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Daniel Jones named Starting QB


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#51 CrazedDogs

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 09:17 PM

No he means RPO (Run Pass Option) you see the Seahawks use it all the time.
 
It's basically the QB either hands the ball off, or hits a quick out pattern which is set up in some sort of screen, typically to a TE or Slot WR.
 
Typically the QB doesn't scramble in the slightest but it takes a QB with some athleticism to pull it off since typically they need to roll out to hit anything long.


Here's my understanding of the terms...

I think you described the RPO well, but as far as I've seen pretty much every team runs it. Seahawks, yes, but that includes the Giants too, in particular it's a big part of their shotgun package. Plus mobility isn't necessarily required for the RPO, it's just a concept.

The read option is where the QB has a run built in, by definition. Seahawks also run that all the time. Like the RPO, its just a concept. What makes the Seahawks somewhat unique is they run plays that are both RPO AND read option - QB has the choice between a throw or one or more running options.

#52 Herc

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 09:17 PM

Its much easier to sit through this shitfest defense when I know I get to watch jones develop next series. I was finding myself tuning out for entire drives for the first time since Ive been a fan. Just give me something to have some hope for and Ill suffer through the blown coverages and bad losses

#53 BlueInCanada

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 09:26 PM

Here's my understanding of the terms...

I think you described the RPO well, but as far as I've seen pretty much every team runs it. Seahawks, yes, but that includes the Giants too, in particular it's a big part of their shotgun package. Plus mobility isn't necessarily required for the RPO, it's just a concept.

The read option is where the QB has a run built in, by definition. Seahawks also run that all the time. Like the RPO, its just a concept. What makes the Seahawks somewhat unique is they run plays that are both RPO AND read option - QB has the choice between a throw or one or more running options.

 

What your describing is the RPO lol

 

 

What is the RPO?

For clarity’s sake, here’s a quick breakdown of the three most confused acts of tricky used by NFL offenses:

  • Read-Option: Popularized by RGIII, the read-option is running play in which the QB decides whether to hand the ball off to his running back or keep the ball himself on a run.
  • The Play Action Pass: A passing play that fakes a handoff before the passer sets up to throw. There is no actual run option involved since it’s a pass play all the way.
  • The Run-Pass Option: The QB has the option to hand the ball off, throw the ball, or even keep it himself.

https://sportdfw.com...option-rpo-nfl/

 

It's why a QB like Eli cant run the RPO, because then it's just a play action pass, there's no threat of him rolling out or scrambling.



#54 Drizzle

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 09:35 PM

Immediately, wow!.... That would be great, but that is a high bar for a rookie QB.

Certainly he makes the offense more multiple, but mobile athleticism is such a small lever compared to arm talent and the mental side of the game.

That is what worries me about Shurmur... I'm concerned he may overvalue certain traits that are not to this point associated with successful NFL QBs (again, except Russell Wilson, who incorporates mobility into his game better than anyone since Steve Young, imo).

A further concern with, potentially, Shurmur.... If he was really sandbagging the offense just to get DJ in the game, as many fans have speculated, holy shit.... That is a red flag to end all red flags.


Im just not sure how anyone could watch the Giants the last three years and see anything cerebral or mental about Mannings game anymore.

#55 Drizzle

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 09:37 PM

 
What your describing is the RPO lol
 
https://sportdfw.com...option-rpo-nfl/
 
It's why a QB like Eli cant run the RPO, because then it's just a play action pass, there's no threat of him rolling out or scrambling.


Yeah, thats my position on Jones. I think he fits the RPO concept well. It just adds a dimension that isnt there that nearly every team runs except the Giants.

#56 Tempest

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 10:11 PM

It is what it is

 

I think this ends Eli Manning's career in the NFL and officially puts Shurmur in the hot seat.  Daniel Jones now has to play as good or better Eli Manning.  If Daniel Jones fails at this the blame falls on Shurmur for throwing Jones in there. 

 

Now we just have to find a defensive player on the bench opponents have to game plan against...

 

I do no think Daniel Jones is going to be significantly better until Shepard/Tate get on the field together.  Jones is going to have to throw to third/fourth string WRs who would be free agents on another roster.



#57 BlueInCanada

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 11:11 PM

It is what it is

 

I think this ends Eli Manning's career in the NFL and officially puts Shurmur in the hot seat.  Daniel Jones now has to play as good or better Eli Manning.  If Daniel Jones fails at this the blame falls on Shurmur for throwing Jones in there. 

 

Now we just have to find a defensive player on the bench opponents have to game plan against...

 

I do no think Daniel Jones is going to be significantly better until Shepard/Tate get on the field together.  Jones is going to have to throw to third/fourth string WRs who would be free agents on another roster.

 

I don't think that's the case.

 

Mara wouldn't of let Shurmur bench Eli if he wasnt already convinced this season is a wash, if anything I could see it spelling the end of Getty and his "WERE GONNA WIN WHILE I THROW EVERYONE OUT!" bullshit he was saying the last two years.



#58 JayD

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 12:00 AM

I dont think anyone is in any danger of being tossed. With all the young talent, and now a 22 year old QB, I think this move just bought everyone two years before heads start rolling.

Hopefully things will get turned around by then.

I have high hopes for Jones. Like its been said, there will be growing pains. Im crossing fingers though that this kid comes out swinging. I think thats totally possible.

#59 CrazedDogs

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 12:20 AM

 
What your describing is the RPO lol
 
https://sportdfw.com...option-rpo-nfl/
 
It's why a QB like Eli cant run the RPO, because then it's just a play action pass, there's no threat of him rolling out or scrambling.


Except that link is wrong.

Case in point, RG III sure as shit didn't popularize the read option. It's an extreme old concept, at the center of schemes such as the wing T.

#60 Drizzle

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 01:07 AM

Except that link is wrong.

Case in point, RG III sure as shit didn't popularize the read option. It's an extreme old concept, at the center of schemes such as the wing T.


Im thinking Newton and McCafery with more hand offs and less designed QB runs and more QB moving and throwing.

#61 Lughead

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 01:23 AM

This is a retarded move .  



#62 Tempest

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 01:35 AM

 

I don't think that's the case.

 

Mara wouldn't of let Shurmur bench Eli if he wasnt already convinced this season is a wash, if anything I could see it spelling the end of Getty and his "WERE GONNA WIN WHILE I THROW EVERYONE OUT!" bullshit he was saying the last two years.

 

John Mara is not sitting in his office deciding who is starting on Sunday.  Giants lost two games, there is a lot more season to go.

 

Head coaches get replaced more often than general managers, Giants have had more head coaches than general managers.



#63 echochamber

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 11:04 AM

With the way Eli has gone out, my hatred for that scum fuck Jerry Reese has never been higher. I hope he gets hit by a bus and dragged a few blocks.

#64 Drizzle

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 12:08 PM

Phil Simms: "Daniel Jones is Shurmur's draft pick, he will help run the offense that Shurmur wants."



This is exactly what Im saying. Shurmur is finally going to get to run his own offense, no handcuffs. Im looking forward to it.

#65 BlueInCanada

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 12:27 PM

 
John Mara is not sitting in his office deciding who is starting on Sunday.  Giants lost two games, there is a lot more season to go.
 
Head coaches get replaced more often than general managers, Giants have had more head coaches than general managers.


So telling MacAttack to bench Eli two seasons ago was him doing what?

Getty so far has done nothing but void this team of any talent while telling Mara and Co "We'll still win and Eli will lead the way!" as he turns around and guts any scraps on the team from the JR era.

This roster is Gettys fault and Shurur has been given the task to try and coax wins out of a team that looks as bad as the Miami Dolphins who are trying to tank this year.

#66 BlueInCanada

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 12:32 PM

Phil Simms: "Daniel Jones is Shurmur's draft pick, he will help run the offense that Shurmur wants."



This is exactly what Im saying. Shurmur is finally going to get to run his own offense, no handcuffs. Im looking forward to it.


I hope to see more RPO and the fact Jones can pull the ball down and run.

Outside of that Shurmurs offence with the Vikings was pretty much what we have been seeing a run game supported by short to medium passes.

Unless he plans on throwing a bunch of new stuff out on the field with Jones which very well might be the case.

#67 Nas

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 12:46 PM

My heart says "fuck this team, you bunch of imgrates", but really, how much longer can the suckage go on for? Unfortunately, Jones could sling his way to 8 TD's a game but the D will give away 12 so this isn't going to bring us more wins. Let's just hope he stays upright and uninjured and has us all recalling this moment 15 years from now fondly. 

 

Yes the D is a glaring problem... but I recall (maybe the 2006 the year we won the SB in 2007), our D sucked ass and we went 0-2 then they got it together... This is not to say this will happen but I expect this young D to improve as games are played this year... let's hope for a W against Tampa. 



#68 echochamber

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 01:35 PM

So telling MacAttack to bench Eli two seasons ago was him doing what?

Getty so far has done nothing but void this team of any talent while telling Mara and Co "We'll still win and Eli will lead the way!" as he turns around and guts any scraps on the team from the JR era.

This roster is Gettys fault and Shurur has been given the task to try and coax wins out of a team that looks as bad as the Miami Dolphins who are trying to tank this year.


Nope

#69 BlueInCanada

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 02:14 PM

Nope


Yarp

#70 CrazedDogs

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 02:35 PM

Im thinking Newton and McCafery with more hand offs and less designed QB runs and more QB moving and throwing.

 

and that will be nice, but it just isn't all that important.... 

 

Number of teams that have won with that concept as the centerpiece of their offense: exactly one. And Russell Wilson is a unicorn. 

 

 

Phil Simms: "Daniel Jones is Shurmur's draft pick, he will help run the offense that Shurmur wants."



This is exactly what Im saying. Shurmur is finally going to get to run his own offense, no handcuffs. Im looking forward to it.

 

and that's what worries me about Shurmur. A good coach runs the scheme that works best for the players he actually has. Its a hell of a lot easier to adjust the playbook than it is to find different players. 

 

I hope that Shurmur is not worshipping at a shrine to his own genius. 



#71 Drizzle

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 02:36 PM

 
and that will be nice, but it just isn't all that important.... 
 
Number of teams that have won with that concept as the centerpiece of their offense: exactly one. And Russell Wilson is a unicorn. 
 
 
 
and that's what worries me about Shurmur. A good coach runs the scheme that works best for the players he actually has. Its a hell of a lot easier to adjust the playbook than it is to find different players. 
 
I hope that Shurmur is not worshipping at a shrine to his own genius. 


I think he couldnt do what he wanted to do with Manning so the offense ran through what Manning could handle...

#72 BlueInCanada

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 03:23 PM

 
and that will be nice, but it just isn't all that important.... 
 
Number of teams that have won with that concept as the centerpiece of their offense: exactly one. And Russell Wilson is a unicorn. 
 
 
 
and that's what worries me about Shurmur. A good coach runs the scheme that works best for the players he actually has. Its a hell of a lot easier to adjust the playbook than it is to find different players. 
 
I hope that Shurmur is not worshipping at a shrine to his own genius. 


That's not really true though.

Bellichek runs his scheme regardless of players and their talent if they don't fit they got shipped.

Look at Bettcher he has basically brought in players who used to play for him because they fit his scheme not the other way around.

#73 CrazedDogs

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 04:55 PM

That's not really true though.

Bellichek runs his scheme regardless of players and their talent if they don't fit they got shipped.

Look at Bettcher he has basically brought in players who used to play for him because they fit his scheme not the other way around.

 

LOL, nobody changes scheme more often than Belichick. What the fuck, a Giants fan should know all about that, he's legendary for changing shit on the fly. 



#74 BlueInCanada

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 07:26 PM

 
LOL, nobody changes scheme more often than Belichick. What the fuck, a Giants fan should know all about that, he's legendary for changing shit on the fly. 


But he changes players just as fast this whole "a good coach fits his scheme to his players" is insane lol

Billy has no problem with the revolving door of players at any position because he doesn't care who's there as long as they fit what he's trying to do.

Is it that hard to understand?

How many WRs have come and gone under his team or defensive players he's let go just to fit the next guy into the starting rotation.

Lol yeah he really cares about his scheme fitting who's there.

#75 BlueInCanada

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 07:29 PM

Not to menition my point still remains just look at the Giants Bettcher doesn't care who's here in fact we've brought guys in from Arizona who knows his scheme.

No coach is going to change what they think works because of one player lol

Billy is a prime example doesn't matter who's on the bench or starting he's going to find players that work in his system and kick the ones out that don't.




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