin was third in passer rating his rookie year because he barely threw the ball and when he did they were safe high percentage throws. It went straight down as soon as the redskins tried to open up their offense and he had to start actually trying to win games with his arm. It's a stat that doesn't tell the whole story--kinda like completion percentage (see Eli). Kind of like ERA in baseball or points per game in basketball. When you say a guy is top 32 in a league with around 70 active qbs every week we are getting into hair splitting territory as far as sports crimes go. only a few teams have a good qb and half the teams have crap. If I own a team and my crappy qb or crappy backup qb is the 40th best qb and I could have the 30th best qb but I don't like him or I think he's bad for business or I don't like guys whose last names start with K then it's my business if I don't want to write him checks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Winning games is good for business, I hear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 It is. 11-24 without harbough and being surrounded by pro-bowlers isn't though. That's why his team didn't want him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Lol what's funny about that? I was right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 It's not revisionist. The general consensus before he didn't stand for the flag was that he was a below average quarterback. What's revisionist is this movement to look at some peripheral stats on a relatively lesser amount of attempts than his peers and say he's better than we thought he was simply for political reasons. The niners were going to cut him if he didn't opt out. Good qbs don't get cut. Herc gets it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringe Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 what's funny about that? I was right. How would I know you're right? I don't know what you eye test consists of. Just struck me as funny. Look, when he was good, he was very good. He had a series of shoulder injuries and the team fell apart. He also had a bad attitude with teammates. All that doesn't matter if the NFL conspired to keep him out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 How would I know you're right? I have no clue why you would think I was wrong. Every single team in declining to employ him has echoed my assessment. Even if you assume the truth of the collusion story, his OWN team, before he was kneeling, had already begun to give up and move on. I don't know what you eye test consists of. I've shared my thoughts on Kaep on this board back when most people still thought he was good. I'll repeat again for you, he had terrible touch as a passer, just awful; I think Kaepernick threw the flattest ball I've ever seen from an NFL QB, certainly in recent memory. He also never learned to read a defense. That offense they ran back when he was 'productive' was a one read offense. My local high school plays a more complex offense than the Kaepernick era 49ers. And it only worked, and marginally so, at the NFL level because they had a top notch running game, probably the top defense of that era, respectable receivers across the field (WRs, TEs), and so they could get away with an offense built on play action and fifteen passes a game, like the Steelers back when Big Ben was just coming up. Look, when he was good, he was very good. He had a series of shoulder injuries and the team fell apart. He also had a bad attitude with teammates. All that doesn't matter if the NFL conspired to keep him out. oh, for fuck sake, he was NEVER good, not even on his best day. I don't care what the per play statistics say, I never watched him play and came away thinking, that guy is a quality NFL QB. And please.... a QB that had a bad attitude with his teammates?... lets add this up.... mediocre at best player at a leadership position, and he has a bad attitude too?... and some of us still wonder why he's unemployed? This is getting fucking stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 I'm just saying where was the outrage when a hall of fame caliber wr coming off a 900 yard season was shut out of the NFL? Everyone was cool with owners doing what they wanted with their own money back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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